Star Trek 2 Villain Revealed?

[Therin of Andor]

I think, in a way, it makes me mourn (yeah, maybe that word is overkill) for the stories that I know and love

And that strategy worked perfectly. Retailers reported extremely healthy sales on all ST DVD boxed sets after the theatrical release of Bad Robot's movie: not only TOS sets, but TAS, the movie sets, TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT. At a time where sales had been expected to dwindle, with every set now having been out on DVD for ages, a new ST movie had suddenly stimulated old fans to revisit what had gone before, and new fans to investigate what they had missed. Good marketing!

knowing that with this new timeline they will never have existed.

But it does exist. The writers told us at the time, "think Parallels", the episode of TNG. Then they co-plotted a comic mini-series, "Countdown", which shows that the 24th century we know and love continues after the disappearance of Ambassador Spock into the black hole.

But you illustrate my point quite well! They DO have a completely clean slate! Introduce new villains and completely unseen missions! Why go back to Khan?

We don't know that they have gone back to Khan. The writers floated the possibiilty that, if Khan shows up in the new universe, they would probably have a different tale to tell with him in this new timeline.

Look at the fan speculations. Some are asking where lots of characters are in this new timeline: will we see Chapel (only namedropped last time, and an offscreen "Yes, doctor"), Rand, Garth, Norman, Kor, Q, and so on.

The last movie had a new villain, Nero. To go with another new villain this time, you have just as much chance that some people will complain, "But that's two movies in a row with a brand new villain. Why can't we revisit an old one and see what happens to them in this timeline?"

 

[Trekkie2]

Abrams stated initially that Eve's character was new to canon. Orci is saying that she will play a cannon character. So what is it? Is one wrong, or are both right?

If she's playing Dr Dehner, she's new to the canonical core team of regulars, but still a canonical character.

It's also possible Alice Eve was signed on as a brand new character and the writers, when planting the Dehner namedrop as an Easter egg in the first IDW comic, decided to make her Dehner in the movie script they were shaping up at the same time.

I wsn't aware (ooh look, a typo) that she was signed for more than one movie. Dehner was very briefly mentioned in the comic book. I really don't think it's her. Chapel was briefly mentioned in the last movie, but there's no indication of who might be playing, if she's in the next movie. We should probably wait for the trailer (if it ever comes out) and go from there.

Or maybe her character gets shot out of a cannon, and both are telling the truth, but, the reporters had a typo and spelled it canon

Yea, your explanation sounds good to me Therin of Andor

My bad. How silly of me to be the only person capable of a type mistake.

 

[Therin of Andor]

I wsn't aware (ooh look, a typo) that she was signed for more than one movie. Dehner was very briefly mentioned in the comic book.

We don't know how many movies she was signed for, but it's a common strategy to have possible sequels options contracted in, keeping future salaries capped.

We do know that Persis Khambatta, Kirstie Alley, Merritt Butrick and Robin Curtis all signed contracts with built-in options for sequels. I would also speculate that Robert Hooks (Harry Morrow) had one, too, which he relinquished, causing his character to be renamed Cartwright. I recall an interview with Bibi Besche where she discussed having to come to grips with not being required for ST III.

I really don't think it's her.

And I think tying her romantically to McCoy (issue #1) may be one of the Easter eggs to be followed up.

 

[Sigokat]

I'm hoping its not Khan, but no matter who Cumberbatch plays I will be watching the movie as soon as I can (I'll be deployed when its released...figures) because 1. I love ST and 2. Cumberbatch is a fantasic actor.

I'm excited no matter what.

 

[Drago-Kazov]

I hope Section 31 will show up. There is something shady going on according to the end of the Archon comic.

 

[Jackson_Roykirk]

Cumberbatch will be playing Gary Khan of Izar:
Kirk's genetically-enhanced superhuman best friend from the academy who develops a God Complex and goes insane.

 

[Drago-Kazov]

Why isn't he in the SA books then?

 

[Ryan8bit]

You really had to reboot the timeline if you wanted to use the original crew again. Otherwise we would already know what was in store for them over the next forty years or so.

"Well, Kirk is going to get trapped in the Nexus, Spock is going die but come back, Scotty will be trapped in a transporter buffer, Sulu's going to become captain of the Excelsior, etc."

Now they've got a clean slate.

Do you think they'll actually kill any of those guys off though?

 

[Greg Cox]

You really had to reboot the timeline if you wanted to use the original crew again. Otherwise we would already know what was in store for them over the next forty years or so.

"Well, Kirk is going to get trapped in the Nexus, Spock is going die but come back, Scotty will be trapped in a transporter buffer, Sulu's going to become captain of the Excelsior, etc."

Now they've got a clean slate.

Do you think they'll actually kill any of those guys off though?

Maybe not, but it's not like their entire futures are set in stone anymore. Spock and Uhura could stay together. Chekov could get promoted to Captain. Who knows?

And you won't have legions of fans wondering where Chapel is or what about the Organian Peace Treaty and when Kirk is going to find out that Carol Marcus is pregnant. And nitpicking each new movie for trivial "canon violations."

"But Kirk didn't discover the slingshot effect until Episode X, and shouldn't he be serving on the Farragut now? And why isn't he living with Janice Lester yet?"

There's more to a clean slate than just the ability to kill people. (Although, rest in peace, Amanda!) It means you're not locked into forty years of predetermined history . . ..

If nothing else, they don't have to worry about "Amok Time" or "Journey to Babel" anymore!

 

[Set Harth]

And nitpicking each new movie for trivial "canon violations."

I'm sure that'll still happen.

It's not an entirely clean slate.

 

[captainkirk]

Abrams stated initially that Eve's character was new to canon. Orci is saying that she will play a cannon character. So what is it? Is one wrong, or are both right?

Abrams never said that. That was just a rumor. I compared a shot of Dehner with the picture of Alice Eve in costume and her hair seemed to be an almost exact match so I'm fairly sure that Eve is Dehner. What I don't know is who the villain could be. It has to be someone who could be played by Del Toro and Cumberbatch, can resist a nerve pinch, is dressed in leather, isn't from the first season of TOS, and isn't Harry Mudd or Spock's brain (Orci confirmed that they wouldn't be involved in the movie).
There are a few characters I can think of. Perhaps Kang or Chang disguised as a human. Or the idea I prefer, which is that this movie will focus heavily on Starfleet. The villain was seen in a Starfleet uniform, as was Alice Eve. Peter Weller said that he's playing a human and he has his own ship. Plus there's the possible appearance of Section 31 in the comics. My theory which I admit doesn't explain everything is that the villain could be Colonel West from TUC. Section 31 could have some technology that enhances their strength, explaining ho he resisted the nerve pinch. Of course I doubt he could be played by a Mexican, but you never know, maybe Del Toro was never considered for a role and that was just a rumor started to make people think it was Khan. We'll have to wait and see, I'm not making any firm guesses until we know more.

 

[Trekkie2]

Abrams stated initially that Eve's character was new to canon. Orci is saying that she will play a cannon character. So what is it? Is one wrong, or are both right?

Abrams never said that. That was just a rumor. I compared a shot of Dehner with the picture of Alice Eve in costume and her hair seemed to be an almost exact match so I'm fairly sure that Eve is Dehner. What I don't know is who the villain could be. It has to be someone who could be played by Del Toro and Cumberbatch, can resist a nerve pinch, is dressed in leather, isn't from the first season of TOS, and isn't Harry Mudd or Spock's brain (Orci confirmed that they wouldn't be involved in the movie).
There are a few characters I can think of. Perhaps Kang or Chang disguised as a human. Or the idea I prefer, which is that this movie will focus heavily on Starfleet. The villain was seen in a Starfleet uniform, as was Alice Eve. Peter Weller said that he's playing a human and he has his own ship. Plus there's the possible appearance of Section 31 in the comics. My theory which I admit doesn't explain everything is that the villain could be Colonel West from TUC. Section 31 could have some technology that enhances their strength, explaining ho he resisted the nerve pinch. Of course I doubt he could be played by a Mexican, but you never know, maybe Del Toro was never considered for a role and that was just a rumor started to make people think it was Khan. We'll have to wait and see, I'm not making any firm guesses until we know more.

He did make a statement that Eve's character was new to canon late last year when she signed on. As for the hair thing, Uhura's hair look's nowhere near what it did in TOS, so you can't go on that basis. In fact, no woman's hair really looks like what we saw in TOS. Orci has somewhat recanted his interview with AICN claiming exhaustion from a press junket, but I don't think it's Harry Mudd either. I think Del Toro was approached to play Khan, but he turned it down because the pay was not what he thought it should be, which would mean the role was not as prominent as he expected. Interesting you should mention Kang and Chang, I gave them thought, since the Klingons in the deleted scenes wore nothing but leather, and BC's mother said he was dressed head to toe in leather also. I hadn't read what Weller said about his character.

 

[Disruptor]

Cumberbatch's character is Captain Garth of Izar.

 

[Jackson_Roykirk]

...I think Del Toro was approached to play Khan, but he turned it down because the pay was not what he thought it should be, which would mean the role was not as prominent as he expected...

I think it's possible that Khan was NEVER supposed to be the antagonist if this film, and del Toro was approached to play the same (non-Khan) antagonist being portrayed by Cumberbatch.

I suppose what I'm saying is that just because del Toro is Mexican, we should not read into it that he was going to play Khan. Del Toro could play a lot of different kinds of Star Trek roles, not just Khan.

 

[BillJ]

...I think Del Toro was approached to play Khan, but he turned it down because the pay was not what he thought it should be, which would mean the role was not as prominent as he expected...

I think it's possible that Khan was NEVER supposed to be the antagonist if this film, and del Toro was approached to play the same (non-Khan) antagonist being portrayed by Cumberbatch.

I suppose what I'm saying is that just because del Toro is Mexican, we should not read into it that he was going to play Khan. Del Toro could play a lot of different kinds of Star Trek roles, not just Khan.

Including Gary Mitchell.

 

[captainkirk]

He did make a statement that Eve's character was new to canon late last year when she signed on.

I don't remember that. I sure it was just a rumor. Got a link?

Uhura's hair look's nowhere near what it did in TOS, so you can't go on that basis.

True. However, it does seem to point to Dehner more than any other character.
Some have suggested before that Khan was going to be the villain but when they couldn't get Del Toro they rewrote it, but Abrams said in an interview once that they haven't made any changes dud to casting. That's why I think that a Klingon is possible since they could be played by either a Mexican or a Brit.
Anyway, the speculation is fun, so I hope that the villain's identity isn't revealed too soon. In fact, I'll stop visiting all Trek sites starting in 2013 to avoid spoilers so if they keep it secret until then I'll go into the theater not knowing who it is. Unless he's on the poster, of course.

 

[Therin of Andor]

I don't remember that. I sure it was just a rumor. Got a link?

http://trekmovie.com/2011/11/30/act...equel-role-del-toro-deal-pending-for-villain/
"According to Variety, Star Trek sequel producer/director JJ Abrams has chosen actress Alice Eve for an unnamed role in the film. The report states that the role is 'believed to be new to the canon'."

http://www.variety.com/article/VR1118046803
"As is common with Abrams, secrecy has surrounded the pic since the helmer officially announced he would be back -- including which characters the new actors will play. Sources say Eve's character is new to the Star Trek universe, unlike del Toro, would insiders believe will be playing someone familiar to Trekkies."

Nothing definitive there, really.

 

[M'Sharak]

Abrams stated initially that Eve's character was new to canon. Orci is saying that she will play a cannon character. So what is it? Is one wrong, or are both right?

Abrams never said that. That was just a rumor. <snip>

He did make a statement that Eve's character was new to canon late last year when she signed on. <snip>

No. He made no such statement.

See Therin's post above. See my post from two weeks ago in which I quoted the same casting announcement item. See the TrekToday entry on the same topic. None of those attribute the "new to canon" statement to Abrams; I'd give credit for that one to Variety writer Justin Kroll, and no one else.

Now, if you want to decide—based upon no firm evidence—that a thing must be so, then that's up to you. Just don't be too surprised when others don't wish to play along as you complain again about how Abrams or Orci have been lying about this or that.

 

[Therin of Andor]

See Therin's post above... Just don't be too surprised when others don't wish to play along as you complain again about how Abrams or Orci have been lying about this or that.

Here's another cool interview about possible easter eggs:

Mike Johnson, IDW writer: "There’s not a big leather-bound padlocked book with all the secrets, but I have Bob [Orci] on speed-dial to make sure whatever we do in the comics doesn’t contradict what the plan is, and can instead help expand it beyond the films."
http://www.newsarama.com/comics/star-trek-mike-johnson-truth-about-tribbles.html

 

[evolution]

I certainly hope that Kahn is not the villain being played by cumberpatch or to have been played by del toro. Neither one of them are Indian. And having read the eugenics wars & to rule in hell, I would be pissed if Kahn was altered in that way. The new timeline can't change Kahn being born Indian in the 1970's. So unless the filmakers are overlooking that which I have to believe the are smart enough not to do, I think we can rule out Kahn. Or at least Kahn being played by them. Maybe though he cumberpatch is one of Kahn's followers. Joaquin?