Shatnertage's Mostly-1st-Time Watch Thread

[apenpaap]

One thing that is pretty funny about Sisko being a half-Prophet is that it means there is only one fully standard-issue human in the main cast. After all, Julian is genetically engineered, so that only leaves O'Brien. Well, that is if we don't count the

Spoiler: future development

...Nothing, really. Just messing with ShatnerTage. O'Brien is as human as it gets.

 

[NavisPacifica]

One thing I would have liked to have been different about the whole series is the involvement of the Pah Wraiths starting about right now. Their existence makes sense and for the most part I like the connection between them and Dukat which will continue to play out, but as far as the Prophets are concerned I would have preferred their main antagonists to be the Founders; both are life forms radically different from humanoid solids, both are worshiped as gods, and in both cases their divinity is simply a matter of perspective, but there are interesting contrasts: the Prophets are benevolent, but their primary role seems to be as teachers who instructed the Bajoran people long ago, and otherwise they like to remain aloof from linear, corporeal affairs. The Founders, while preferring seclusion and isolation, feel that everything must be put in its place, and their attitude towards "solids" is really one of disdain and even hatred. Their inherent flaw, as I see it, is that they simply can't live and let live; the Alpha Quadrant must be subdued, and in their arrogance they assume it is both possible and necessary, thereby demonstrating that they are not as highly evolved as they would like to think.

The Pah Wraiths, on the other hand, don't have much of a compelling back story; they're simply the Satanic counterpart to the Prophets, the fallen angels. While I like the ideal of fallen Prophets, it simply wasn't played out in a way that interested me (the episode in which Keiko is possessed by a Pah Wraith is an exception; while I found the episode a bit tedious, Chao's performance was spooky and effectively portrayed a callous and ruthless being...but why should they be so? We never find out).

 

[intrinsical]

Well, this is Ronald D. Moore's first attempt at examining religion from a science fiction perspective. I like that there Prophets who try to mean well but don't see really themselves as gods and Founders who genetically engineer beings to believe they are gods. Personally, I think he did a better job in DS9 than he did with BSG.

 

[Shatnertage]

It's time to...

"Take Me Out To The Holosuite"

This was certainly no "Duet." Sisko gets challenged to a baseball game by a Vulcan captain who's been disrespecting him since their academy days. And, to get back at that Vulcan who thinks he's so great, he enlists his staff--most of whom have no idea what baseball is--to play against them. There are lots of training scenes.

The only really funny thing about this episode (for me) was Sisko's exposition about how Solok's written 47 (or however many) papers about Vulcans' superiority, and started each one with the anecdote of their wrestling match. I was actually laughing at how peeved Sisko was.

Although if you think about it, the whole thing is preposterous. First of all, it's not exactly politic for a Vulcan in Starfleet, which has many humans in its command structure, to go around badmouthing humans. Second, lets say I get challenged to a wrestling match by an 8 year-old (hopefully, I'm 3 times as strong as an 8 year-old). If that kid gets hospitalized after the match with broken ribs, etc, who lost their temper, me or him? Not exactly good sportsmanship from Solok there.

The joke, of course, is the same joke from TOS: despite his protestations to the contrary, Spock is the most emotional guy on the whole ship. Ditto with Solok.

Reading MA, I found out that parts of the episode were just recycled from a Fame episode Ira Steven Behr had written before, including the decidedly unfunny bit where Nog doesn't know who to tag. I can't say I'm really surprised.

The best I can say about this one is that if you imagine that it takes place in the same alternate continuity as "A Night in Sickbay," there are a few good laughs. But it's a lot more boring than ANiS, with fewer Pillarian slips. So there.

 

[Shatnertage]

And then someone sheds their...

"Chrysalis"

I see the blurb and I wince. The most annoying guest characters I can remember (and that's saying a lot) are back.

I will digress here and say they remind of some character types from some of the darker corners of Trek BBS. You've got the manic guy with delusions of grandeur and an unshakable sense of his own superiority; the attention-seeking histrionic woman; the nice but easily upset guy; and the cataleptic woman. Well, the last one wouldn't be on here, but you get the point (I hope). I can really picture Jack posting huge walls of text arguing minor points of continuity.

But anyway, they want to make Sarina normal, and it's up to Bashir to do it in 45 minutes, otherwise she's condemned to live in a cataleptic state her whole life.

And, thanks to the machine the Jack Pack improved, he's able to do it, although for some reason none of them can use the machine to help themselves, or design a machine that would do so. And since their problems can't be solved in 45 minutes, they make no effort to solve them.

Then Sarina comes out of her state, and she can talk, but Jack makes fun of her, so they start singing. I can appreciate that the song sequence was a lot of work to put together, but I just wasn't into it, probably because I don't really like the Jack Pack much.

When we see that some level of neurosomethings is high, I guess that Sarina's going to go "Flowers for Algernon." That turns out to be wrong.

Bashir falls in love with her. She's incapable of reciprocating, and since it's the fifth act and she's not a recurring character, the solution is for her to move far, far away. When she asks Bashir if he'll remember her, I half expect him to say, "Nah. I've only got a few more months here, then I'm going to try to get movie work."

The quality seems to have dipped a bit.

 

[Sindatur]

Yea, neither one of those really did much for me. Take Me out to The Holosuite has a few funny parts, but, overall, nothing special about. And yea, the Augments didn't really need a followup episode, too much of a mediocre thing, the first episode was alright, but, no reason to revisit them, IMHO.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

I hated "Chrysalis."

"Take Me Out to the Holosuite," however, had me laughing so hard I cried. ("DEATH TO THE OPPOSITION!" ) But then again, I've never exactly held the Vulcans in such high regard, so seeing this kind of asinine behavior on display just reinforces the hypocrisy so many of them are known for.

As for why a Vulcan's badmouthing would be "tolerated," at least in my mind, what we see in ENT explains it to some degree.

 

[Shatnertage]

^ Yeah, Worf was the other funny thing about "Holosuite."

 

[You_Will_Fail]

That's one of my favorites, I loved the chemistry and dialogue between Worf and Jadzia and when I was watching season 6 I knew Jadzia was going to die at some point but not when! So I was kinda shitting my pants during the episode along with that one where she's injured when the Jem Hadar ship crashes too.

 

[apenpaap]

Take me Out to the Holosuite is one of DS9's best comedic episodes, IMO. I would rank only The House of Quark and The Magnificent Ferengi above it myself.

 

[Shatnertage]

Personally, I'd put House of Quark at the top of the list, followed by the one where Lwaxana made everyone have the hots for each other, and probably some other ones that I can't remember right now. Oh yeah--the one where Jake and Nog get the Willie Mays card! Big lulz at cellular entertainment.

 

[BlueStuff]

Of course you would say that, you soulless minion of orthodoxy.

 

[apenpaap]

Ah, yeah, Fascination and In the Cards are good too. But, imo, nowhere near the level of hilarity that House of Quark, The Magnificent Ferengi, and Take me out to the Holosuite are. Badda-Bing, Badda-Bang near the end of this season is another of my comedic favourites, probably at number four or five for me.

 

[You_Will_Fail]

The Ferengi episodes always brought the laughs for me, loved "Bar Association" and "The Magnificient Ferengi". "Our Man Bashir", "Badda Bing..." were great too, didn't like "In the Cards".

 

[DS9 Gal AZ]

One bit I really did like in "Take Me Out to the Holosuite," was when Nog didn't know what to do about the Vulcan who ran off the field or whatever, and Worf shouts "Find him and kill him!"

Oh Worf. Don't ever change.

 

[boco]

Admiral Shran sends you a warm hello

 

[Shatnertage]

Hi Admiral Shran! Wherever you are.

Of all the posts I've encountered in my travels, his were the most...Andorian.

That brings me to my latest episode...

"Treachery, Faith, and the Great River"

At last! One that I really liked. Both the A and B stories click here, even though the B story is a rehash of the previous two times Nog was horsetrading to get a specific item, which was itself a rehash of a MASH episode, which was in turn a rehash of Milo Minderbender. But it was fun, particularly the Martok bits. And the desk.

The Odo/Weyoun story was also great, with one big continuity issue (Odo shouldn't need oxygen or heat to survive). But the interplay between Odo and both Weyouns and Drunk Damar was brilliant. The Female Changeling is sick...I've got a general idea where this is going.

So good stuff all around.

 

[DS9 Gal AZ]

Poor Weyoun. *sniff sniff* Never thought I'd feel that way but man. Jeffrey Combs did such a great job playing both versions of our favorite Vorta.

 

[Thor Damar]

^ That time I don't Damar was drunk.

I honestly love this episode, there was some great characterization from both weyouns and Damar was a surly delight as per usual at this point. (of course there's no surprise whom my favorite character in this little tale is). Also a wonderful continuity nod

Spoiler: regarding a small plot point

(the executed Gul that Odo was supposed to meet was the same contact that he spoke to in Improbable Cause)

And then there is this wonderful line.

"Of course I'm paranoid, everyone's trying to kill me!"

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

Also a wonderful continuity nod

Spoiler: regarding a small plot point

(the executed Gul that Odo was supposed to meet was the same contact that he spoke to in Improbable Cause)

That's actually just speculation on Memory Alpha, though very plausible. And admittedly I did make that assumption for my fanfic...but it's just an assumption.