News Seth MacFarlane’s The Orville

[Mudd]

Entertainment as such obviously isn't the only business that makes such decisions based on short-term - one might suggest "short-sighted" - metrics that aren't easily intuited by the outsider.

In the late 90s I was doing contract work for MCI directed toward setting up an online marketplace for recorded music sales. They were right on the cutting edge, there, and if they'd continued with the effort who knows how much they could have made?

They killed the project in one meeting, one afternoon, because there was competition for the budgeted money - building a cellular tower somewhere in Africa which promised a tiny bit higher return on investment over the following five years. They did not have infinite money for these things, and so something had to be sacrificed.

 

[137th Gebirg]

DS9's Rules of Engagement

Took me a while to remember what that one was about. After looking through Memory Alpha it started coming back to me. Yes, there were children aboard the transport which appeared quickly in the middle of a pitched battle between Worf on the Defiant and other Klingon vessels, and got accidentally destroyed in the melee. The episode does effectively describe the high cost of war, but there is a fundamental difference - there was no pause to ascertain the existence of the civilian vessel and make a conscious and careful decision to work around it, by either side. Either it all happened to quickly or both sides were being too careless and it happened, with the full implications about what exactly occurred not being evaluated until long after the incident in question. So yes, DS9 did broach the subject - tangentially - but not directly like Orville just did. This is also why I loved DS9 so much. They weren't shy about asking those kinds of serious questions, particularly about things that happen in wartime. Anyone who hated the show because it was "all about a kewl ptew-ptew war" clearly weren't paying attention. Same with B5.

"It's instinctive. But the instinct can be fought. We're human beings with the blood of a million savage years on our hands, but we can stop it. We can admit that we're killers, but we're not going to kill today. That's all it takes. Knowing that we won't kill today."
- Kirk, A Taste of Armageddon

In Orville, Mercer had a plan - stopped - examined the consequences of his actions before continuing the plan - and then coming up with an alternative plan to accomplish the same strategic goal while still successfully preserving innocent lives, deciding that he wouldn't kill today. All while under pressure, behind enemy lines, as if in a kinetic war footing. Even though he was never "anyone's first choice" to sit in the center seat of a starship, I daresay the Union (which seems to be full of just as many smarmy-arrogant shits as the Federation in its perceived elitist superiority in the galaxy, the more we see them) could use a LOT more captains like him making the hard decisions.

 

[KirkusOveractus]

Entertainment as such obviously isn't the only business that makes such decisions based on short-term - one might suggest "short-sighted" - metrics that aren't easily intuited by the outsider.

In the late 90s I was doing contract work for MCI directed toward setting up an online marketplace for recorded music sales. They were right on the cutting edge, there, and if they'd continued with the effort who knows how much they could have made?

They killed the project in one meeting, one afternoon, because there was competition for the budgeted money - building a cellular tower somewhere in Africa which promised a tiny bit higher return on investment over the following five years. They did not have infinite money for these things, and so something had to be sacrificed.

MCI. Weren't they the ones who led the breaking of AT&T's monopoly? I think it's part of Verizon now, correct? Amazing how fate can turn on a dime. I guess deciding on the online music for them was more of an unknown risk.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Took me a while to remember what that one was about. After looking through Memory Alpha it started coming back to me. Yes, there were children aboard the transport which appeared quickly in the middle of a pitched battle between Worf on the Defiant and other Klingon vessels, and got accidentally destroyed in the melee. The episode does effectively describe the high cost of war, but there is a fundamental difference - there was no pause to ascertain the existence of the civilian vessel and make a conscious and careful decision to work around it, by either side. Either it all happened to quickly or both sides were being too careless and it happened, with the full implications about what exactly occurred not being evaluated until long after the incident in question. So yes, DS9 did broach the subject - tangentially - but not directly like Orville just did. This is also why I loved DS9 so much. They weren't shy about asking those kinds of serious questions, particularly about things that happen in wartime. Anyone who hated the show because it was "all about a kewl ptew-ptew war" clearly weren't paying attention. Same with B5.

"It's instinctive. But the instinct can be fought. We're human beings with the blood of a million savage years on our hands, but we can stop it. We can admit that we're killers, but we're not going to kill today. That's all it takes. Knowing that we won't kill today."
- Kirk, A Taste of Armageddon

In Orville, Mercer had a plan - stopped - examined the consequences of his actions before continuing the plan - and then coming up with an alternative plan to accomplish the same strategic goal while still successfully preserving innocent lives, deciding that he wouldn't kill today. All while under pressure, behind enemy lines, as if in a kinetic war footing. Even though he was never "anyone's first choice" to sit in the center seat of a starship, I daresay the Union (which seems to be full of just as many smarmy-arrogant shits as the Federation in its perceived elitist superiority in the galaxy, the more we see them) could use a LOT more captains like him making the hard decisions.

No, it's not a perfect correspondence, and if it were, it would be called plagiarism. The episode did suggest something about Federation values that might not otherwise be broached by other series. However, the dilemma of "Krill" seems closer to the strategic problem of families on the D that many fans crow about.

 

[Mudd]

MCI. Weren't they the ones who led the breaking of AT&T's monopoly? I think it's part of Verizon now, correct? Amazing how fate can turn on a dime. I guess deciding on the online music for them was more of an unknown risk.

Aren't they Sprint? I honestly don't remember.

And yeah, they didn't have the online store thing worked out. I think you had to go through their catalogue on the website and then pay using your phone. As I say, it was early days.


ETA: Looked it up, it is Verizon.

 

[KirkusOveractus]

Aren't they Sprint? I honestly don't remember.

And yeah, they didn't have the online store thing worked out. I think you had to go through their catalogue on the website and then pay using your phone. As I say, it was early days.


ETA: Looked it up, it is Verizon.

I couldn't remember if it was Sprint or Verizon, either. Little bit of trivia from my other passion, railroads: do you know what Sprint stands for?

 

[Mudd]

No, what does it mean?

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I'm still kind of mind-blown over "Krill". NOT ONCE in the history of Trek, with all its many hundreds of episodes and movies, has a single character, main or supporting, ever considered there might be children on enemy vessels that they were about to destroy. Not only did they consider it in Orville, but went out of their way to prevent the deaths of innocents. Add to that the bonus of consequence, where the Krill female officer warned Mercer that he made enemies of the children that day, despite his noble efforts to save them. No pathetic reset button here that the cowardly and lazy Trek writers so frequently pressed.

There were even Borgified children shown one time on one of the cubes in TNG, but not a single consideration to their existence before potentially blowing them up with other cubes seen throughout TNG and VOY. Sure, the SF crews were threatened and had to fight back, nor would they have had the opportunity to mount a rescue mission every time they came across one, but never one mention of "Y'know there may be kids on that ship" in all the episodes that featured them? Weren't there also kids seen on some of the Suliban ships during Enterprise? I think so...

Yeah, the sets are kind of wonky and hearken a nostalgia for 90's kitsch, as you mentioned, but the writing in many ways is quite superior to most of those 90's shows, particularly TNG and VOY, and the CG production values are surprisingly high, IMO.

Even all the while there were families and children on the Ent-D, which I thought there being children on the Krill ship might be an allusion to.

 

[Cake]

The ratings of the last episode went up a lot!

episode --- live + SD --- live + 3 --- live + 7
1 --- 2.71 / 8.558 mio ---- 3.5 / 11.3 mio ------------------------------- after 35 days: 3.9 / 14.5 million
2 --- 2.17 / 6.631 mio ---- 2.8 / 8.415 mio --- 3.1 / 9.054 mio
3 --- 1.10 / 4.053 mio
4 --- 1.05 / 3.698 mio -------------- ? ------------- 2.1 / 6.811 mio
5 --- 0.91 / 3.431 mio -------------- ? ------------- 2.1 / 6.786 mio
6 --- 0.99 / 3.371 mio ---- 1.9 / ? mio ---------- 2.1 / 6.692 mio
7 --- 1.21 / 4.181 mio

And here is the most recent renew/cancel index. Looks good so far.

 

[RJDiogenes]

That's encouraging.

 

[137th Gebirg]

It is! You don't often see up-trends in genre shows like this, to my recollection. Very encouraging indeed!

 

[BillJ]

1.10 - "Firestorm"

When a fire breaks out on the spaceship and a crew member dies, Alara begins to question if she is fit for her job, just as unusual and terrifying things start happening on the ship.

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/orville/s01/e10

 

[137th Gebirg]

Sounds like a good one.

 

[BillJ]

Can't wait for the inevitable cries from Trek fans about The Orville ripping off "Disaster"!

 

[Trekker4747]

Any episode focusing on Alara is good with me!

 

[safarial]

In the original Galactica, they had "Fire in Space"

 

[137th Gebirg]

^^^ Was thinking about that one too. Hopefully Orville will get the science a little better than BSG did.

 

[B.J.]

I love both ORV and DSC, but this should ruffle some feathers! (Made it myself)

 

[KennyB]

UK premiere date is Dec 14th.........

 

[Jedi_Master]

Any episode focusing on Alara is good with me!

I agree. She is growing on me...and appears to be one of the most well-rounded characters on the show.