Shatnertage's Mostly-1st-Time Watch Thread

[Shatnertage]

^ I was thinking the exact same thing. Maybe it was a psychological defeat--if they beat the people who everyone else is in fear of, then the regular military doesn't stand a chance.

Anyone else like the mimosas?

 

[Admiral Shran]

I suppose that makes sense. A psychological defeat can be very harmful, but both still have great strength. Changling Lovok should have said something like "they're greatly weakened now" instead of that they're no longer any threat.

And I never noticed the mimosas before.

 

[BlueStuff]

I never thought I'd see a Sex and the City reference here of all places, but it's one I appreciate! I'll have to look out for the mimosas the next time I watch that one (one of my favorite two-parters!)

Garak surely can make any episode watchable.

 

[The Dominion]

The Obsidian Order and the Tal Shiar are more than you run of the mill intel agencies though, they were like the KGB/CIA on steroids, and a big part of each empire's whole functioning system. The Fed's equivalent - Section 31, though effective, is so small and unknown (and arguably illegal) that if they were gone the Federation wouldn't miss much, and would be far from crippled.

 

[TheGodBen]

The effect that this event has on the Romulan Empire is debatable as we don't see much of their internal politics in the show, although we do know that the Tal Shiar manages to survive. However, the impact on the Cardassian Union is major and that's a big part of season 4. They're not defeated, but their empire is ripe for the taking.

 

[Admiral Shran]

I never thought I'd see a Sex and the City reference here of all places

It was a Sex and the City reference?!

The effect that this event has on the Romulan Empire is debatable as we don't see much of their internal politics in the show, although we do know that the Tal Shiar manages to survive. However, the impact on the Cardassian Union is major and that's a big part of season 4. They're not defeated, but their empire is ripe for the taking.

True. But if the episode itself had made this clearer, I wouldn't have a problem with it. If Changling Lovok had said they succeeded in weakening their opponents or in opening up opportunities for destabilizing them it would have been better.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

Of course, the Changelings had this arrogant habit of speaking of their aims as a fait accompli, no matter what.

 

[Thestral]

The Fed's equivalent - Section 31, though effective, is so small and unknown (and arguably illegal) that if they were gone the Federation wouldn't miss much, and would be far from crippled.

Spoilers!

Spoiler: Later in the show

Not the equivalent - that'd be Starfleet Intelligence - and definitely illegal.

The effect that this event has on the Romulan Empire is debatable as we don't see much of their internal politics in the show, although we do know that the Tal Shiar manages to survive. However, the impact on the Cardassian Union is major and that's a big part of season 4. They're not defeated, but their empire is ripe for the taking.

Agreed.

True. But if the episode itself had made this clearer, I wouldn't have a problem with it. If Changling Lovok had said they succeeded in weakening their opponents or in opening up opportunities for destabilizing them it would have been better.

For the Romulans, who have a history of isolationism and using covert action before (or instead of) overt military action, removing the Tal Shiar effective negates their threat, not to mention the potentially destabilizing influence.

Also, we saw what they meant in Season 4 -

Spoiler: Spoilers!

the Detapa Council able to overthrow Central Command which opened them up to predation from the Klingongs via Changeling Martok. They're playing the long game...

 

[Admiral Shran]

For the Romulans, who have a history of isolationism and using covert action before (or instead of) overt military action, removing the Tal Shiar effective negates their threat, not to mention the potentially destabilizing influence.

Spoiler: Seasons 6 and 7

Yet that didn't happen because they came back helped the Feds and Klingons win the Dominion War.

 

[46379.1]

For me, this is Trek at its worst: completely serious, preachy about something that all civilized people already agree on

This story worked for me because there wasn't much technobabble and no space battles

When I say that "Equilibrium" was boring, it's not because there weren't space battles or explosions. That stuff works for me only once in a blue moon

I'm not a big one for space battles, anyway.

Are you sure that you want to continue watching?

 

[TheGodBen]

Actually, while the scale of DS9's space battles were far beyond anything seen in the other shows, and even the movies, space battles themselves were less frequent than they were on Voyager and Enterprise. Think about it, for all the talk of DS9's epic battles, there are only 7 fleet battles in the whole show, including the one in The Die is Cast.

 

[46379.1]

But it's not just that. He doesn't like space battles, no technobabble, no dead serious Trek and no preachy Trek, all of wich is a big part of (at least for me) what made DS9 so good.

 

[MacLeod]

^Might be a case of less is more with regards to DSN's battles then. The more you use a battle, the less impactful they are.

 

[defiantfan]

But it's not just that. He doesn't like space battles, no technobabble, no dead serious Trek and no preachy Trek, all of wich is a big part of (at least for me) what made DS9 so good.

There are lots of different parts that make DS9 great. I like reading this take on it because of the appreciation for the character relationships.

 

[Admiral Shran]

There's something in DS9 for everyone.

 

[Athena28]

I finally took a trip...

"Through the Looking Glass"

And didn't really like what I found there...

All I can say is...it's fun.

 

[Athena28]

I'm finally back with some time after championing an...

"Improbable Cause"

I always like it when Garak & Bashir trade fables.

 

[Athena28]

And I'll jump right through to...

"The Die is Cast"

So upsetting the torture scene. But brilliant ep., nonetheless.

 

[Shatnertage]

Actually, though, the more that I think about it, the mimosas scene is more Patsy and Edina than Carrie and Miranda.

They are certainly a legendary pair of...

"Explorers"

This was a good episode. The Thor Heyerdahl/Kon-Tiki stuff was a little forced, but I like that Ben and Jake got to spend some time together.

And I'm thrilled that, after three seasons of hearing how Sisko was a builder, I finally got to see him build something. Yeah, I'm being a little literal there, but I've got my virtual tongue in cheek. You should have heard how vociferously I complained during that George Clooney movie where he was a "fixer" for a law firm. I kept waiting for someone to bring him a broken lamp or something. No dice.

Back to the episode. We also have our first Leeta sighting, as well as yet another mention of the pre-ganglionic fiber/post-ganglionic nerve. I suspect that no DS9 fans who were in medical school ever missed that question.

And Quark is betting on Bashir to...get more involved...with his med school rival. It can't get much more fun than that. Then she shows up and totally ignores him, sending him into a tailspin.

I like what they did with it, but I thought a funnier resolution would have been, "What? You didn't know that she's legally blind?"

My rewind and rewatch moment:

"Hammock time!"

"Yooooo!"

I don't even really know why that's funny, but I know it's funny.

In a possible Trek first, this episode features both main cast members getting plastered and main cast members discussing how to use the toilet...without any specifics, though. That would wait until that ENT episode where Tucker talked poop for those school kids.

You might quibble with this, saying that surely some Bajoran would have tried the light ship thing, but I liked this episode.

Yo!

 

[Admiral Shran]

A pretty good episode. I like that they decided to give Jake the idea to be a writer, thereby finally finding something to do with him.

And, what were your first impressions of Leeta, since there's currently a thread in this forum about her.