That's why I thought be nice to introduce Rand, set-up with Kirk for later movies/series, but give her some comedy stuff with Chekov while Kirk off doing whatever he does
Roberto Orci Offers Star Trek 2 Update
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That's why I thought be nice to introduce Rand, set-up with Kirk for later movies/series, but give her some comedy stuff with Chekov while Kirk off doing whatever he does
I think all the women in the new reboot should have a chance to shine and provide something worthwhile to the movie. Allow Nurse Chapel to be more than " Nurse, hypospray! " and allow Rand to be more than the cute yeoman. Rand should probably be... Kirk's canvas for emotional release, like Rush said. Not sappy or dramatic like a Spock/Uhura but, like a strong woman on his side that can level him out when McCoy can't.
I can't see it happening though. If they had introduced her as Pike's yeoman and maybe had Spock send her to Delta Vega to guard Kirk instead of blasting him into space to enjoy that pointless ice trek and hideous 'find Spock in a random cave' moment, they would have given the characters time to bond and she would have had to make a choice to follow NuSpock's orders or take a chance on Kirk. Without that build up, I think she will just be a Sulu/Chekov/Scotty support level character, which is still acceptable, as long as she is given something worthwhile to do in her 'big' scene. It is a shame though.
That's putting it mildly. Shatner hinted at the real reason in his Star Trek Memories--and Whitney herself set the record straight in Longest Trek.
It's very disturbing, suffice it to say....
Absolutely.
That's why I thought be nice to introduce Rand, set-up with Kirk for later movies/series, but give her some comedy stuff with Chekov while Kirk off doing whatever he does
It's funny--in my Black Book of novel ideas, I have quite a few Excelsior tales, wherin I would have had Rand and Chekov do some comical things, such as Rand expressing frustration at his "Inwented in Russia" antics....
On that note...Mr. Orci, if you're reading this, please give this very serious thought:
Chekov: ...and of course, ve vere the first men on the moon!
Rand: Okay, that's it! The first man on the moon was NOT a Russian, okay? He was an American by the name of--
Chekov: Neville Amstrunsky.
Rand: (long pause) ...Neville...Amstrunsky....
Chekov: Da--and the second man vas Boris Aldrinov!
Rand: (facepalm) Why me?
Chekov: Vhat? It is historical record--date of moon landing: June 19, 1968--
Rand: Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagh....
Mr. Orci...may you be inspired.
For the love of god, WHY??? TOS' Janice Rand ultimately developed into the second most useless character in the entire franchise; even Morn managed to get more character development.
Is there anything in Rand's character WORTH preserving in the new continuity? For that matter, is there anything in that characterization that would automatically contradict the notion of her deciding to transfer to the security department and discovering a hidden talent for marksmanship? Or were you about to explain to me that Janice Rand never handles a phaser unless she's trying to bring the Captain some coffee?
Innocence and femininity, eh?
I'm still waiting for you to explain how that is incompatible with her being chief of security.
Pauln6's suggestion about Rand is nothing short of brilliant, and I praised the idea when it was put forth about a month ago.
newtype_alpha you are quite correct, but you forgot minidress martial arts.
OK, seriously, though. I can handle her in black pants for landing party duty, which is actually the way it should be. That would actually be more awesome, because when she shows up in pants you'd just know she's going to kick some ass.
Exactly so.
Alternatively, don't bring back characters like Rand unless they can improve them - and the "tough girl" would be an improvement in Rand's case, for sure.
Oh, shit.
I think we should bow our heads for a moment of silence, in observation of possibly the first on screen phaser blast dematerialization in nuTrek.
Won't that be dramatic?
I think we should bow our heads for a moment of silence, in observation of possibly the first on screen phaser blast dematerialization in nuTrek.
Won't that be dramatic?
about Rand as Yeoman I don't know. But looking at Wiki, "In the United States Navy and United States Coast Guard, a yeoman is a rating usually with secretarial, clerical, payroll or other administrative duties." Is it true? Then Yeoman is still important even in 23rd Century.
Well, we never see administration problem in the Enterprise yet, like what about the pay roll? or... letter work, or well, if an officer need the permission to leave, etc. A captain can't handle them all. Somebody must do the administration work, and Janice Rand can enter the stage from here.
Plus, administration can be funny sometime. Like Kirk abuse his power by asking her to make him coffee, or doing anything else that make her.... Uuuuuuugh to our beloved captain. Plus, we can witness a Chekov and Sulu scene where they will looking for excuse to court her with asking permission to leave or... asking for some paper work or other things, or Scotty who want to borrow some money, etc.
We can set Rand as Kirk's childhood friend who secretly love to Kirk without the playboy know about that; and her arrival to Enterprise make Kirk feel uneasy because he think that Rand will cut his freedom to flirt with other women. It will funny, because look, Kirk is a kind of woman killer hero, what if... his quest to court a new lady challenged by the appearance of Rand? Look at how funny our captain try to avoid Rand to get Miss Chapel attention then caught by Rand and get some trouble.
Well, we never see administration problem in the Enterprise yet, like what about the pay roll? or... letter work, or well, if an officer need the permission to leave, etc. A captain can't handle them all. Somebody must do the administration work, and Janice Rand can enter the stage from here.
Plus, administration can be funny sometime. Like Kirk abuse his power by asking her to make him coffee, or doing anything else that make her.... Uuuuuuugh to our beloved captain. Plus, we can witness a Chekov and Sulu scene where they will looking for excuse to court her with asking permission to leave or... asking for some paper work or other things, or Scotty who want to borrow some money, etc.
We can set Rand as Kirk's childhood friend who secretly love to Kirk without the playboy know about that; and her arrival to Enterprise make Kirk feel uneasy because he think that Rand will cut his freedom to flirt with other women. It will funny, because look, Kirk is a kind of woman killer hero, what if... his quest to court a new lady challenged by the appearance of Rand? Look at how funny our captain try to avoid Rand to get Miss Chapel attention then caught by Rand and get some trouble.
I think any role either Chapel, Rand, or any other TOS character is given must not distract from the main story. So they either have to be a part of that story (like perhaps T'Pring, T'Pau, Sarek, Carol Marcus, KHAAAAAN, Kor etc) or just in the background, contributing in their 'big' scene or two (most of the supporting crew).
I don't think that Janice will be reclaiming her crown as female lead any time soon, particularly as there's not much point in having two romances taking place among the leading crew (this isn't 90210). I do agree that the position of yeoman has a fair amount of comic potential, particularly as young Kirk may be unenamoured by the administrative side of command. All I'm saying is that there is no real reason why Rand shouldn't be trained to other stuff (including fighting and shooting) to try and update the character and make her a bit more versatile. In the sixites, most of the women were hopeless in a fight whereas the reality is that they should have been trained to shoot and fight to the same degree as the men.
We also have to bear in mind that the movie was incredibly profitable and the actors are going to want a bigger slice of that pie in any sequels, so the likelihood is that the franchise is going to go supernova quite quickly as the law of diminishing returns starts to apply. It's likely that we will see a cull of lesser characters with Uhura, Rand, Chekov, and Sulu probably topping the list for a tragic death, albeit I would expect that in the third movie assuming that they signed up for the usual three. It could go either way for Rand, either moving up the list to fill a slot vacated by one of the others or by going out in a blaze of glory herself.
I don't think that Janice will be reclaiming her crown as female lead any time soon, particularly as there's not much point in having two romances taking place among the leading crew (this isn't 90210). I do agree that the position of yeoman has a fair amount of comic potential, particularly as young Kirk may be unenamoured by the administrative side of command. All I'm saying is that there is no real reason why Rand shouldn't be trained to other stuff (including fighting and shooting) to try and update the character and make her a bit more versatile. In the sixites, most of the women were hopeless in a fight whereas the reality is that they should have been trained to shoot and fight to the same degree as the men.
We also have to bear in mind that the movie was incredibly profitable and the actors are going to want a bigger slice of that pie in any sequels, so the likelihood is that the franchise is going to go supernova quite quickly as the law of diminishing returns starts to apply. It's likely that we will see a cull of lesser characters with Uhura, Rand, Chekov, and Sulu probably topping the list for a tragic death, albeit I would expect that in the third movie assuming that they signed up for the usual three. It could go either way for Rand, either moving up the list to fill a slot vacated by one of the others or by going out in a blaze of glory herself.
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They don't use money anymore.
They do it themselves.
He asks his superior who gives him verbal permission or a verbal denial and that officer makes a note in his log.
Unless I'm mistaken, that's what the First Officer is for, no?
Read my post about Gene's intent on where to take her character. I would say that is worth experimenting with.
Let me play the "out of context" card, where that reference to "Field of Fire" is concerned.
For Ezri as well as Rand, I allow for confidence and being able to take care of herself in a fight. I am fine with giving both women ability to handle a phaser, etc., well. (Indeed, Rand's characterizarion does NOT contradict such, any more than Ezri's does.)
I do not approve of taking such to the extreme I have stated--especially if it involves a re-write of the character.
1) A little civility, please? No goading or baiting, if you will....
2) Transferring Rand from Yeoman to Security Chief is like transferring Uhura to Sciences, or McCoy to Engineering.
BTW...considering how Trek's quintessential female Security Chief is Tasha Yar--that is NOT where I would want to take Rand.
For goodness sake--we still have fans complaining about how the film basically rewrote and "ruined" Kirk (it didn't--he's the same James T. Kirk we've always known, just younger) and Spock (same thing) and Uhura (hmm...here, I see their point) for the sake of "coolness".
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What about transferring Chekov to Security?
Well, considering how that was only for one film...
But seriously--Chekov was on command track. And...througout the series, we saw him as going through a kind of "on-the-job-training" in various departments. We saw him filling in for Spock in his very first (production-order) appearance, for one.
He wasn't just a navigator even on the show. He was more of a "jack-of-all-trades" in the making, at the time mastering in navigation.
Thus...nuChekov, while a complete goofball (And PLEASE straighten up that hair!), is still in character at least in that regard.
Rand as security chief has no such basis in the show.
But seriously--Chekov was on command track. And...througout the series, we saw him as going through a kind of "on-the-job-training" in various departments. We saw him filling in for Spock in his very first (production-order) appearance, for one.
He wasn't just a navigator even on the show. He was more of a "jack-of-all-trades" in the making, at the time mastering in navigation.
Thus...nuChekov, while a complete goofball (And PLEASE straighten up that hair!), is still in character at least in that regard.
Rand as security chief has no such basis in the show.
I think Rand's role is going to be somewhat pivotal in the next movie, but I certainly don't want to see her pining for an idiot and serving the same idiot coffee. I do see her as an engineer, eventually, though, partly because of ST:TMP. And wouldn't it be nice if she could kick the same idiot's butt.
If Orci and Kurtzman were nice to their female (and some male) fans, Kirk and McCoy would be shirtless in the next movie. And Rand will be quite "leggy" for the male (and some female) fans.
If Orci and Kurtzman were nice to their female (and some male) fans, Kirk and McCoy would be shirtless
in the next movie. And Rand will be quite "leggy" for the male (and some female) fans.
Agreed--which is why I would venture to have Kirk continue to grow from playboy to a real man. Make him worthy of a woman's love, as opposed to a woman's sexual attraction.
Hmm...perhaps....
Depends on who the idiot is, I suppose. If it were Cupcake, I'd be one of the first to cheer--provided it's a "telling him off" kind of kick-butt, when he becomes insubordinate--and he WILL become insubordinate, mark my words--towards Kirk....
If Orci and Kurtzman were nice to their female (and some male) fans, Kirk and McCoy would be shirtless
Kirk's almost a given--the iconic sequence of Jimbo getting his shirt ripped off.
(Of course, Chris Pine may therefore have a LOT of working out to do, if he hopes to equal the macho chest of Shatner, as opposed to the all-too-typical-of-modern-male-heart-throbs scrawny/slender "pretty boy" chest.)
Bones...not sure.
Oh...oh...yeah....
I'm ambivalent. Chekov becoming security chief in TMP was a terrible re-write for his character. He displayed no aptitude for security, adminstration, or tactical skill before or since. Traitor Winds was a great novel that went some way to explain why Chekov transferred to security. Fortunately, I don't think he was ever stated on screen to be security chief so my version would make him simply a weapons officer, for which he has at least displayed some canonical aptitude and keep a different character (in my story, a female andorian) as security chief.
Uhura appears to be an (electronics) engineer by training, with specialisms in linguistics and communications, and she is also command trained (as we saw in the first few episodes of TOS). Rand appears to be an (electronics) engineer by training with specialisms in administration, transporters, and communications. Chekov appears to be scientist by training with specialisms in astrogation, zoology (possibly), and planetary ecology, and he is also command and weapons trained. Sulu appears to be science trained with specialisms in (astro)physics, botany, and piloting and he is also command and weapons trained. Chapel is science trained with specialisms in biology, paleobiology, and archaeology with enough medical training to hold a nurse's post and she trained as a doctor throughout TOS (technically she should have been a junior doctor rather than a chief nurse if she was fully qualified to act as a CMO 3 years after TOS).
The writers tend to shuffle characters around depending on what they need for the plot and I think they should continue to do that within reason. Rand could act as transporter chief instead of yeoman but if they do that then they consign her to her post like Uhura and Chapel and essentially limit her to a cameo. Chapel should be in charge of life sciences rather than a nurse or she really will be relegated to handing out hypos and pouting. I think keeping Rand as Kirk's yeoman has a lot more comic potential, a lot more room for her to grow, and a lot more options for her to contribute to the story.
Uhura appears to be an (electronics) engineer by training, with specialisms in linguistics and communications, and she is also command trained (as we saw in the first few episodes of TOS). Rand appears to be an (electronics) engineer by training with specialisms in administration, transporters, and communications. Chekov appears to be scientist by training with specialisms in astrogation, zoology (possibly), and planetary ecology, and he is also command and weapons trained. Sulu appears to be science trained with specialisms in (astro)physics, botany, and piloting and he is also command and weapons trained. Chapel is science trained with specialisms in biology, paleobiology, and archaeology with enough medical training to hold a nurse's post and she trained as a doctor throughout TOS (technically she should have been a junior doctor rather than a chief nurse if she was fully qualified to act as a CMO 3 years after TOS).
The writers tend to shuffle characters around depending on what they need for the plot and I think they should continue to do that within reason. Rand could act as transporter chief instead of yeoman but if they do that then they consign her to her post like Uhura and Chapel and essentially limit her to a cameo. Chapel should be in charge of life sciences rather than a nurse or she really will be relegated to handing out hypos and pouting. I think keeping Rand as Kirk's yeoman has a lot more comic potential, a lot more room for her to grow, and a lot more options for her to contribute to the story.
Hoo, someone's just asking to get schooled by the Chris Pine and Karl Urban fan brigades, isn't he?Kirk's almost a given--the iconic sequence of Jimbo getting his shirt ripped off.If Orci and Kurtzman were nice to their female (and some male) fans, Kirk and McCoy would be shirtless
(Of course, Chris Pine may therefore have a LOT of working out to do, if he hopes to equal the macho chest of Shatner, as opposed to the all-too-typical-of-modern-male-heart-throbs scrawny/slender "pretty boy" chest.)
Bones...not sure.
^Meh. I've been through worse.
I apologize for nothing.
I apologize for nothing.
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