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Should novels set in the JJVerse rectify the film's plot holes?

There was also never a mention of bathrooms in Star Trek. Yet we can assume they have one.

I remember them being refereed to in some of the books as waste extraction facilities

Damnit, why is it that there's always someone who needs to disagree?!

It's not "disagreement" if it's a matter of objective fact. It's simply clarification, giving you more information so you'll be able to understand the situation more fully. It's simply the truth that "waste extraction" was used (beginning in DS9, I believe) as the Trek-universe euphemism for bathrooms.

Also, we did see Troi's bathtub in "Genesis" and showers in various ENT episodes, and both "The Naked Time" and "The Naked Now" referenced people showering with their clothes on. Plus we saw B'Elanna in the sonic shower in "Juggernaut." So the statement that bathrooms were never referenced in Trek is simply wrong. If you don't want a statement to be "disagreed" with, then take care to confirm your facts before you post it.
 
There was also never a mention of bathrooms in Star Trek. Yet we can assume they have one.

I remember them being refereed to in some of the books as waste extraction facilities

Damnit, why is it that there's always someone who needs to disagree?! So there was no mention of masturbation in Star Trek then, yet we can assume they do it.

Wasn't there?:evil:
In TNG: The perfect mate, Riker was shown heading directly to the holodeck after an interaction with the femme fatale from that episode.
Not to mention - the previously mentioned examples.:evil:

Let's be honest - we all know what the primary use of the holodeck is.:devil:

JD, trek's explanation for why different species understand each other was always the UT - never a 'federation standard' - as I said, THIS was the scenarists' intent.

No, not really. At least, it depends on which "scenarists" you're referring to. The concept of the UT was first introduced in "Metamorphosis" as a special device that was used for specific purposes, in this case trying to communicate with an energy being that didn't have the capacity for normal speech. It was depicted at a flashlight-sized cylinder, so it clearly wasn't something that everyone had on their person 24/7, since we'd never seen one in use before.

True, later Trek has retconned the UT into a more ubiquitous device, in order to rationalize Trek's prior and ongoing use of the "every alien speaks English" conceit of sci-fi television. But that just makes it one means for interspecies communication, specifically a means of facilitating communication between species that have never encountered each other before. It is illogical to assume that that precludes every other possible method of communication, such as actually learning another language.

Case in point: Picard and Riker were both shown to gain a fair proficiency in Klingon, actually learning the language itself. Clearly people in the 24th century, particularly in Starfleet, are not lazy idiots who let machines do all their thinking for them, but intelligent, inquisitive people willing and eager to learn new things even if they don't strictly "need" to.

My point is simply that when the scenarists bothered to come up with an explanation for why everyone understands everyone else, the UT was this explanation.
All 24th century series (and enterprise) are filled with references to how easy to use the UTs are, how ubiquitous they are, etc - all in order to explain the ease of comunication.

Of course, you can come up with a 'federation standard' theory - as I said, I find it interesting. But you'll inevitably have to retcon/explain away numerous instances in the series where this explanation doesn't quite fit - because they were not written to fit it.

As for Picard and Riker - they only seemed to know a few klingon words, not speak klingon fluently.
For example, Picard always spoke english before the high council, not klingon.
 
You seem to think we are saying that they didn't use UTs, and as for myself (and I'm sure the others will agree with me) all I'm saying is that there would have to be some kind of a backup method of communication. I find it completely implausible that they would rely only on a piece of tech like that for all of their communications.
 
I remember them being refereed to in some of the books as waste extraction facilities

Damnit, why is it that there's always someone who needs to disagree?!

It's not "disagreement" if it's a matter of objective fact. It's simply clarification, giving you more information so you'll be able to understand the situation more fully. It's simply the truth that "waste extraction" was used (beginning in DS9, I believe) as the Trek-universe euphemism for bathrooms.

Also, we did see Troi's bathtub in "Genesis" and showers in various ENT episodes, and both "The Naked Time" and "The Naked Now" referenced people showering with their clothes on. Plus we saw B'Elanna in the sonic shower in "Juggernaut." So the statement that bathrooms were never referenced in Trek is simply wrong. If you don't want a statement to be "disagreed" with, then take care to confirm your facts before you post it.

Somehow I had the feeling that YOU might be coming in here again being the annoying smartass you always are. :guffaw:
 
Damnit, why is it that there's always someone who needs to disagree?!

It's not "disagreement" if it's a matter of objective fact. It's simply clarification, giving you more information so you'll be able to understand the situation more fully. It's simply the truth that "waste extraction" was used (beginning in DS9, I believe) as the Trek-universe euphemism for bathrooms.

Also, we did see Troi's bathtub in "Genesis" and showers in various ENT episodes, and both "The Naked Time" and "The Naked Now" referenced people showering with their clothes on. Plus we saw B'Elanna in the sonic shower in "Juggernaut." So the statement that bathrooms were never referenced in Trek is simply wrong. If you don't want a statement to be "disagreed" with, then take care to confirm your facts before you post it.

Somehow I had the feeling that YOU might be coming in here again being the annoying smartass you always are. :guffaw:

He's not being an annoying smartass, he's being right. It's not his fault you get upset every time someone points out a minor mistake of yours.
 
It's not "disagreement" if it's a matter of objective fact. It's simply clarification, giving you more information so you'll be able to understand the situation more fully. It's simply the truth that "waste extraction" was used (beginning in DS9, I believe) as the Trek-universe euphemism for bathrooms.

Also, we did see Troi's bathtub in "Genesis" and showers in various ENT episodes, and both "The Naked Time" and "The Naked Now" referenced people showering with their clothes on. Plus we saw B'Elanna in the sonic shower in "Juggernaut." So the statement that bathrooms were never referenced in Trek is simply wrong. If you don't want a statement to be "disagreed" with, then take care to confirm your facts before you post it.

Somehow I had the feeling that YOU might be coming in here again being the annoying smartass you always are. :guffaw:

He's not being an annoying smartass, he's being right. It's not his fault you get upset every time someone points out a minor mistake of yours.

Oh he is.

What was I actually saying? Someone said that the existence of Federation Standard doesn't need to have been mentioned, it's just reasonable to assume that. And to emphasize this, I decided to say they never mentioned bathrooms, yet we can assume they have some.

Now the smartass decides to say "but they mentioned bathrooms!" and another smartass comes along and says "he's right to say that, check your facts!", while the reasonable person would simply get the point.

Oh no, maybe I should have said toilets? Have we seen those? I don't know, I don't have all the 700.000 episodes memorized. But maybe Memory Alpha has an article on toilet use in Star Trek.
 
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Somehow I had the feeling that YOU might be coming in here again being the annoying smartass you always are. :guffaw:

He's not being an annoying smartass, he's being right. It's not his fault you get upset every time someone points out a minor mistake of yours.

Oh he is.

What was I actually saying? Someone said that the existence of Federation Standard doesn't need to have been mentioned, it's just reasonable to assume that. And to emphasize this, I decided to say they never mentioned bathrooms, yet we can assume they have some.

Now the smartass decides to say "but they mentioned bathrooms!" and another smartass comes along and says "he's right to say that, check your facts!", while the reasonable person would simply get the point.

No, the reasonable person is the one who doesn't throw a temper tantrum because someone pointed out a minor error.
 
He's not being an annoying smartass, he's being right. It's not his fault you get upset every time someone points out a minor mistake of yours.

Oh he is.

What was I actually saying? Someone said that the existence of Federation Standard doesn't need to have been mentioned, it's just reasonable to assume that. And to emphasize this, I decided to say they never mentioned bathrooms, yet we can assume they have some.

Now the smartass decides to say "but they mentioned bathrooms!" and another smartass comes along and says "he's right to say that, check your facts!", while the reasonable person would simply get the point.

No, the reasonable person is the one who doesn't throw a temper tantrum because someone pointed out a minor error.

One could always ask why the reasonable person even started to throw a temper tantrum.
 
Oh he is.

What was I actually saying? Someone said that the existence of Federation Standard doesn't need to have been mentioned, it's just reasonable to assume that. And to emphasize this, I decided to say they never mentioned bathrooms, yet we can assume they have some.

Now the smartass decides to say "but they mentioned bathrooms!" and another smartass comes along and says "he's right to say that, check your facts!", while the reasonable person would simply get the point.

No, the reasonable person is the one who doesn't throw a temper tantrum because someone pointed out a minor error.

One could always ask why the reasonable person even started to throw a temper tantrum.

No, one couldn't, because the one who starts to throw a temper tantrum isn't reasonable in the first place.
 
Sci - knowing your own proclivities toward throwing "a temper tantrum", I find your affirmations here disingenious.

Practice what you preach - only then may you be taken seriously.
 
Sci - knowing your own proclivities toward throwing "a temper tantrum", I find your affirmations here disingenious.

Practice what you preach - only then may you be taken seriously.

Indeed. Even though he may not have been completely acquite in that no "bathrooms" were mentioned, there was no real need for Christopher to get all "anal" over it and then you to jump to his defence. I knew what JarodRussel meant even if you didn't or felt the need to understand it and then be a "smartarse" about it.
 
According to The Making of Star Trek First Contact, they actually built a bathroom with a hexagonal toilet just off the captain's ready room despite the fact there were no plans to show it. It's either a bad joke by the writers of the book or a waste of money by the producers of the movie.
 
Somehow I had the feeling that YOU might be coming in here again being the annoying smartass you always are. :guffaw:

He's not being an annoying smartass, he's being right. It's not his fault you get upset every time someone points out a minor mistake of yours.

Oh he is.

What was I actually saying? Someone said that the existence of Federation Standard doesn't need to have been mentioned, it's just reasonable to assume that. And to emphasize this, I decided to say they never mentioned bathrooms, yet we can assume they have some.

Now the smartass decides to say "but they mentioned bathrooms!" and another smartass comes along and says "he's right to say that, check your facts!", while the reasonable person would simply get the point.

Oh no, maybe I should have said toilets? Have we seen those? I don't know, I don't have all the 700.000 episodes memorized. But maybe Memory Alpha has an article on toilet use in Star Trek.
Memory Alpha: Toilet:biggrin::guffaw:
You really shouldn't say stuff like that as a fact when it is easily proven wrong. At least not with people like Christopher, and Sci (hell, and me) around.
 
If we include the books, I think I remember there was being a reference in Destiny to one of the characters taking care of things themself.

Incidentally, I thought "be your own best friend" was the best euphemism ever.

According to The Making of Star Trek First Contact, they actually built a bathroom with a hexagonal toilet just off the captain's ready room despite the fact there were no plans to show it. It's either a bad joke by the writers of the book or a waste of money by the producers of the movie.

Well, not really a "waste," as such. Sets for TV shows and serial movies are often built with things that would logically be in them that aren't needed for the project at hand, just because someone might want to use them in the future. The engine room for TNG, for instance, is a giant example, with a couple of scenes added in the pilot just to show it off, because the producers knew they'd need it later, and knew they'd never have enough money to do it right again. "Serenity" also rebuilt all the sets from "Firefly," even ones that were barely seen, like the Captain's Quarters, the Infirmary, and Inara's Shuttle. I wouldn't be surprised if there was some stuff recreated for that movie that never actually made it on-screen.
 
You know, someone mentioned the written languages being sort-of evidence that everybody knows English (and I'm not saying they necessarily don't--at least I'll say it's more likely that the aliens would go to the immense trouble of learning English than the Human would of learning the major Vulcan language, but that's because it's kinda clear, in an unfortunate-implications sorta way, that we're the demographically if not culturally dominant group).

However, when we already have to buy realtime alien-to-English and English-to-alien aural translation, through some means, it's no great leap to believe that written translation is effected through similar means. I mean, in comparison, that's some absolutely trivial, twenty-minutes-into-the-future stuff.

Of course, you'd need the substrate written language, so English (being the dominant language of humans, and humans being the dominant players in the Fed) it is.*

*(Although there's an alternative explanation for that: English may be suited better to realtime translation than most other human languages, because of the extremely restricted word order, but maybe not. Someone with better grasp of foreign languages with less restrictive word orders may be able to answer that better.)
 
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