Star Trek Continues: Episode 2 "Lolani"...

[Mr_Homn]

Lou Ferrigno was really really great as Zaminhon. Lou and his character was worthy of being in the real show. It was a shame that he died at the end because I'd love to see the character return.

This is the first fan production I've ever been able to sit through, and it was really quite good. Big improvement over the first episode and I'm really excited to see what they have in store for us in the future.

 

[Warped9]

I have to say this up front. One thing I didn't care for in TNG was returning characters particularly in the form of Llwaxana Troi. That coupled with characters going back to Earth or Risa whenever they felt like it. It made the galaxy seem small and the ship didn't feel like it was on the frontier.

TOS only did it once with Harry Mudd and it looked like a total coincidence. And I wasn't crazy about the episode he returned either. Having fresh characters helped lend the feeling they weren't hanging around the neighbourhood. And characters weren't going off to Starbase or Earth for leave whenever they felt like it. It's those little things that added to that sense of being "out there."

To that end I hope STC sticks with that sensibility.

Sadly TAS did revisit a number of previous characters and I wish they hadn't. In quite a few cases they were the weaker episodes.

 

[Warped9]

On the FB page I get the sense critiquing the character of McKennah can make some (posters and not STC folks) a bit prickly. It's almost as if they're equating critique and observation as comdemnation. Definitely not the same thing. I like the McKennah character, but it's valid to critique how she's utilized as well as speculating what plans they might have for the character. And if those plans could be at the expense of the other familiar characters and thus changing the character dynamic too much.

 

[Noname Given]

I have to say this up front. One thing I didn't care for in TNG was returning characters particularly in the form of Llwaxana Troi. That coupled with characters going back to Earth or Risa whenever they felt like it. It made the galaxy seem small and the ship didn't feel like it was on the frontier.

TOS only did it once with Harry Mudd and it looked like a total coincidence. And I wasn't crazy about the episode he returned either. Having fresh characters helped lend the feeling they weren't hanging around the neighbourhood. And characters weren't going off to Starbase or Earth for leave whenever they felt like it. It's those little things that added to that sense of being "out there."

To that end I hope STC sticks with that sensibility.

Sadly TAS did revisit a number of previous characters and I wish they hadn't. In quite a few cases they were the weaker episodes.

Well, to be fair:

The return of Harry Mudd was intentional. In fact:

Source: http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/I,_Mudd_(episode)

According to Walter Koenig, NBC considered making a spin-off series detailing the comical adventures of Harry Mudd after the success of this episode. They assigned Gene Roddenberry to develop the idea, but being busy with Star Trek and other projects, he didn't have time for it, and the series was never conceived.

In "Day of the Dove" they did want to bring back John Colicos as 'Kor' but both times scheduling couldn't be reconciled:

Source: http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Kor

Kor was initially to have appeared in "Day of the Dove"; the writer of that episode, Jerome Bixby, very much wanted to cast John Colicos as the installment's main Klingon character. Colicos was again offered the role and could hardly have been more excited by the prospect of appearing in "Day of the Dove". However, he was unavailable, meanwhile involved in a film being produced in Italy.

But that said, to this day, I really enjoy Michael Ansara's portrayal of the Klingon captain, "Kang".

So, yeah, I don't think Harry Mudd's return was sheer coincidence, and I think had TOS lasted a few more seasons, we might have seen more returning/recurring characters. Honestly, I don't mind it as long as the script/story is good, and with regard t "I Mudd" , IMO - the whole exchange between Kirk/Mudd/Spock about how Mudd ended up on the Android planet is one of the funniest 'played straight' scenes in TOS:

Mudd: "Do you know what the penalty is for fraud on Deneb V?"

Spock: "The convicted party has his choice: death by hanging, death by electrocution, death by phaser..."

...

Mudd: "I borrowed transportation."

Kirk:" He stole a spacecraft..."

Mudd: "The patrol acted in a hostile manner..."

Kirk: "They fired on him..."

Mudd: "They have no respect for private property! They damaged the bloody spacecraft!..."

^^^
Something we wouldn't have gotten if we'd not seen the return of Roger C. Carmel as 'harry Mudd'; so gain, not at all dissappointed they decided to bring him back in Season 2 of TOS myself.

 

[Warped9]

^^ What I meant was the Enterprise crew were indeed surprised to encounter Mudd again in "I, Mudd."

I know they had thought of trying to bring certain characters back, but I'm rather glad it didn't pan out that way because the series was better for it. I agree and I'm so glad we got Michael Ansara as Kang. The only character I could have done without was Koloth. I think Kor would have rocked in "The Trouble With Tribbles" and we wouldn't have had a soft Klingon.

 

[Maurice]

I'm skeptical that NBC ever assigned Roddenberry to develop a Mudd show. I suspect that's more Roddenberry-generated myth making. If anything, I bet he pitched the idea but they didn't bite.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I'm skeptical that NBC ever assigned Roddenberry to develop a Mudd show. I suspect that's more Roddenberry-generated myth making. If anything, I bet he pitched the idea but they didn't bite.

Yeah. The idea that Roddenberry was too busy to develop a television show under assignment, and so just let it drop, doesn't pass the sniff test.

 

[Bixby]

I just can't picture Kor in the Trouble with Tribbles....

 

[Maurice]

I'm skeptical that NBC ever assigned Roddenberry to develop a Mudd show. I suspect that's more Roddenberry-generated myth making. If anything, I bet he pitched the idea but they didn't bite.

Yeah. The idea that Roddenberry was too busy to develop a television show under assignment, and so just let it drop, doesn't pass the sniff test.

That NBC would even ASK doesn't pass the sniff test to me.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I'm skeptical that NBC ever assigned Roddenberry to develop a Mudd show. I suspect that's more Roddenberry-generated myth making. If anything, I bet he pitched the idea but they didn't bite.

Yeah. The idea that Roddenberry was too busy to develop a television show under assignment, and so just let it drop, doesn't pass the sniff test.

That NBC would even ASK doesn't pass the sniff test to me.

Did NBC ask for any spin-off to Star Trek, or was Assignment: Earth and spinning-off a show all Roddenberry's idea? The usual sources don't say.

 

[JJohnson]

I watched it and enjoyed most of the episode, though I was still waiting for Kirk to pull something off, like 'allowing' Lolani to steal a shuttle or something, so she didn't have to die, which I thought was a bit of a downer for an ending.

I would like to see one or more Orion females on the ship as regular, accepted, Starfleet officers, perhaps as a helm/nav officer, science officer, or engineer, just to show that they are more than just 'slave girls.' The new Star Trek (09, and Into Darkness), as much as I dislike them, do at least show a more diverse crew with aliens who are just as much part of the crew as the humans. Perhaps Kirk can rescue an Orion in a flashback, and flash-forward to present day, and that Orion is now an ensign or lieutenant on the Enterprise?

 

[JJohnson]

As an aside, in Star Trek Continues, it would be incredibly awesome to see Captain Robert April and/or Captain Christopher Pike in a flashback or even just visiting the Enterprise 'today.' Maybe even a flashback to Kirk taking command of the Enterprise, with Spock and Gary Mitchell at his side, while "Admiral" Robert April and Captain Pike shake his hand, if it could be tied into the episode somehow.

 

[Bixby]

As an aside, in Star Trek Continues, it would be incredibly awesome to see Captain Robert April and/or Captain Christopher Pike in a flashback or even just visiting the Enterprise 'today.' Maybe even a flashback to Kirk taking command of the Enterprise, with Spock and Gary Mitchell at his side, while "Admiral" Robert April and Captain Pike shake his hand, if it could be tied into the episode somehow.

ONLY if his appearance is needed because of the story, not just as fan wank...You`re in trouble when you write something and you`re adding things because you said to yourself : `wouldn`t it be cool if...?`

 

[JJohnson]

I think it's all a matter of execution. Uhura isn't just some random guest character of the week. She's a regular that the audience identifies with. She could easily have stepped into the role McKennah serves in "Lolani" and you wouldn't have to insert anything overt into the discussion. She could merely relate to Lolani on a personal "friendly and sympathetic" face sort of way. The poignant juxtaposition would be in the nonverbal symbolism: Uhura as the symbol for what Lolani and others like her long for.

One quibble I have with Kim Singer as Uhura is she doesn't have Nichelle Nichols' exotic aura for lack a a better term. Uhura was African, not African American, and she spoke English with a touch of accent that added to her aura and distinctiveness. STC's Uhura comes across as American. Now if she thought of it or the STC thought of it, depending on her skill as an actress, maybe Singer could try to evoke a touch of Nichelle Nichols' manner of speech.

Note that JJtrek's Zoe Seldana doesn't have Nichell Nichols' presence either. Nichols gave Uhura grace and poise and something of a feline demeanor. I've no doubt that's actually part of Nichelle Nichols' personality and it's not an easy thing to capture. But it's unmistakably the TOS Uhura.

Of course I'm also thinking that Uhura always deserved a little more screen time, and it would have been a strong message back in the day just to see her up front a bit more. Now a production like STC has that opportunity to do something that should have been done back in the day, but wasn't. In "Lolani's" case I believe Kim Singer was available for only one day of shooting so that might pretty well snuff out more of her involvement in this episode. But I would like to see Uhura given some screen time beyond manning the communications board or singing in the rec-room.

I personally prefer Nichelle Nichols as an actress to the current Uhura actress. The current one doesn't have the grace, charm, or character that Nichelle put into her Uhura. I would have loved to see the original Uhura get more screen time, and what she did get in the movies I enjoyed. I do hope that STC can continue using the character in new ways that are in tune with the original series' version of her, as well as Chekov and Sulu and Scotty, and McCoy. Maybe the unproduced 'Johanna' featuring McCoy's daughter could be a future episode?

 

[Warped9]

I just can't picture Kor in the Trouble with Tribbles....

Given Kor's obvious intelligence and sense of humour seen in "Errand Of Mercy" I can easily see easily see Kor in "The Trouble With Tribbles" and John Colicos easily pulling it off.

Indeed they wanted Kor to return for "The Trouble With Tribbles," but Colicos was unavailable. Pity. I liked William Campbell as Trelane, but I just rolled my eyes seeing him as Koloth.

 

[JJohnson]

One of the problems we face as Fan Productions working on a shoestring budget with cardboard sets and volunteer actors, (and volunteer just about everything else, for that matter), is that it's a challenge to get people to take our show seriously as it is. (We often get the "Community Theater" comparisons--which is understandable.)

I think it would be an uphill battle to successfully pull off a comedic episode, although I think we're not actually averse to trying. (I recall both STC's and Exeter's "Night Shift" shorts.) Personally, I'd like to push the envelope a bit of what constitutes a "Star Trek" episode--maybe a comedy, maybe a musical, maybe an episode entirely in an alien language like Klingon or Vulcan but subtitled for those few fans who don't speak any of those alien languages.

Mostly, venturing too far out of the Trek formula might be more trouble than it's worth. Fortunately, we have a Senior Executive Producer and a Show Runner who get to make those kinds of decisions. (Also David Gerrold has been working on a "Tribbles" follow-up episode for us, but the scuttlebutt is that he's going counter-intuitive with it, and it's more scary than it is funny. So that might not actually scratch the "unconventional Trek episode" itch we might be having.)

It would certainly be interesting to see if STC or any other production would attempt something like "Shore Leave," "The Trouble With Tribbles," "I, Mudd" or "A Piece Of The Action."

Mind you nothing as absurd as "I, Mudd" or "A Piece Of The Action," but something with a distinct humourous bent.


In "Lolani" I think Scotty had two of the best lines and each delivered perfectly.

"He seems nice...for a slave trader."

"Lolani says you're a brutal monster."

Two things:

1. I would love to see several minutes of sustained Vulcan or Klingon dialog in your show. That would be utterly amazing, especially if the actors pulled off convincing pronunciation of the two languages (Klingon has q, Q, and H to contend with, along with D and S, which are pronounced in the back of the mouth, unlike English).

2. If you need a volunteer for background actor, or behind the scenes whatever, I'd be happy to volunteer.

 

[JJohnson]

As an aside, in Star Trek Continues, it would be incredibly awesome to see Captain Robert April and/or Captain Christopher Pike in a flashback or even just visiting the Enterprise 'today.' Maybe even a flashback to Kirk taking command of the Enterprise, with Spock and Gary Mitchell at his side, while "Admiral" Robert April and Captain Pike shake his hand, if it could be tied into the episode somehow.

ONLY if his appearance is needed because of the story, not just as fan wank...You`re in trouble when you write something and you`re adding things because you said to yourself : `wouldn`t it be cool if...?`

Absolutely. If it's in the context of the story, yes, not just as a random scene for no reason.

 

[Warped9]

We'll Robert April appeared in TAS' "The Counter-Clock Incident," but I don't know if STC acknowledges TAS. Phase II apparently does given the appearance of Arex. STC might be acknowledging TAS by its inclusion of the prototype holodeck.

Since Robert April could be an Ambassador-at-large then a diplomatic type story could support his appearance. I think that would be better than a flashback, particularly if it involved scenes aboard the Enterprise. A flashback aboard ship could involve redressing the set(s) to look Pike era. That could be problematic.

But as has been mentioned you really need the right story or it does come off as fanwank.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

As an aside, in Star Trek Continues, it would be incredibly awesome to see Captain Robert April and/or Captain Christopher Pike in a flashback or even just visiting the Enterprise 'today.' Maybe even a flashback to Kirk taking command of the Enterprise, with Spock and Gary Mitchell at his side, while "Admiral" Robert April and Captain Pike shake his hand, if it could be tied into the episode somehow.

This would be more of the connect-the-dots that fan films are already riff with, and I would rather they spend more time telling original stories and exploring strange new worlds.

 

[Warped9]

A lot of fans like the idea of revisiting things or characters they found particularly exciting. They can have this notion that if we revisit those things it will be exciting again. But context is everything. Part or the original excitement was the novelty which you no longer have in a revisit. So revisiting a favoured character will only be interesting if there is something genuinely fresh to bring to the game and it's justified by the larger story. Otherwise it's just meaningless pandering.

TNG began the era of connect-the-dots that continued through the following series. And connect-the-dots is something that's been going on in Trek lit since the beginning. But candidly it's rare that this practice really works and it's usually just more pandering. It also makes the fictional universe seem that much smaller every time it's done. It isn't necessary for everyone to know everyone else and for everyone to be privy to everyone else's experiences.

Please, let's keep it to a minmum.

Truthfully as much as I like Star Trek Continues and the character Elise McKennah I am somewhat disappointed seeing the idea of her character in the TOS era. It's so obviously a connect-the-dots to the TNG era in the face of no evidence that ships' counselors existed in the TOS-TMP-TWOK era. We also don't see evidence of it in the Enterprise C era (although they could have been there). There's supposed to be about a century between the TOS and TNG eras so why the insistence to introduce a Counselor now? It's simply a connect-the-dots move.

The idea of the proto-holodeck is more iffy because GR did have the idea back in the day and it did appear in TAS. But for a lot of folks not knowing those things it is a connect-the-dots move. I don't really mind it, but they could have done without it.

What's being done in Phase II is also a connect-the-dots move and one (in my opinion) which doesn't make sense in the "real" world of TOS. Why would Starfleet drastically refit a ship only three years into its five-year voyage and then refit it again (even more drastically) a few years later just prior to TMP? That strikes me as a lot of unnecessary effort and downtime. But the Phase II folks feel compelled to cement this connection between TOS and TMP to rationalize the visual differences between TOS and TMP. It's an indulgence that in the larger scheme of things---telling compelling stories---doesn't accomplish anything. It's just "because."

TAS did it with Robert April. In a more real world perspective it isn't necessary for Kirk and crew to have ever even met Robert April. Certainly the story he appeared in could have easily been told without him. But the writers wanted to indulge in connect-the-dots. It didn't add anything to the story even as it didn't really take away anything from it either. It's a touch of fanwank and in that instance it did no harm. But I certainly wouldn't want to see this all the time.

Of course, that's just my opinion.