I think Allison Pill has an elfin quaility that Evan Evagora lacks.Heh ... I think perhaps you may have gotten your IP's crossed on that one.
EITRI AT THE STAR FORGE
Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 1x04 - "Absolute Candor"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
She may well be closer to a ronin (a masterless samurai/warrior).
The Fenris Rangers may well be a loosely-bound organization (Seven showed up even though the Rangers weren't officially patrolling the area).
Seven has never been one for playing well with others.
Or form a Fellowship of the Fleet...One Fleet to save them all.
It's about as subtle an homage as Z'Ha'Dum in Babylon 5 to K'Zha'Dum in Lord of the Rings.
An was ironically was part of a collective.
I would prefer more.
Using digitally altered images to advance a falsehood is not classy.Or form a Fellowship of the Fleet...One Fleet to save them all.
If it is a matter of a corrupt, flawed institution, I could see staying and doing as you suggest. But if it is a specific decision, I am not sure what more he could have done as an Admiral. He could have done what Eisenhower did and run for President. I am not sure how Presidents are elected in the Federation, but I agree with those who say that he could have done more about this as a civilian. Time is of the essence. A window is closing and we either act now, or it will be too late to get more off the planet. I just dont agree that he has anything to personally atone for, not that he has no reason to feel bad about it, or might want to make it right.
My problem with the show that it isn't remotely about "setting things right." Picard's mission has no literal, personal or thematic connection to why he left Starfleet and his reasons for doing so. It's an entirely separate series of circumstances.
Yes, it helps the disillusioned Picard find something to care about again, which is good, but in no way is he trying to atone for Starfleet's failings or even for his own. He's not personally trying to fix the Romulan situation and he's not even apologizing to the people he left behind and/or screwed over. In fact, he's hitting them up for favors!
And that's why this show isn't really clicking on a dramatic level....
An was ironically was part of a collective.
Which may be one reason why she doesn't play well with others ...
She was surrounded by people 24/7 for 24 years. Talk about no privacy!
He HIMSELF might not entirely know why he's doing what he's doing.
He feels compelled to do SOMETHING to atone for the mistakes he's made in the past.
The way the show is being written, the writers don't even seem aware that that's a question.
The show seems to be saying, "Picard quit and walked away. Period." As if no further explanation is required.
Well it seems too late to do anything now about the Romulan decision. It went nova, that's it. That window closed years ago. I am accepting that he feels bad about a number of things, but there is just no basis for a redemption story even though the writers of the show want to make it seem like it is. They could have made him responsible for some of these things if that is what they wanted.
The personal quest to find Maddox and the other twin I think is ultimately about dealing with the synth ban. But yes, it seems like a personal quest animated by much narrower interests and concerns. Would he have checked in on Raffi or Elnor if not for a synth twin with a connection to Data dropping into his life? Probably not.
So what are these other defintions? Come on, enlighten us.
And he's always sure to tell everyone that in any conversation.
This TVTropes page has a good discussion of it. As I have said, I will coin a new term if people are that bent out of shape by it. But it will mean the same thing, no matter what I call it.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MarySue
I think it's less about him having abandoned the individual people, and more about how that desperate act of offering his resignation from Starfleet, having backfired on him, affected so many lives, and he no longer had the power that might have made a difference for these people.
I think there's a bit of contradiction here. As indicated in the first quote, in bringing Raffi and Elnor into his main quest, he's finding himself engaged in a side quest to rebuild some of the bridges that his resignation unintentionally burned.
While the episode didn't clearly indicate it, I was under the impression that it was perhaps a desperate move to get Elnor's attention.
Laying on the anti-Millennial theme a bit thick...I may have to add a rule to the drinking game.
I think that's a fair point. From what we know of Picard, for decades he's been a Star Fleet Captain and Federation Ideologue first, and human being second. Neither being assimilated by the Borg, spending a virtual lifetime as a family man in Inner Life, or revisiting his Kirk wannabee youth in Tapestry really cracked that veneer very much. He was still the one person with so much stiff upper lip that Sarek came for it in his time of need even ahead of any fellow Vulcan. All he knows how to solve problems is being the Star Fleet Captain he molded himself into so yeah, I think he's feeling his way along here. And I think deliberately going to Raffi and to Vashti, a person and a planet full of people he failed in the past instead of his old Enterprise crew is part of that journey of figuring out how to atone for his mistakes because you can't do that by being The Great Man.
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From the article you provided:
Finally, the advent of the Internet allowed the term to migrate out of the Star Trek community to most fandoms, losing pretty much any real meaning in the process. There are dozens upon dozens of essays that offer interpretations of what the term means, generally basing it off of some usages of it, but none of them are truly comprehensive or accepted. Using the term in most contexts isn't too far off from Flame Bait, generally provoking the defendant into rants. Much Internet Backdraft has resulted, especially if the term is applied to a canon character on a popular show.
Mary Sue as Protagonist You Don't Like
An alarmingly widespread use of the term, and one reason a lot of people feel that the term has lost whatever useful meaning it once had. There are a lot of reasons why this usage is so common. Most obviously, as rants about and mockery of the Mary Sue phenomenon became increasingly well-known in fandom, it became increasingly easy to throw the term around as Flame Bait. The fact that so many of the other definitions are highly subjective doesn't help.
People who accuse characters of being Mary Sues rarely admit that this is the definition they're using. The best way to tell is if their justifications for the character's Sue-hood are all based on shoehorning, Alternate Character Interpretation, misrepresenting the sources, and Accentuate the Negative. Describe any non-fanfic character as a Canon Sue, and you'll be lucky if no one accuses you of using this definition of the term.
Mary Sue as Author Avatar
Simple as that. The original meaning, this one has lost prominence as a sole definition lately but still often gets invoked. People used to sometimes call their alter ego characters "their Mary Sue", but this usage has mostly died with the proliferation of the term as an automatic pejorative.
Flaws
The other influential Not A Mary Sue argument, this claims that having a Fatal Flaw (or two... four... four hundred) makes them not ideal and, thus, not a Mary Sue. As mentioned in Mary Sue as Idealized Character, this usually results in other extremes that aren't too desirable.
The article is pretty clear in stating that these additions to what a mary sue is and isn't are not accurate, subjective and not in the true meaning of what the term actually meant. Which is what everyone has been arguing in the first place.
Good to see Picard getting his little crew together.
Nice to see Romulans acting like normal people and not haughty, elite a-holes. But having your civilization reduced to near dystopian will bring you down to earth.
The Qo Milan sound like a cross between the Dora Milage and the Bene Gesseritt. The Romulans are apparently, as spiritual as the Vulcans. That surprises me. Thought the two groups were as opposite as it gets.
Raffi’s impersonation of Picard made me laugh out loud. It was spot on. When She tried to persuade JL to abandon the side trip to Vashti and in response he looks at her and says “I may not come this way again,” then shakes his head and says “I’ll be in my quarters,” you know, they’re going to Vashti. I thought that was yet another beautifully acted scene by Stewart.
Anxious to see two of the best actors in the franchise go toe to toe starting next week.
Nice to see Romulans acting like normal people and not haughty, elite a-holes. But having your civilization reduced to near dystopian will bring you down to earth.
The Qo Milan sound like a cross between the Dora Milage and the Bene Gesseritt. The Romulans are apparently, as spiritual as the Vulcans. That surprises me. Thought the two groups were as opposite as it gets.
Raffi’s impersonation of Picard made me laugh out loud. It was spot on. When She tried to persuade JL to abandon the side trip to Vashti and in response he looks at her and says “I may not come this way again,” then shakes his head and says “I’ll be in my quarters,” you know, they’re going to Vashti. I thought that was yet another beautifully acted scene by Stewart.
I think (and hope), they’ve decided to tone down the whole over the top tough guy thing. I don’t know if it was an acting issue or a writing issue, but count me among those for whom that characterization was not working
Anxious to see two of the best actors in the franchise go toe to toe starting next week.
No, not even close. There a dozens of usages. As the author says, "TV Tropes doesn't get to set what the term means; the best we can do is capture the way it is used." There is no consensus on a precise definition and dozens of usages now exist. The article author does not, and does not claim, to able to say they are "not accurate".
There is no such thing, in any human language as "true meaning". All meanings are always the subjective creation of the people who create them. Words mean what we say they mean. New words get invented, older terms take on new meanings. "Rock" in English refers to a form of music, or a stone. IN German, "Rock" means "Skirt".
But if all this is a point blank refusal to accept the reality of changing word usuage, I will be happy to coin a new term. It will mean the same thing however.
Don't feed the beast. Starve it.
