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Roddenberry Vault - Running Times

DeepSpaceYorks

DeepSpaceYorks

Commander
Red Shirt
 
Just got the set on Friday and watched it over the weekend, and while it's a nice set, I must also say that I'm somewhat disappointed in the presentation of the newly-uncovered footage. I though the inclusion of the 12 episodes meant that they had an option to watch the episodes with the deleted scenes and alternate angles edited into them. But no, they are actually just the plain episodes. Having the new documentaries spread over all three discs is also a weird choice. I would have wished that there was a section on one of the discs that neatly collects all the deleted material. But no, it's all spread over the documentaries.

Don't get me wrong, it's nice to have something like this at all, but again, the presentation leaves a lot to be desired.
 
So how much actual deleted material is there? Was there even enough to make "extended editions" anyway?
What were some of the more interesting deleted footage?
Thanks for any info!
 
I was just going thru TNG season 7 and I loved how they presented the cut footage for the deleted scenes. A text explaining what and where the footage went and then a framing portion for each clip using the existing material for placement context. Doesn't look like they used that model for the Vault footage.
I seriously don't think any episode had enough footage had to make even one extended edition.
 
Grant said:
So how much actual deleted material is there?
Click to expand...
That's hard to tell, considering the way it is presented, i.e. spread over six (!) features on three seperate discs. And yes, I do think it would have been possible to make “extended editions” of some of the episodes, incorporating deleted footage or alternate angles. What's the point of having the episodes on there if you don't connect them to the uncovered material? At the very least I expected a separate “Deleted Scenes” section for each episode, but alas …

Grant said:
I was just going thru TNG season 7 and I loved how they presented the cut footage for the deleted scenes. A text explaining what and where the footage went and then a framing portion for each clip using the existing material for placement context. Doesn't look like they used that model for the Vault footage.
Click to expand...
No, sadly they didn't. Come to think of it, the way they presented the footage – with overlaying text like “omitted dialog” superimposed over the footage – is really weird.
 
Thanks for that info.

Surprised to hear that there may have been enough cut footage from any given episode to create an extended version.
Could you give any examples of significant cut footage from any particular episodes that were compelling?
Thanks again.
 
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M said:
Just got the set on Friday and watched it over the weekend, and while it's a nice set, I must also say that I'm somewhat disappointed in the presentation of the newly-uncovered footage. I though the inclusion of the 12 episodes meant that they had an option to watch the episodes with the deleted scenes and alternate angles edited into them. But no, they are actually just the plain episodes. Having the new documentaries spread over all three discs is also a weird choice. I would have wished that there was a section on one of the discs that neatly collects all the deleted material. But no, it's all spread over the documentaries.

Don't get me wrong, it's nice to have something like this at all, but again, the presentation leaves a lot to be desired.
Click to expand...

Are the 12 episodes the remastered versions or the ones with the original effects?
 
Both are included.

I've seen comments from several people in Europe who have the set andnot one has given an example of a significant deleted scene featured.
It's like the Manhattan Project.
Just vague comments. LOL.
 
Grant said:
Both are included.

I've seen comments from several people in Europe who have the set andnot one has given an example of a significant deleted scene featured.
It's like the Manhattan Project.
Just vague comments. LOL.
Click to expand...

Cool. Thanks!

Are the original effects cleaned up? Just wondering because from the previews it looks like the found some of the original effects elements, at least for the doc on the VFX.
 
Very much doubt theycleaned up the original FX.
Pretty sure they would be promoting something as cool as that. And the folks who already have it have not mentioned anything.
But they've been as tight lipped as an Adebaran Shellmouth
 
Grant said:
Very much doubt theycleaned up the original FX.
Pretty sure they would be promoting something as cool as that. And the folks who already have it have not mentioned anything.
But they've been as tight lipped as an Adebaran Shellmouth
Click to expand...

Ah too bad then. If they found the original elements in the Roddenberry "vaults", would be nice to have an updated remastered that replaced those effects. TBH, the remastered effects are pretty crappy CGI and already look outdated.
 
M said:
That's hard to tell, considering the way it is presented, i.e. spread over six (!) features on three seperate discs. And yes, I do think it would have been possible to make “extended editions” of some of the episodes, incorporating deleted footage or alternate angles. What's the point of having the episodes on there if you don't connect them to the uncovered material? At the very least I expected a separate “Deleted Scenes” section for each episode, but alas …
Click to expand...

They had to justify bloating it up to 3 discs and charging $50+. Put all of the new content on one disc in one documentary and people will realize too easily that it's a rip-off.
 
There are over 100 hours of found footage which is significantly more that the entire TOS series. I personally would be happy with only the footage; I don't really need to hear "Mohawk Guys" or most others comments because I don't really care. I AM interested in hearing if Shatner has any new insights that have not been documented before but I'm sure it will be the same stories we've heard dozens of times before.

I am looking forward to seeing ANY new footage so that will be interesting and something to look forward to.
 
Is should have been a bonus disc. on the 50th set -- but they were NEVER going to sell this as a documentary only.
But when they decided to put it out as separate release -- we ended up getting the 3 new commentaries, the 11 isolated scores and the 12 episodes with better picture and less DNR. For some people that is worth the $43 the price fell to at Amazon on cyber Monday.
 
Grant said:
I've seen comments from several people in Europe who have the set andnot one has given an example of a significant deleted scene featured.
Click to expand...
Here's a complete breakdown of all the new footage included in the set. I hope that helps …

Deleted/extended scenes
Season 1
  • “The Corbomite Maneuver” – deleted scene of Sulu talking about oriental villiains in old movies
  • “Arena” – omitted dialog by Kirk and Spock talking down on Cestus III
  • “Arena” – omitted dialog by Kirk to the Gorn commander
  • “Space Seed” – deleted scene of Khan getting in and out of bed before McCoy enters the room
  • “Space Seed” – deleted scene of Marla and Khan in the transporter room
  • “Space Seed” – deleted scene of Khan holding the crew hostage and McCoy being stunned
  • “The Conscience of the King” – extended scene of Lenore and Kirk on the observation deck
  • “The Conscience of the King” – short scene of Kirk talking to Martha
  • “Tomorrow is Yesterday” – omitted dialog in the scene where Kirk is being interrogated
  • “Tomorrow is Yesterday” – some omitted dialog of the security guard to McCoy
  • “Return of the Archons” – some omitted dialog of Kirk talking to Reger about Landru
  • “A Taste of Armageddon” – nice little deleted scene of Scotty talking to McCoy on the bridge
  • “This Side of Paradise” – deleted scene showing Kirk getting the club with which he attacks Spock
  • “This Side of Paradise” – omitted dialog of Spock talking about the spores' origin
  • “This Side of Paradise” – deleted scene of McCoy, Spock and Leila talking about Kirk's resistance to the spores
  • “Devil in the Dark” – deleted scene of Kirk and Spock wondering about the tunnels
  • “Devil in the Dark” – deleted scene of Kirk and Spock finding another tunnel
  • “Errand of Mercy” – short deleted scene of the Organians talking amoung themselves about the situation
  • “City on the Edge of Forever” – McCoy doesn't know what a Clark Gable movie is
  • “City on the Edge of Forever” – McCoy telling Edith she's got “the biggest eyes I have ever seen”
  • “City on the Edge of Forever” – extended kissing scene with Kirk and Edith
  • “City on the Edge of Forever” – short snippet of omitted dialog from Edith in a scene with her and Kirk
  • “City on the Edge of Forever” – deleted footage of Edith being hit by the car
  • “City on the Edge of Forever” – long deleted scene of Edith and Kirk talking on the stairs, professing their love for one another
  • “Operation: Annihilate” – deleted scene of Spock calling the Enterprise from the planet (standing in front of the red tiled wall)
  • “Operation: Annihilate” – deleted scene of Spock calling the Enterprise from the planet (after scanning the alien organisms)
  • “Operation: Annihilate” – that deleted scene of Peter Kirk sitting in the Captain's Chair in a Starfleet uniform; ending with Kirk telling Scotty that he hopes Peter won't enter Starfleet
Season 2
  • “Who Mourns for Adonais?” – partial deleted scene of Spock being told by McCoy that Carolyn Palamas is pregnant with Apollo's child
  • “Metamorphosis” – deleted scene of Sulu, Scotty and Uhura on the bridge, searching for the others
  • “Metamorphosis” – deleted scene of Hedford insinuating that Kirk made a navigational error
  • “Metamorphosis” – omitted dialog of Hedford in a scene with McCoy and Kirk in the shuttle
  • “Mirror, Mirror” – short deleted scene of Mirror Sulu talking to Mirror Chekov on the bridge
  • “The Trouble with Tribbles” – omitted dialog of the scene where Jones first presents the tribbles
  • “Wolf in the Fold” – some omitted dialog from the scene with Kirk, McCoy and Scotty in the café
  • “The Changeling” – omitted dialog of Uhura explaining music to Nomad
  • “I, Mudd” – omitted dialog of Mudd talking about the androids' long lifespan
  • “Return to Tomorrow” – funny little scene with omitted dialog of McCoy talking to the shells housing Kirk, Spock and Mulhall
  • “Return to Tomorrow” – deleted scenes of Chapel and Spock talking about the experience of sharing one consciousness and Kirk and Spock talking about Sargon's fate
  • “Return to Tomorrow” – a lot of omitted dialog from the conference room scene
  • “Return to Tomorrow” – rather long deleted scene of Spock mind-melding with the Sargon shell (no audio)
Season 3
  • “Elaan of Troyius” – deleted scene of Uhura talking to Spock about music in the recreation room
  • “The Paradise Syndrome” – omitted dialog of a scene with Kirok and Miramanee
  • “The Paradise Syndrome” – deleted scene with Kirk, Spock and McCoy; Kirk wonders how long it's been since he's seen flowers
  • “And the Children Shall Lead” – short deleted scenes of one of the children's chants
  • “Requiem for Methuselah” – omitted dialog of a scene with Spock and an offscreen Kirk

Alternate takes/angles
Season 1
  • “The Conscience of the King” – alternate scene of Uhura singing “Beyond Antares”
  • “Space Seed” – alternate angle on Khan during the dinner scene
  • “This Side of Paradise” – alternate angle on Spock talking about McCoy's Mint Julep
  • “This Side of Paradise” – alternate take of Leila talking to Spock in the Enterprise transporter room
Season 2
  • “The Doomsday Machine” – alternate take of Decker talking about how his crew died
  • “The Trouble with Tribbles” – alternate take of Kirk ordering the tribbles be taken off the bridge
  • “The Trouble with Tribbles” – alternate take of Cyrano Jones tyring to sell glow water
  • “A Private Little War” – alternate scene of Kirk and McCoy analysing the situation

Behind-the-scenes footage/bloopers
Season 1
  • “The Cage” – footage of the crew beaming down before the transporter effect is added
  • “The Corbomite Maneuver” – several slates before filming a scene; temp footage of the Enterprise model with Balok's cube; Leonard Nimoy messing up a technobabble-heavy scene
  • “The Menagerie” – disfigured Pike's makeup being freshened up
  • “The Squire of Gothos” – Shatner messes up the scene after Trelane fires his pistol
  • “The Squire of Gothos” – Shatner forgets his line when he introduces his crewmen to Trelane
  • “Space Seed” – several slates befor filming and Ricardo Montalban preparing to film a close-up
  • “Return of the Archons” – the townspeople move to pre-recorded drumbeats
  • “Return of the Archons” – optical effects elements for Landru hologram
  • “Devil in the Dark” – several slates and Nimoy playing around with one of the Horta eggs
  • “Devil in the Dark” – Shatner's double reading his lines in a scene with McCoy and Spock
  • “City on the Edge of Forever” – one of Spock's tubes blows during Shatner's dialog
  • “City on the Edge of Forever” – Shatner and Nimoy jumping through the guardian arriving in the past without the special effects
Season 2
  • “Mirror, Mirror” – short snipped of Kirk talking to the computer with the script supervisor “voicing” the computer's beeping sounds
  • “Metamorphosis” – Shatner almost falls out of his chair on the shuttlecraft set
  • “Metamorphosis” – Shatner and Nimoy react to an invisible companion who is coming towards the house
  • “Metamorphosis” – footage of Elinor Donahue voicing the companion on set
  • “Metamorphosis” – optical effects reference footage of a redshirt standing in for the companion
  • “Friday's Child” – Leonard Nimoy misses his mark during Kelley's dialog
  • “The Trouble with Tribbles” – behind-the-scenes footage of Kirk and Spock materializing on the station plus several slates before filming a scene
  • “The Trouble with Tribbles” – angle on Leonard Nimoy who tries not to laugh in the last scene for the episode
  • “I, Mudd” – Nimoy misses his entry and Kelley delivers his line instead
  • “I, Mudd” – Nichols doing dance moves between takes
  • “The Changeling” – a stagehand pulling out Nomad's antenna
  • “Return to Tomorrow” – director Ralph Senensky checking the scenery and a makeup guy refreshing Shatner's forehead
  • “Who Mourns for Adonais?” – behind-the-scenes footage of Scotty getting zapped by Apollo without the special effects, temp effects of Apollo's lighting bolts, unprocessed blue screen footage of the giant Apollo and several slates before filming a scene
  • “Who Mourns for Adonais?” – footage of Nichelle Nichols improvising a song about Spock when she works on the inside of her console
Season 3
  • “The Paradise Syndrome” – one camera blocking the other in a scene with Kirok and Miramanee
  • “And the Children Shall Lead” – footage of Melvin Belli as Gorgon sans the optical effects
  • “That Which Survives” – Shatner messing up a scene with difficult dialog
  • “That Which Survives” – Nimoy flubbing a line in a scene with Doohan
  • “Spectre of the Gun” – Kirk and the others are colliding with a force field that will be added in post
There is also a lot of footage that's not assigned to any particular episode. A lot of slates, close-ups of the consoles and some footage of Shatner making funny faces and such. One of the more interesting scenes might be one with several crewmembers dancing in the rec room. Which episode is that from?

Episodes that really should have gotten the “Extended Episode” treatment are “City”, “Space Seed” and “Return to Tomorrow”. There are so many nice deleted scenes and it would be so interesting to see how exactly they fit and feel inside the episodes. But oh well …

Ryan Thomas Riddle said:
Are the original effects cleaned up? Just wondering because from the previews it looks like the found some of the original effects elements, at least for the doc on the VFX.
Click to expand...
Also included is a lot of footage of the Enterprise, Galileo, Botany Bay and K-7 models before a blue screen. What's weird is that this footage does look significantly better than the dailies footage from the episodes. It looks very “high definition” for lack of a better word. At some points they even seem to splice it with the space background which gives a nice taste of what an actual remastered TOS would look like. I wonder if all the effects footage turned up or just some. Because if they had everything they really should remaster the effects.

Green said:
Is should have been a bonus disc. on the 50th set -- but they were NEVER going to sell this as a documentary only.
But when they decided to put it out as separate release -- we ended up getting the 3 new commentaries, the 11 isolated scores and the 12 episodes with better picture and less DNR. For some people that is worth the $43 the price fell to at Amazon on cyber Monday.
Click to expand...
I think it was a purchase well worth the money. It's not as good as it could have been, though.
 
Last edited:
^You sir, are a true gentleman!

I had always wanted to see the extended Kirk/Lenore scene on the observation deck when I think Rand interrupts them and then the conversation turns to -- "what are the women like in your world"
 
Last edited:
Wow!! Thank you M for those details
I am actually more excited now after reading your content review than I have been.
 
Green said:
^You sir, are a true gentleman!
Click to expand...
No problem, it was fun doing it. :)

feek61 said:
Wow!! Thank you M for those details
I am actually more excited now after reading your content review than I have been.
Click to expand...
It's a lot of good and great stuff I never thought I would see! It's just that it's presented so awkwardly. It would have been so wonderful if they had just put a “Deleted Footage” section to each of the episodes.

I understand that they tried to present the new stuff more interestingly. But it seems like they overlooked the fact that the new stuff in itself is the most interesting thing about this release. The way it is now is just too confusing and inconvenient. At least for me. Another problem is that they edited the found footage too much, cuting away too early, talking over the footage and superimposing text. That's not properly preserving that stuff.

Sorry if I sound too harsh. I love having new TOS footage, I really do. But this leaves a lot to be desired.
 
Considering that the DC of TWOK is 3 minutes 28 seconds extended......

A couple of added minutes in a 49 minute TV episode would have been a reasonable addition.
Pretty cool how 3 of the better quality episodes Seed, City and Paradise seem to have the most footage.
I wonder if they had offered just those 3 and included both original and extended versions -- if the response would have been more enthusiastic.
TNG only had one extended episode, but it -- (Measure of a Man) practically made season 2 worth owning for even folks who don't like that season.
 
Well they presented the deleted TNG footage in a more viewer friendly way, BUT they did mute the colors of the new footage so it looked far inferior to the existing footage. Maybe to discourage fan edits.
This sound so promising that I would be both furious AND overjoyed if they released a volume 2.
Furious they lied and thrilled at the prospect of more deleted footage. But I do believe they will stick to one release.
 
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