SPACE: Above and Beyond - Reviews and general geekiness

[Pauln6]

I loved this show too. It's a shame they didn't make a couple of TV movies to tie up the loose ends.

I wish Lanei Chapman had been given something meatier to work with in her Trek appearances too. Judging from what we see in this show, she could have made a worthwhile addition to the cast there if they'd developed her like O'Brien.

 

[saturn5]

I agree with the sentiment that McQueen, Hawkes, and Vansen (in that order) basically carried the show. As far as lead characters go, Nathan West was a pretty weak one. Maybe one of the few negatives points in that show.

Col. McQueen was one of the best bad-ass characters in science fiction.

To wit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2p5KOq6Ekwg&feature=related

Here's a clip which continues right after that moment... McQueen taking on Chiggi Van Richthofen singlehandedly, avenging the death of Lt. Winslow. Probably one of the show's best episodes:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIzLBvB-tpM

It wasn't so much McQueens combat with Chiggy (to which BSG's 'Scar' owes an obvious debt) but his reflection afterwards.

'Now I know who I am. But who was he? And who was she?'

That's what raises SAAB to a higher level, gives it the emotional resonance that means we still adore it nearly 20 years later.

As for Damphouse she was ok, she needed more to do. But Wang and West were the dead losses. I did like Martin Jarvis' guest star role, nice to see the Grenadier Guards are still serving King and Country hundreds of years in the future.

 

[saturn5]

I hated, hated, hated West. He was so boring and lifeless. Gawd. The episodes starring him were by far the worst. I loved Vansen mainly because I had a huge crush on Kristen Cloke back in the day

Didn't we all? Certainly the producer did, that's why he married her (lucky bugger!)

 

[stonester1]

Wargamers also remember S:AB...

http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/ACME4155/mycustompage0001.htm

http://www.armouryhobbies.com/Starship_Models!Space_Above_and_Beyond.htm

 

[Saul]

Didn't like the show at first but by the end was screaming for more. nBSG did remind me of it.

Spoiler: About West in season 2

He dies?? Was that really the plan?

 

[Forbin]

Yeah, I think it started out weak - I actually stopped watching it after a few episodes. But then I tuned in again mid-season and discovered it had become the best military sci fi show ever.

 

[byron lomax]

I barely remember anything about it, but I do remember liking it. From what I do recall, the main character was kind of bland, but the rest of the cast made up for it. I had a major crush on Kristen Cloke too, and still think she looks magnificent - too bad she never had much time for acting later on.

 

[ManOnTheWave]

I didn't really care for it at first. After seeing the final episode, I thought it may be worth it to see the whole thing. A couple years back I got the DVDs for cheap. There were worse ways to kill a weekend.

I thought it was odd though, the way everyone was a pilot and a ground troop. Reminded me of the GIJoe cartoons from the 80s. I really wasn't sure if it was a conscious statement on the part of the writers to make future warriors completely adaptable. Or just lazy writing. "Eh, !@#$ it, everyone's a pilot and ground pounder. And a diver. And they snow board."

 

[Mistral]

Loved the show. Bought the discs for 19.99 a couple years ago-so glad I did. The Col was my favorite by far-he added gravitas to the scenes, like when he blows up on that marine for hitting on him.

Favorite episode? The one with the pancakes. That final scene was, to me, almost iconic in its imagery. Good show, deserved more of a chance. Oh, and I owned (and still do) the same Bears t-shirt Wang had. LOL.

 

[saturn5]

I didn't really care for it at first. After seeing the final episode, I thought it may be worth it to see the whole thing. A couple years back I got the DVDs for cheap. There were worse ways to kill a weekend.

I thought it was odd though, the way everyone was a pilot and a ground troop. Reminded me of the GIJoe cartoons from the 80s. I really wasn't sure if it was a conscious statement on the part of the writers to make future warriors completely adaptable. Or just lazy writing. "Eh, !@#$ it, everyone's a pilot and ground pounder. And a diver. And they snow board."

I'm afraid you have to chalk that up to the cliches of storytelling, like Captain Kirk leading every away party or The Unit's members being able to blend into every enviroment, the series wanted to explore every aspect of the war but keep the continuity of the characters

 

[Ensign_Redshirt]

I didn't really care for it at first. After seeing the final episode, I thought it may be worth it to see the whole thing. A couple years back I got the DVDs for cheap. There were worse ways to kill a weekend.

I thought it was odd though, the way everyone was a pilot and a ground troop. Reminded me of the GIJoe cartoons from the 80s. I really wasn't sure if it was a conscious statement on the part of the writers to make future warriors completely adaptable. Or just lazy writing. "Eh, !@#$ it, everyone's a pilot and ground pounder. And a diver. And they snow board."

I'm afraid you have to chalk that up to the cliches of storytelling, like Captain Kirk leading every away party or The Unit's members being able to blend into every enviroment, the series wanted to explore every aspect of the war but keep the continuity of the characters

Making the main characters combined fighter pilots/ground soldiers simply opened up more story-telling opportunities. Some people questioned the realism of having such "multi-purpose" soldiers. But then again, it's supposed to be the year 2063, who knows how the military is gonna work then?

 

[Admiral2]

I didn't really care for it at first. After seeing the final episode, I thought it may be worth it to see the whole thing. A couple years back I got the DVDs for cheap. There were worse ways to kill a weekend.

I thought it was odd though, the way everyone was a pilot and a ground troop. Reminded me of the GIJoe cartoons from the 80s. I really wasn't sure if it was a conscious statement on the part of the writers to make future warriors completely adaptable. Or just lazy writing. "Eh, !@#$ it, everyone's a pilot and ground pounder. And a diver. And they snow board."

I'm afraid you have to chalk that up to the cliches of storytelling, like Captain Kirk leading every away party or The Unit's members being able to blend into every enviroment, the series wanted to explore every aspect of the war but keep the continuity of the characters

Right. It was just easier to have one set of main characters to insert in all aspects of the war than it would have been to have different teams for every dimension of warfare or to concentrate just on the "air" war like "Black Sheep Squadron" (another fine series about Marine Corps Aviators).

And it seems like Kristen Cloke/Shane Vansen has emerged as the crush/darling/babe of the show. I'm not surprised at all. When Space was cancelled, I followed her to Millenium where she had a recurring role (the only reason to watch that show really).

Then, years later, she did Final Destination. I've since forgiven her, but it took a while.

 

[Forbin]

I seem to recall a scene that was probably driven by fan criticism, wherein McQueen addresses the troops: "I've heard some whining about having to be both pilots AND ground pounders. May I remind you that you are Marines, and you will do whatever you are ordered to do!"

And that was the end of that discussion!

 

[Admiral2]

I seem to recall a scene that was probably driven by fan criticism, wherein McQueen addresses the troops: "I've heard some whining about having to be both pilots AND ground pounders. May I remind you that you are Marines, and you will do whatever you are ordered to do!"

And that was the end of that discussion!

Actually, his exact words were "This isn't the AIR FORCE!" Followed by a motto of the Corps that sums it up nicely: "Every Marine a Rifleman!" It was in the ep "Dear Earth."

I've heard cost talked about before as a reason for why some shows don't get second seasons, and that's obviously a factor, but it's always been my contention that a big enough viewership would make money no object. I think if S:AAB (or Firefly, or Caprica, what have you) had the ratings that Cheers or Friends got on a consistent basis advertisers would gladly pay through the nose to sponsor such shows and the network in turn would gladly pay whatever it took to keep them on the air.

Sadly, that's not always the case. The original BSG never fell out of the top 25 shows, but CBS counter-programmed All In the Family and Alice against it, causing it to drop out of the top 10. BSG's high cost and troubled production schedule (partly ABC's fault for going to series too fast) made ABC think it could be more successful in that timeslot by moving the much cheaper to make powerhouse of Mork & Mindy against CBS on Sunday at 8. (That didn't turn out to be the case, and Mork's ratings dropped so much that the show never recovered.) BSG was killed despite doing pretty well in the ratings against some of the toughest competition on network TV: Archie Bunker.
Reference here.

I guess you're right. I just like to think that the show would have gotten at least one more season if it had an overwhelming fan base.

 

[saturn5]

I seem to recall a scene that was probably driven by fan criticism, wherein McQueen addresses the troops: "I've heard some whining about having to be both pilots AND ground pounders. May I remind you that you are Marines, and you will do whatever you are ordered to do!"

And that was the end of that discussion!

Actually, his exact words were "This isn't the AIR FORCE!" Followed by a motto of the Corps that sums it up nicely: "Every Marine a Rifleman!" It was in the ep "Dear Earth."

I've heard cost talked about before as a reason for why some shows don't get second seasons, and that's obviously a factor, but it's always been my contention that a big enough viewership would make money no object. I think if S:AAB (or Firefly, or Caprica, what have you) had the ratings that Cheers or Friends got on a consistent basis advertisers would gladly pay through the nose to sponsor such shows and the network in turn would gladly pay whatever it took to keep them on the air.

Sadly, that's not always the case. The original BSG never fell out of the top 25 shows, but CBS counter-programmed All In the Family and Alice against it, causing it to drop out of the top 10. BSG's high cost and troubled production schedule (partly ABC's fault for going to series too fast) made ABC think it could be more successful in that timeslot by moving the much cheaper to make powerhouse of Mork & Mindy against CBS on Sunday at 8. (That didn't turn out to be the case, and Mork's ratings dropped so much that the show never recovered.) BSG was killed despite doing pretty well in the ratings against some of the toughest competition on network TV: Archie Bunker.
Reference here.

I guess you're right. I just like to think that the show would have gotten at least one more season if it had an overwhelming fan base.

The curse of sci-fi, it's reasonably expensive in relation to the figures it gets. SAAB had a huge budget for it's day and just couldn't justify it for the audience it got. Classic BSG suffered from the same problem, Bab 5 and New BSG had the advantage of cheap and effective CGI which meant they survived. By contrast a comedy series like 'Friends' has no stunts, no special effects, can be filmed entirely in the studio and get good ratings, the most expensive thing is the cast's salary. Then of course in reality TV you don't even need that

 

[Admiral2]

The curse of sci-fi, it's reasonably expensive in relation to the figures it gets. SAAB had a huge budget for it's day and just couldn't justify it for the audience it got. Classic BSG suffered from the same problem, Bab 5 and New BSG had the advantage of cheap and effective CGI which meant they survived. By contrast a comedy series like 'Friends' has no stunts, no special effects, can be filmed entirely in the studio and get good ratings, the most expensive thing is the cast's salary. Then of course in reality TV you don't even need that

What kills me is, I hated Friends, and I remember when some of the cast (or maybe all of them) were jockeying for seven figs and I thought: "These people want to get paid a million dollars each to act in this shit?"

 

[saturn5]

The curse of sci-fi, it's reasonably expensive in relation to the figures it gets. SAAB had a huge budget for it's day and just couldn't justify it for the audience it got. Classic BSG suffered from the same problem, Bab 5 and New BSG had the advantage of cheap and effective CGI which meant they survived. By contrast a comedy series like 'Friends' has no stunts, no special effects, can be filmed entirely in the studio and get good ratings, the most expensive thing is the cast's salary. Then of course in reality TV you don't even need that

What kills me is, I hated Friends, and I remember when some of the cast (or maybe all of them) were jockeying for seven figs and I thought: "These people want to get paid a million dollars each to act in this shit?"

I like Friends and to be fair the actors were worth it (except Ross?). But it's cheap to make, no expensive costumes or fancy SFX makeup etc so they can afford to pay the cast, no sci-fi show could ever pay it's stars that much

 

[Admiral2]

The curse of sci-fi, it's reasonably expensive in relation to the figures it gets. SAAB had a huge budget for it's day and just couldn't justify it for the audience it got. Classic BSG suffered from the same problem, Bab 5 and New BSG had the advantage of cheap and effective CGI which meant they survived. By contrast a comedy series like 'Friends' has no stunts, no special effects, can be filmed entirely in the studio and get good ratings, the most expensive thing is the cast's salary. Then of course in reality TV you don't even need that

What kills me is, I hated Friends, and I remember when some of the cast (or maybe all of them) were jockeying for seven figs and I thought: "These people want to get paid a million dollars each to act in this shit?"

I like Friends and to be fair the actors were worth it (except Ross?).

Not all of them. Aniston, LeBlanc and Perry, maybe, who were actually funny. The rest were just there to be hip and ironic.

But it's cheap to make, no expensive costumes or fancy SFX makeup etc so they can afford to pay the cast,

True. All they needed was a coffee shop and two Manhattan apartments nobody in the universe could afford.

no sci-fi show could ever pay it's stars that much

So be it, but I would gladly have chipped in to pay Kristen Cloke Jennifer Aniston's salary because I'd rather have a couple of years of Space than eight years of "The One Where Phoebe says something else goofy and Ross acts nebbishy."

 

[saturn5]

What kills me is, I hated Friends, and I remember when some of the cast (or maybe all of them) were jockeying for seven figs and I thought: "These people want to get paid a million dollars each to act in this shit?"

I like Friends and to be fair the actors were worth it (except Ross?).

Not all of them. Aniston, LeBlanc and Perry, maybe, who were actually funny. The rest were just there to be hip and ironic.

But it's cheap to make, no expensive costumes or fancy SFX makeup etc so they can afford to pay the cast,

True. All they needed was a coffee shop and two Manhattan apartments nobody in the universe could afford.

no sci-fi show could ever pay it's stars that much

So be it, but I would gladly have chipped in to pay Kristen Cloke Jennifer Aniston's salary because I'd rather have a couple of years of Space than eight years of "The One Where Phoebe says something else goofy and Ross acts nebbishy."

Perry was the funny one (even wrote a lot of his own stuff having previously been a scriptwriter), the girls were gorgeous but the show would have still worked if it had just been Chandler and Phoboe. Of course it would have essentially been Dharma and Greg...

Yeah Playboy worked out for Joey to have lived where he was supposed to would have cost $5000 a month. But the camera makes everything look bigger and you need decent sized places in order to fit all the equipment in

 

[Forbin]

This thread got me amped, so I just watched Never No More and Angriest Angel again. Good lord, that was a good fracking show!!!