Romance and DS9

[mlbach]

Well, we'll always have A Stitch In Time....

 

[Discofan]

... Well, if that gets you hot, I'm not one to judge...

There's no need to get personal.

And just to be clear, by that I mean "don't".

 

[Discofan]

Peter Allan Fields, nor any other writer, conceived of or pushed for Garak to be gay. Andrew Robinson, who was responsible for Garak's behavior in Past Prologue, did not think of Garak as gay. He chose to perform Garak as a hedonist (or omnisexual, as he now says) who uses sexuality to get what he wants from people. It was fans who saw how Garak came on to Bashir and hoped it would lead to a relationship. From my perspective, I'm glad they did not. There were moments in which they gave a wink and a nod to the notion that Bashir might be bisexual, and perhaps they should have developed such a story. Garak, as someone who was both morally compromised and homosexual, would have been par for the course for 90s television, not revolutionary.

An untoward juxtaposition...

 

[Bad Thoughts]

An untoward juxtaposition...

Unfortunately, I don't think it would have been as great as people think. Garak would no doubt be witty, but I don't think he could constantly undermine the notion of truth. Perhaps more importantly, I don't see Bashir embracing someone who twice tried to kill off the Founders and tortured Odo.

 

[Kate Nichols]

I've observed that heterosexual men often have the most difficult time dealing with gay relationships depicted on the screen. But, not always. A few years ago and it was a few years ago, as there were video stores in existence at the time. One day every week, my husband and I would go and fetch a movie and order pizza and have wine(for me) and beer(for him). We took turns selecting our film of the week and on this particular week, it was my turn. I wanted to see Broback Mountain. I was preparing some appetizers and asked him to go alone to the video store. When I named the film that I wanted him to rent, he gave me a look and so I said: Okay, I know you'll be embarrassed to get it so I told him to rent "Good Night and Good Luck," instead, another movie that I wanted to see at the time about the television reporter, Murrow. He went and came back with the movie. I was just finishing our dinner preparations. I asked him what movie did he get and he said: Good Night and Good Luck. I said great and we sat down with food, drinks and I pushed the button to start the movie. It was Broback Mountain.

 

[Discofan]

I've observed that heterosexual men often have the most difficult time dealing with gay relationships depicted on the screen. But, not always. A few years ago and it was a few years ago, as there were video stores in existence at the time. One day every week, my husband and I would go and fetch a movie and order pizza and have wine(for me) and beer(for him). We took turns selecting our film of the week and on this particular week, it was my turn. I wanted to see Broback Mountain. I was preparing some appetizers and asked him to go alone to the video store. When I named the film that I wanted him to rent, he gave me a look and so I said: Okay, I know you'll be embarrassed to get it so I told him to rent "Good Night and Good Luck," instead, another movie that I wanted to see at the time about the television reporter, Murrow. He went and came back with the movie. I was just finishing our dinner preparations. I asked him what movie did he get and he said: Good Night and Good Luck. I said great and we sat down with food, drinks and I pushed the button to start the movie. It was Broback Mountain.

I confirm that heterosexual males don't like to be thought gay. To me, it's a remnant from childhood when being called "gay" was about the worst insult that could be thrown at someone. I've punched a few faces in my time for that. In fact, I often did some insane things (back in my early teens) just so people wouldn't think me a coward (which was then associated with being gay). I've long overcome that and have no problem with that anymore. But I still get angry when some idiot thinks he can insist on thinking me (out loud) gay even after I've told him that I wasn't and I soon prove to him that he's not man enough for that kind of exercise.

 

[mlbach]

I confirm that heterosexual males don't like to be thought gay. To me, it's a remnant from childhood when being called "gay" was about the worst insult that could be thrown at someone. I've punched a few faces in my time for that. In fact, I often did some insane things (back in my early teens) just so people wouldn't think me a coward (which was then associated with being gay). I've long overcome that and have no problem with that anymore. But I still get angry when some idiot thinks he can insist on thinking me (out loud) gay even after I've told him that I wasn't and I soon prove to him that he's not man enough for that kind of exercise.

ALMOST the worst insult... But not as bad as being called "a woman."

 

[eschaton]

IMHO, I never saw the Garak/Bashir romance. I mean, Garak was clearly into Julian, but Sid played the role as if he was completely and totally oblivious to what was happening.

 

[Discofan]

IMHO, I never saw the Garak/Bashir romance. I mean, Garak was clearly into Julian, but Sid played the role as if he was completely and totally oblivious to what was happening.

I agree. There was some kind of naivete about Bashir in the beginning. He becomes more devious as he grows old, especially toward the end when he manages to trap Sloan of section 31.

 

[kkt]

I agree. There was some kind of naivete about Bashir in the beginning. He becomes more devious as he grows old, especially toward the end when he manages to trap Sloan of section 31.

Garak taught him well.

 

[Tosk]

I confirm that heterosexual males don't like to be thought gay.

Some of them, just as some couldn't care less. Speaking for myself, the time I got asked out by a dude was actually one of the more flattering things I've ever had happen to me.

 

[mlbach]

To quote Warren on Buffy, "You know what homophobia really says about a person..."

 

[Discofan]

Some of them, just as some couldn't care less. Speaking for myself, the time I got asked out by a dude was actually one of the more flattering things I've ever had happen to me.

I am not bothered by that. For one thing, most gay dudes don't think there is anything laughable to being gay. What bothers me is people of indeterminate sexuality (whether they are straight or closeted gay) that think it's funny to assume that you are gay for some reason and insisting on it. It could be total strangers that saw you rent Brokeback Mountain for example or anything else that THEY think does not befit a straight person. I am not the kind to let people I don't know behave around me like there is something ridiculous about me and get away with it, IOW you do the crime, get prepared to do the time as well. And as I admit it's a remnant of when I was a kid and being called gay was about the worst insult that you could imagine. As for gay dudes being attracted to me, I have no feeling about it one way or the other. I have old friends that are gay and never asked me out. I don't know if it's because they aren't attracted to me or think I am too much of a straight guy or some other reason and I am not really curious about it. I've also been asked out politely and not insistingly and in that case, I respond likewise in a polite and friendly manner that I am not interested. I guess it's mostly a matter of mutual respect.

 

[Tosk]

Eh, if a total stranger wants to think I'm gay so be it. It changes nothing for me. Maybe I am gay and they're just way more perceptive than I am?

 

[Discofan]

Eh, if a total stranger wants to think I'm gay so be it. It changes nothing for me. Maybe I am gay and they're just way more perceptive than I am?

Well, I've been attracted to gay women and never knew it until they (or some other person) told me so or perhaps I am too perceptive and deep down they are straight and attracted to me. They just don't know it yet.

However, life is too short to spend too much time on lost causes and in a case like that I move on.