sound design in the vacuum of outer space

[jefferiestubes8]

Really with the exception of 2001: A Space Odyssey (1968) like it has been said almost all scifi movies have sound design (Sound Effects) during all space exterior scenes. Especially when the explosive bolts are used on the EVA pod.

Even the sequel "2010: The Year We Make Contact" had sound design during the airbraking slingshot around Jupiter.
At least during the spacewalk over to Discovery we hear the breathing and dialogue only, oh wait we hear the motor of the tool to open the hatch....

Even during Alien (1979) when the crew detaches the Nostromo from the refinery before going down to planetoid [LV-426] the audio from the computer countdown over the PA an echo effect is used over the wide exterior space shots which is totally ludicrous as sound would not get heard in space due to the vacuum much less have atmospheric effects of delay and echo bouncing off the refinery.
Though early in the film Ridley Scott chose to use the musical score instead of any interior ambience rumble while the the crew is being awoken.

I forgot what sound we hear when the rover is driving away in Moon (2009) in the wide shots as the moon has no atmosphere.

These days it seems silence is now used as an effect rather than scientific accuracy in depicting the vacuum of outerspace exteriors.
see Contact (1997) when she finally unbuckles from the chair inside the Machine and it breaks away from the floor.

This part below is a takeoff from the thread on the Star Trek Movies XI+ forum: Sound in outer space which is an old thread.
as far as Star Trek, a few quotes from that other thread and my reply:
About the scene in "ST:First Contact" when they are outside the ship in space suits to stop the Borg:

Wasn't there phaser fire sound when they were shooting those Borg out there on the deflector dish ?
Can't remember right now

Yeah, and the sound of steam when the borg gets blown off the dish. Plenty o' sound, plus slow broody music.

That really bothered me.
Dramatic license and the vacuum of space certainly contradict themselves.

space battles without sound = epic fail.

if it serves the plot or has a dramatic resonance, to hell with the implausibility. If I wanted to watch a science oriented show, I'll stick with the Science Channel or Nova. This is Star Trek for goodness sake.

I'm not talking about the battles, but the small things like the scene in First Contact above.

 

[Myasishchev]

Just watched Moon again last night; I don't think there's sound in the exterior shots (barring Rockwell's voice and Mansell's score).

 

[Chindogu]

Movies are an artifice. They are created not to represent the physical reality of a situation but to develop/manipulate an emotional relationship with the audience. I think Kubrick understood this, and if silence in space was antithetical to what he was trying to say with 2001 then he would have had sound in space. Most Sci-Fi movies have sound in space because that's part of their core emotional identity.

And if you're going to complain about sound in space then you might as well complain about all non-source music in movies too. Where is the reality of an Orchestra in space, or is there really one following Darth Vader around playing the Imperial March?

Or have I misunderstood what you're trying to say here?

 

[Stevil2001]

Where is the reality of an Orchestra in space, or is there really one following Darth Vader around playing the Imperial March?

Don't be silly, that's ridiculous. No one would think that.










Obviously part of that chest-unit is an iPod.

 

[Owain Taggart]

If nobody's ever seen the Bad Astronomy Website, it's all about this kind of thing where the reviewer points out things that Sci-Fi movies have done wrong.

http://www.badastronomy.com

 

[jefferiestubes8]

Re: sound design in Trek

the Bad Astronomy Website, it's all about this kind of thing where the reviewer points out things that Sci-Fi movies have done wrong.

thanks Owain Taggart.

regarding Star Trek and sound

Well, it's Trek. That means we hear sounds in space.

The real reason is that it feels weird to the audience to have a ship rush past them without hearing anything. In the original Trek, the studio wanted Trek creator Gene Roddenberry to put the sound in there on purpose. He acquiesced; at least, in the first season. I have it on inside info that he took it back out in the second and third seasons, without the studio being the wiser.

http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/tv/enterprise.html

 

[The Comedian]

Where is the reality of an Orchestra in space, or is there really one following Darth Vader around playing the Imperial March?

Don't be silly, that's ridiculous. No one would think that.










Obviously part of that chest-unit is an iPod.

Curiously, if helicopters play "Ride of the Valkyries" as they go into battle, it's cool.

If a Dark Lord were to do it on his own, it would be comedy.

 

[jefferiestubes8]

to develop/manipulate an emotional relationship with the audience.

Most Sci-Fi movies have sound in space because that's part of their core emotional identity.

I understand. Sure a director has 3 sound tools to use to control those emotions in storytelling:
dialogue, music, sound effects.
I guess that is why a Michael Bay splosionfest like Armageddon (1998) is full of super loud sound effects even in outer space. It is identifying and thus manipulating action movie fans (not scifi fans).

 

[Deckerd]

*cough* Firefly */cough*

I'm curious about the title of this thread. Is 'outer space' even quieter than just plain ole space?

 

[tharpdevenport]

space battles without sound = epic fail.

Baloney. End battle in "Serenity".

Only three or four times we heard sound in space in that film, and each has a reason:

1. Serenity was entering the upper atmosphere of the planet at the beginning.

2. Mal shoots at the Reaver ship from ontop Serenity; we are hearing from inside his helmet speaker (that's why we heard the airwave sounding comments moments before) and the concussive explosions hit his helmet as much as it can in space, creating those low booms.

3. Again, upper planetary atmosphere at during the end battle.

(think there was another time, but don't recall)


Other than that, NO sound in space (not counting the score).

Where is the reality of an Orchestra in space, or is there really one following Darth Vader around playing the Imperial March?

A famous film composer (I think Bernard Herrmann) had a good reply to that when asked by the director where the music was coming from; he said something like:

Show me where the camera is and I'll tell you where the music is coming from.

 

[Lindley]

When Mal shoots the Reaver ship, I don't think that's even a sound effect there. I think the score just has some conveniently timed bass drum.

 

[Mistral]

After careful consideration I've decided that, to me, this is a silly thread and a silly topic to wrangle over. A movie is artifice and the sound effects are there for dramatic license. If you want accurate, go watch live simulcasts of NASA.

 

[Deckerd]

If it can be done effectively, as has been demonstrated, then perhaps the film/TV makers should stop treating people like morons.

 

[JarodRussell]

I do think the space walk in First Contact would have been way better without sound. Just to hear the breathing similar to 2010 would have been nice.


But yes, sound in space is solely artistic license. Same goes for being able to see laser beams. Or light coming out of nowhere in caves.

 

[Owain Taggart]

After careful consideration I've decided that, to me, this is a silly thread and a silly topic to wrangle over. A movie is artifice and the sound effects are there for dramatic license. If you want accurate, go watch live simulcasts of NASA.

No, but see, it's not about being dramatic, it's about realistic science and so many movies and shows get it wrong. And it's not only on effects, but highly inaccurate facts as well.

 

[SG-17]

Wait, wouldn't there actually be some sound on the Moon since it does have an atmosphere? Or is it so thin that it doesn't matter?

 

[JarodRussell]

Well, technically, if you'd actually film on the moon, you would hear a lot of stuff, depending on the nature of the microphones you use.

What is realistic sound in film anyway? It's recorded with microphones, and there's always the barely noticable recording glitch because someone hit the boom mike.
If a Mars rover passes by, the vibrations that translate from the ground into the microphone, for instance.

If you recorded in vaccuum, you'd be surprised how clearly you could hear that stuff.

 

[Tiberius]

The simple fact is that space is not a total vaccuum. There is a very very sparse gas, a few atoms per cubic centimeter. And Star Trek has very sensitive microphones.

 

[Owain Taggart]

Well, technically, if you'd actually film on the moon, you would hear a lot of stuff, depending on the nature of the microphones you use.

What is realistic sound in film anyway? It's recorded with microphones, and there's always the barely noticable recording glitch because someone hit the boom mike.
If a Mars rover passes by, the vibrations that translate from the ground into the microphone, for instance.

If you recorded in vaccuum, you'd be surprised how clearly you could hear that stuff.

They should test that on Mythbusters.

 

[Sykonee]

The simple fact is that space is not a total vaccuum. There is a very very sparse gas, a few atoms per cubic centimeter. And Star Trek has very sensitive microphones.

Subspace quantum microphones!