Seven and Icheb

[borgboy]

Yes, I'm going there lol.
I found, like many Seven's relationship with Chakotay to be forced.
I think the Doctor would have made an interesting choice, at least his feelings for her had been well developed over time.
But I also think that Icheb could make an interesting romantic partner for her. I have no idea how old the actor was, but I bet he was over 18.
We know next to nothing about his race. He could well have been old enough to engage in a relationship. They share a common background as former Borg, and have similar lifestyle and intrests. They obviously care about each other very much. Despite the age difference given Seven's arrested development sexually they are at similar places in their lives, both inexperienced. The age difference doesn't bother me, I find it more interesting. Surely we've seen Kirk with women at least as much younger than he is. It's hypoctrical to object much more strongly to a younger man/older woman than older man/younger woman.
While watching Human Error Icheb tells Seven he is reading Oedipus Rex, a story about a man who married his mother. Considering Seven has a maternal bond with Icheb I wonder if Icheb was trying to hint something. Surely whoever wrote that was hinting at something since the comment didn't serve any other real purpose.

 

[Picard Alpha]

While watching Human Error Icheb tells Seven he is reading Oedipus Rex, a story about a man who married his mother. Considering Seven has a maternal bond with Icheb I wonder if Icheb was trying to hint something. Surely whoever wrote that was hinting at something since the comment didn't serve any other real purpose.

The doctor was used as a 'fatherly' figure to Seven, and that relationship seamed to be passed down from Seven to Icheb as 'Motherly.' To be honest, I never understood why they tried to force Seven into a relationship/dating mold. Her character for the most part was stern and cold, and not like someone you would expect to show affection for others. Her time with the Borg required a lot of healing on the inside before she could ever truly care for someone else. You've gotta love yourself before you can love others... Well who knows Love is funny like that. Just my opinion…

 

[kimc]

To be honest, I never understood why they tried to force Seven into a relationship/dating mold. Her character for the most part was stern and cold, and not like someone you would expect to show affection for others. Her time with the Borg required a lot of healing on the inside before she could ever truly care for someone else. You've gotta love yourself before you can love others... Well who knows Love is funny like that. Just my opinion…

Personally I believe the writers were trying to please their target demographic by showing Seven "as you always wanted to see her" - at least according to ads at the time for "Human Error".

You're right though - there was no reason to rush it - she had some growing and healing to do and there's nothing wrong with that considering everything she had been through.

 

[Captain Proton]

I like the idea but I think Icheb was supposed to be a lot younger, around senior year in highschool or younger...Remember in the "haunting of deck 12" when Neelix was telling bedtime stories he was just as captive as the other little Borgs whereas Seven would have not listened to that foolishness at all and he also took part in the science fair another youthfull activity and lastly he befriended Q2 who seemed about the same age and maturity level although Icheb did act more mature than Q2.
Besides all that he lived with his parents which surely would have cramped Seven's style.
Anything would have been better than her and Chakotay though even Kim.

 

[borgboy]

I agree nearly anyone would have been better than Chakotay, their chemistry was so flat. Chakotay could be reallyhot and occasionally intense in his non-relationship with Janeway. It was a big let down to not at least leave things open between J/C in favor of a forced pairing between Chakotay and Seven. Funny that the Doctor's role with Seven is described as fatherly by Picard Alpha, since the Doctor is clearly in love with her.
Icheb does act childish at times, but then his childhood was stolen from him, so sometimes he acts more immature. I see more chemistry and a realistic relationship potential between Seven and Icheb than any of the more allegedly appropriate partners available to her.
Q2 was another cutie. I'd have liked to see their friendship go to the next level too

 

[Guy Gardener]

The episode where he "effectively" admits that he's in love with Seven is called Imperfection. He loves her so much he rips out part of his brain and gives it to her even though his gift will guarantee that it will be impossible for her to return Icheb's feelings and his own will swell a hundred times larger.

I love the Graduate. And apparently he was force maturated by the Borg so his appearance is much more aged than it should be, although the Borg seem to do to peoples brains what they do to bodies... But this aspect was lost in the shuffle like every other aspect that seemed inconvenient to the construction of later stories.

I really don't see Seven of Nine as a sexual being and its ludicrous to force her into relationships nothing beforehand says she would be the slightest bit interested in. Although Seven rebuking and spurning Ichebs affection would be dazzling to observe.

 

[Captain Proton]

Q2 was another cutie. I'd have liked to see their friendship go to the next level too

Q2 fancied Seven so I don't think Icheb is his type.

 

[borgboy]

Q2 is a Q. Limiting his sexuality to one gender seems pretty restrictive for a Q. Besides, I reserve the right to ship and slash randomly and erraticly.

 

[Timewalker]

Seven and Icheb can never be more than mentor/student. Okay, they're also friends... but no more than that.

Besides, Icheb is every bit as uncertain about stuff like dating as Seven -- remember how confused and uncomfortable he was when he thought B'Elanna was attracted to him?

 

[borgboy]

Icheb is still adjusting to his individuality, in time he probably will want to date somebody.
B'Elanna was a married woman that he didn't know all that well, while Seven is the person he is closest to.

 

[Katrine]

Just due to the fact that they were both emotionally immature would make them a terrible couple. Mass confusion on both parts. To me, it seemed as tho Icheb was around 16 or so, not "at least 18". He was tall, but he puts me in mind of one of my teenages sons.
I think that if there could not be a pairing b/t Chuckles & Katherine, then they should have left both Chuckles & Seven single. He was more Janeway's contemporary then Seven's. I was always left with the feeling that it was a brain fart on the writer's part's.

 

[Guy Gardener]

But we all got that vibe during Shattered that Old Icheb and Old Naomi were quite into each other?

 

[borgboy]

I got the impression that TPTB wanted us to think Icheb and Naomi were into each other. I thought Icheb wanted to go on a picnic with Chakotay.

 

[Guy Gardener]

If it was cradle robbing to date Seven, then his relationship with Icheb could be nothing less than egg harvesting.

I just wanted one of them to say "I outrank Harry."

 

[Timewalker]

But realistically, who else but Naomi was anywhere near the appropriate age group for Icheb? (and vice-versa). After Masati and the boys left the ship, the only other children were Miral and the Borg baby.

Honestly, one of the first things they should have done in the Delta Quadrant was set up a nursery and daycare... and told the crew that if they wanted to marry/have children, they had the Captain's blessing to do so. Otherwise, they would all die of old age and the ship would never get home.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Really? the way Sam marched into Janeways office to tell her that she's preggers... It seemed like she was taking a no shit attitude because there was a fair chance that the captain would order her to have an abortion.

 

[Timewalker]

Some captains probably would have ordered her to terminate her pregnancy -- Ransom, for example. But realistically -- the youngest crewmember was still over the age of 20, and they were facing a 70-year trip. Even with the slightly longer lifespan people enjoy in the 24th century, I don't see how they could have expected not to need a second generation -- even a third -- to do it.

 

[Guy Gardener]

And Chakotay agreed with you.

I did a story once where the first thing Kathy did was that she cloned her crew and sealed the originals in the bulkheads like in the cask of Amontillado, which explained why she was such a bitch and the doctor was dosing them with birth control in their food.

 

[kimc]

And Chakotay agreed with you.

I did a story once where the first thing Kathy did was that she cloned her crew and sealed the originals in the bulkheads like in the cask of Amontillado, which explained why she was such a bitch and the doctor was dosing them with birth control in their food.

Wow! You REALLY don't like Janeway, do you?

 

[Guy Gardener]

I like her plenty. Just like people like Hannibal Lecter. I like her as a monster doing monstrous things. Although I do find it irritating how she's painted as a saint when it's just amazing as she's the exact opposite nearly every episode before the reset button takes hold.

Eddie Murphy asked some similar questions about Casper the Friendly Ghost. You ever notice how it doesn't matter how many friends Casper makes, that at the beginning of the next weeks cartoon, he's moping and friendless again? Eddie was hinting that Casper was into weird kinky whacked out shit which made regular people run a mile if Casper wasn't eating them outright... Personally I think maybe he had memory issues like Guy Pierce in Momento or Jonathan Archer in Twilight.

O!

She put them in stasis and then sealed them in the bulkheads so that the 70 year journey would seem instantaneous when they were woken up as they approached earthspace. You didn't think that I meant that she was just torturing them for the hell of it?