Robert Beltran complains... forever!

[Refuge]

Just to edit and reference the above post.. Do you really believe any of them didn't read their scripts? Of course they did otherwise there would have been some serious dead air, lol.

Interesting that 'Tattoo' was the episode I was up to last night. Voyager sent an away team to obtain minerals, no doubt to add to the ship's resources.. but I was reading this about the production: ( Refs: Mark A. Altman, Edward Gross and 'Cinefantastique')

After the initial concept of "Tattoo" was purchased by the writing team, they struggled for a long time to make it work, and it was abandoned for a time. When writer Michael Piller resurrected it, he used the script to make a point to the rest of the writers about pacing: ""Tattoo" was written in sort of a rage...right in the middle of my battle about pace. I set out to prove that there was a way to tell stories without writing long scenes and I turned in a script that had 190 or 200 scenes. Look at all the levels you're dealing with–flashbacks, a mystery, a culture and an issue of history–there are so many things going on."

Isn't that an example of a writer going the extra mile and getting the respect from his actors? Give and take. Robert Beltran held his own.

 

[Sophie74656]

Just to edit and reference the above post.. Do you really believe any of them didn't read their scripts? Of course they did otherwise there would have been some serious dead air, lol.

Interesting that 'Tattoo' was the episode I was up to last night. Voyager sent an away team to obtain minerals, no doubt to add to the ship's resources.. but I was reading this about the production: ( Refs: Mark A. Altman, Edward Gross and 'Cinefantastique')

After the initial concept of "Tattoo" was purchased by the writing team, they struggled for a long time to make it work, and it was abandoned for a time. When writer Michael Piller resurrected it, he used the script to make a point to the rest of the writers about pacing: ""Tattoo" was written in sort of a rage...right in the middle of my battle about pace. I set out to prove that there was a way to tell stories without writing long scenes and I turned in a script that had 190 or 200 scenes. Look at all the levels you're dealing with–flashbacks, a mystery, a culture and an issue of history–there are so many things going on."

Isn't that an example of a writer going the extra mile and getting the respect from his actors? Give and take. Robert Beltran held his own.

I would like to believe he did read everything and took it seriously. But he has said he stopped really reading scripts and had pages taped to props. I don't know what really happened but that's what he said.

 

[Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME]

Just to edit and reference the above post.. Do you really believe any of them didn't read their scripts? Of course they did otherwise there would have been some serious dead air, lol..

As Sophie74656 wrote before, Beltran himself admitted not reading the scripts. As for learning his lines for his scenes, there too, he admitted to see no point to waste his time to learn his dialogues so much there were short and insignificant. And consequently, he used some "cheat sheets" on which were written his lines, and stuck them on different elements of the decor like on tables, mugs, padd, etc.., easy to quickly check discreetly! -> most players have seen him to do it but only Wang confirmed it so openly and mockingly.

That an actor disagrees on the development on non development given to his character is common in the world of TV shows, especially when they run over several years but come on, they are adults there and should act as such. Not like a
little wayward boy, who made known his displeasure by stealth when he has not got what he wanted!
And what about his interviews where he complained about everything and everyone?! It had to make the atmosphere very warm! In any case, it was far from respectful to colleagues, producers, members of the staff.

 

[Sophie74656]

As Sophie74656 wrote before, Beltran himself admitted not reading the scripts. As for learning his lines for his scenes, there too, he admitted to see no point to waste his time to learn his dialogues so much there were short and insignificant. And consequently, he used some "cheat sheets" on which were written his lines, and stuck them on different elements of the decor like on tables, mugs, padd, etc.., easy to quickly check discreetly! -> most players have seen him to do it but only Wang confirmed it so openly and mockingly.

That an actor disagrees on the development on non development given to his character is common in the world of TV shows, especially when they run over several years but come on, they are adults there and should act as such. Not like a
little wayward boy, who made known his displeasure by stealth when he has not got what he wanted!
And what about his interviews where he complained about everything and everyone?! It had to make the atmosphere very warm! In any case, it was far from respectful to colleagues, producers, members of the staff.

If he was unhappy and had criticisms i have no issue with that. Everyone has times when they are frustrated at work. But there are ways to voice those frustrations without being a jerk about it

 

[Lynx]

As Sophie74656 wrote before, Beltran himself admitted not reading the scripts. As for learning his lines for his scenes, there too, he admitted to see no point to waste his time to learn his dialogues so much there were short and insignificant. And consequently, he used some "cheat sheets" on which were written his lines, and stuck them on different elements of the decor like on tables, mugs, padd, etc.., easy to quickly check discreetly! -> most players have seen him to do it but only Wang confirmed it so openly and mockingly.

That an actor disagrees on the development on non development given to his character is common in the world of TV shows, especially when they run over several years but come on, they are adults there and should act as such. Not like a
little wayward boy, who made known his displeasure by stealth when he has not got what he wanted!
And what about his interviews where he complained about everything and everyone?! It had to make the atmosphere very warm! In any case, it was far from respectful to colleagues, producers, members of the staff.

Honestly, the way the producers treated certain cast members was even more disrespectful than Beltran's criticizm.

Besides that, Beltram is right in his criticizm.

 

[Sophie74656]

Honestly, the way the producers treated certain cast members was even more disrespectful than Beltran's criticizm.

Besides that, Beltram is right in his criticizm.

You have no proof that cast members were treated poorly

 

[Refuge]

Well.. hmmmm. I kind of just take what is onscreen when I'm watching something so if he learned his lines or was taking his cues in another way, it got the job done. Marilyn Monroe was famed for actually struggling to deliver lines, drove everyone crazy.

That writer I quoted above in mentioning he wanted to teach the other writers about 'pacing' infers differences with the writing staff themselves. In context of reading Braga I do wonder if Beltran's or any of the other actors experiences would've have been colored by who respected their character's development, backstories etc. Bottom line who wrote the vehicle for them to.. act. I must admit though I haven't read the site and Beltran's criticisms, might get in the way of my liking Chakotay.

 

[Voth commando1]

Maybe he should have been a better actor or quit or whatever.

It's even more shameful he goes to convention.

 

[Sophie74656]

Maybe he should have been a better actor or quit or whatever.

It's even more shameful he goes to convention.

I agree with this. I've seen several videos of him at conventions and they make me like him less. His jokes are in poor taste and he has an attitude. But I still need his autograph on my cast poster.

 

[Lynx]

You have no proof that cast members were treated poorly

Lien was kicked out and beltran's suggestions for his character were totally ignored. That's what I call poor treatment.

 

[Sophie74656]

Lien was kicked out and beltran's suggestions for his character were totally ignored. That's what I call poor treatment.

You have no evidence that they were poorly treated. Just because Lien left the show doesn't mean there was rudeness. You are wanting there to be some because you are unhappy she left. But by her own words there was no poor treatment.

 

[Lynx]

You have no evidence that they were poorly treated. Just because Lien left the show doesn't mean there was rudeness. You are wanting there to be some because you are unhappy she left. But by her own words there was no poor treatment.

You have no evidence that all of them were well-treated and that they all, including those in charge were a big, happy family.

There's always two sides of a coin.

Lien was dumped and was unhappy for that for some years, Mulgrew were unhappy over tha Lien was dumped and that Ryan all of a sudden became the star of the show, Beltran and Wang were unhappy over lack of character development and the rest didn't like that Lien was dumped.

Obviously there were some poor treatment going on.

 

[Sophie74656]

You have no evidence that all of them were well-treated and that they all, including those in charge were a big, happy family.

There's always two sides of a coin.

Lien was dumped and was unhappy for that for some years, Mulgrew were unhappy over tha Lien was dumped and that Ryan all of a sudden became the star of the show, Beltran and Wang were unhappy over lack of character development and the rest didn't like that Lien was dumped.

Obviously there were some poor treatment going on.

Well, Jennifer Lien herself said there were no hard feelings. Whether or not that was actually true, the fact that she said that holds more evidence to the fact that she was not treated poorly than your own wish for some sort of poor treatment of her. You can keep believing your own far fetched theories about what happened but since none of us know what really happened I'll go with what the actress herself said about the situation.

 

[Refuge]

This may be of no relevance and it is my impression, so I offer it as that.

Jennifer Lien portraying Kes seemed to draw upon a vulnerability from the actress herself. That's the sense I get. Her youth too. I can't now see the character without from time to time reflecting how her personal struggles in real life have caused her confusion and unhappiness. Really I wish her all the best as a human being, the vulnerable in life do not weather what life throws at them in the same way. So whereas it may be common practice for casting changes to be made and for other actors to roll with the punches, for some, irrespective of their brave face, it must be bewildering.

Actors and writers must have egos.. there are bound to be issues. Creative types, you know. Then when the money makers get in on the act like most 'bosses' they are just so out of touch and cold. A little restructuring is required.. oh let's outsource. It doesn't take much to structure a justification, but essentially the TV industry version of an audit happened. Someone decided a shakeup involving bringing in this character and dispensing with this other one would balance the books. Those people don't care about the human element of who they are dealing with, they are above it.

For those that were saved.. life goes on.

 

[Sophie74656]

This may be of no relevance and it is my impression, so I offer it as that.

Jennifer Lien portraying Kes seemed to draw upon a vulnerability from the actress herself. That's the sense I get. Her youth too. I can't now see the character without from time to time reflecting how her personal struggles in real life have caused her confusion and unhappiness. Really I wish her all the best as a human being, the vulnerable in life do not weather what life throws at them in the same way. So whereas it may be common practice for casting changes to be made and for other actors to roll with the punches, for some, irrespective of their brave face, it must be bewildering.

Actors and writers must have egos.. there are bound to be issues. Creative types, you know. Then when the money makers get in on the act like most 'bosses' they are just so out of touch and cold. A little restructuring is required.. oh let's outsource. It doesn't take much to structure a justification, but essentially the TV industry version of an audit happened. Someone decided a shakeup involving bringing in this character and dispensing with this other one would balance the books. Those people don't care about the human element of who they are dealing with, they are above it.

For those that were saved.. life goes on.

For those that left...life goes on too. Your life doesn't come to a screeching halt because you were let go from a job. You collect yourself and you look for the next job. That's not to say that it's not upsetting or that it might create financial difficulties but it shouldn't be the end of the world. I've been let go from a few jobs in my life. Yeah I was upset and money was tight until I found the next job. But that doesn't mean the people who let me go were mean to me or rude because they let me go

 

[Refuge]

Perhaps how life goes on for a different type of personality is more difficult.

Her life did go on but in many respects she has been tarnished. Being an actor on a successful show and let go kind of follows you around, in a way us less visible folk don't have to live with. Voyager is a reference point for her. You read comments like.. How sad for her, I mean look at what has happened to her? Gosh was she Kes?! That type of thing.

Does that mean the people who let her go were rude or mean? Well, I'm going to go with mean. Letting anyone go from a secure job and from an environment where she was the young, inexperienced one, is a bit of a slap in the face. It's certainly not a nice thing to do, lol. Might be a pragmatic, business thing to do, but stuff that when you've been given the flick. I would take it as a rejection, absolutely.

Yeah we're all different. She just strikes me as being a confused soul. Beltran on the other hand.. he can look after himself!

 

[Voth commando1]

Lien seems like a young woman who either lost or who never found her way.

 

[Sophie74656]

Perhaps how life goes on for a different type of personality is more difficult.

Her life did go on but in many respects she has been tarnished. Being an actor on a successful show and let go kind of follows you around, in a way us less visible folk don't have to live with. Voyager is a reference point for her. You read comments like.. How sad for her, I mean look at what has happened to her? Gosh was she Kes?! That type of thing.

Does that mean the people who let her go were rude or mean? Well, I'm going to go with mean. Letting anyone go from a secure job and from an environment where she was the young, inexperienced one, is a bit of a slap in the face. It's certainly not a nice thing to do, lol. Might be a pragmatic, business thing to do, but stuff that when you've been given the flick. I would take it as a rejection, absolutely.

Yeah we're all different. She just strikes me as being a confused soul. Beltran on the other hand.. he can look after himself!

Ok so then i have to ask you this....someone is hired for a job and told the job will be for three years. At the end of those three years they may or may not be taken on for an additional 4 years. Those three years come to an end and they are not kept on. Is that mean? Or is it simply the nature of temporary work (which acting is)

 

[Sophie74656]

Lien seems like a young woman who either lost or who never found her way.

Obviously she has had some issues. But since they appear to have started almost 20 years after her being on Voyager I personally doubt it had anything to do with her leaving the show.

 

[Refuge]

Ok so then i have to ask you this....someone is hired for a job and told the job will be for three years. At the end of those three years they may or may not be taken on for an additional 4 years. Those three years come to an end and they are not kept on. Is that mean? Or is it simply the nature of temporary work (which acting is)

I'm no actor.. too shy. My understanding is that if you make it to the main cast there is an expectation that you are regular, lol. I hadn't thought her contract had come to an end as such and that is why she was let go. I got the impression she was happily doing her thing on the show, then some decision maker thought.. ooh let's bring in a Borg. Hey dude do you thing we can get away with squeezing her into this silver wet suit? Sure can! We're going to have to make room in the cast though, budget is getting tight. I know, let's get rid of Harry! Can't do that, he's beautiful. Hmmm.. what about the other blonde girl? Done!

I wasn't there but I can imagine this. If that were the case it is mean in a way.

To answer your question though if I was told I was to be employed for three years and then my job was to be reassessed after that and I was let go, it would be upfront. I agree. However, I would still feel like I had failed seeing all the others I worked with being kept on. Though I can understand if someone else saw it more practically than that.

I think as I pondered earlier this actress is a more sensitive soul. She may still have had difficulties with a whole different set of experiences. Acting is probably one of the worst jobs for those with fragile self-esteem.