Some things that bugged me

[Praxius]

I always figured that was mostly just people-reading skills, recognizing body language and the like. But the original idea may have been that telepathy was long-range in its effects. I'm not sure how fully they thought it through.

The way I figured it was in Tin Man, not only could they sense people they're near or can see, but they can expand it beyond just one person but a general sense of those in a certain area near them.

The thing was that normal Betazoids could channel, focus and control what went into their heads..... buddy who went over to Tin Man couldn't and I believe he had another disability in that his telepathic abilities were far more advanced and could go quite a distance.

While most Betazoids could sense thoughts and emotions, Troi could only focus and interpret emotions, depending on who she focused on.

 

[SPCTRE]

Actually, that is explained in TNG. Betazoids are able to filter out emotional background noise, much like humans are able to filter out acoustic background noise (for example the sound of traffic) in their daily lives.

Ah, right. She senses emotions, but doesn't "eavesdrop" on actual thought content. So there's the empathic ability, to detect emotion, and then there's the ability to communicate telepathically. But the range is what is rather inconsistently depicted.

Exactly. Bear in mind, Deanna's abilities are limited by her "handicap" - she's half human

She usually wasn't able to read the thoughts of non-Betazoids.

 

[Unicron]

Interestingly enough, the TNG comic "Artificiality" had Q turning all of the crew into androids like Data, partly for his own amusement and partly to demonstrate Data's "inferiority" in lacking emotions and relying primarily on rational thinking. Troi apparently could still sense emotions as an android, but lacked the context to interpret them since she'd lost her emotions. It's a rather good read.

 

[Trevacious]

Betazoids can't read a Ferengi's mind, nothing is said about reading their emotions.

"Look at that leer on his face."

 

[T'Girl]

Troi apparently could still sense emotions as an android, but lacked the context to interpret them since she'd lost her emotions.

So she lost her memories of emotions also?

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

if the aliens knew about the existence of others even without Warp Drive there's no PD violation.

Agreed. If an alien race (even one that isn't warp capable) asks for help, the Federation can grant it. That's how they got around the problem in "Pen Pals": they interpreted Sarjenka's messages to Data as a request for assistance.

 

[BillJ]

^I don't think the prime directive changed at all, I just think humans just got more anal about it in the 24th century

Sure it did...

It went from being applied to underdeveloped civilizations to the primary foreign policy tool of the Federation.

 

[Anwar]

I don't think "don't interfere with another culture's internal affairs" and the PD are the same thing. They just sound so similar that it's easy misinterpreted as a PD thing. The PD applies to pre-warp civilizations unaware of alien life, not interfering with another spacefaring culture's internal affairs is just foreign policy.

 

[Christopher]

I don't think "don't interfere with another culture's internal affairs" and the PD are the same thing. They just sound so similar that it's easy misinterpreted as a PD thing. The PD applies to pre-warp civilizations unaware of alien life, not interfering with another spacefaring culture's internal affairs is just foreign policy.

Not so. In "Justice," the Edo knew about the Enterprise's existence (which seemed like a Prime Directive violation in itself) yet the PD required the crew to obey local laws. In "Symbiosis," it was stated that the PD prohibited the crew from telling the Ornarans, a spacefaring culture, about the Brekkians' deception. "The Perfect Mate" said that the PD prohibited interfering in the handover of Kamala to the Valt. DS9: "The Circle" said that the PD forbade intervention in the Bajoran civil conflict. VGR: "Counterpoint" said that VGR violated the Prime Directive when it rescued the telepaths from the Devore. And so on.

The point of the Prime Directive, in general, is that Starfleet can't impose its will on other cultures, that it has to respect their right to self-determination. The ban on contact with pre-warp cultures is a facet of that, intended to keep the Federation from using its superior technology to impose on them. But it's just a part of the whole. Another facet of it is prohibiting uninvited intervention in any unallied culture's local affairs, and prohibiting taking sides in any internal dispute.

 

[Timo]

One might well postulate that the PD is simply a chastity belt locked around the tender parts of Starfleet specifically. It doesn't limit the UFP from exercising whatever foreign policy it wishes. It merely stops Starfleet field commanders from becoming political players.

In managing intra-Federation affairs, Starfleet officers can probably be trusted to obey UFP laws and policies, hence they can freely order around UFP colonists and the like. But any operation involving foreign civilizations, especially very primitive and very advanced ones, is going to be too complex for said officers to handle without them getting up to their necks in the muck of "policy interpreting". That's why Starfleet can't mess with foreign cultures on its own - but a Starfleet vessel with a civilian Ambassador aboard may exercise gunboat diplomacy on them, as in "A Taste of Armageddon".

There is virtually no evidence that the PD would have any effect on UFP civilian citizens or the UFP government. Quite to the contrary, stories like "Angel One" or ST:INS indicate that civilians are exempt of PD obligations and that the government can and will choose to act in ways that are at odds with how they expect Starfleet to act under the PD.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Anwar]

The PD applies only to Starfleet Officers, which makes sense seeing how their ships are likely vastly more powerful and possess resources that civilian craft would not have.

 

[Christopher]

Well, ST has been inconsistent about that. TNG: "Angel One" said it was Starfleet only, but at other times it's been referred to as the Federation's highest law, which would indicate it applies Federation-wide, not just to the military. But then, ST has often blurred the lines between the Federation and Starfleet.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I think the question was, does the Prime Directive apply to *civilians*.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

I have no idea what the physics of a "thought wave" might be, if such a thing even exists.

Thread necromancy!

 

[T'Girl]

But then, ST has often blurred the lines between the Federation and Starfleet.

Well, the Federation is a peace-keeping armada.

 

[RAMA]

Well TNG is perfection, no doubt about that. But it's been a few years since I watched TNG (except for a few reruns I caught here and there) but how does Deanna Troi "read" emotions when they hail another ship? She can read via the sensors? Really puzzles me...

Also I wish they had done an episode where the civilization on a planet isn't entirely primitive, where they're actually as advanced as we are today in the early 21st Century but still pre-warp and where said civilization was facing extinction by something like a large asteroid. Something that THEY could detect. How would the Enterprise deal with such a situation? If they "deal" with the asteroid, the planet's inhabitants would know as they'd be aware of the asteroid (as we would be today if something like that happened) which would break the Prime Directive, but if they didn't do it said civilization would most likely not survive. Was there an episode that dealt with something like this where the Enterprise faced a similar dilemma?

I can't wait to start rewatching this! It's been too long.

There were episodes like this, including "Masterpiece Society"(advanced 21st-22nd century society threatened by stellar core fragment), Matter of Time" (society threatened by earthquakes), Pen Pals(Planet, roughly 20th century tech threatened by mantle instability), "Homeward" (a primitive planet suffering an atmospheric catastrophe)and there were others.

RAMA

 

[RAMA]

^I don't think the prime directive changed at all, I just think humans just got more anal about it in the 24th century

Sure it did...

It went from being applied to underdeveloped civilizations to the primary foreign policy tool of the Federation.

It's a logical continuation to do this, you can't simply apply something to primitive civilizations and then interfere with everybody else.

 

[EmperorTiberius]

Troi can sense up to a certain distance. It also seems like she can focus better when she sees the person or hears them through the comm channel.