Been on that particular ride way too many times.
Happy Fathers' Day Ubik and to all the Trek Dads out there.
Revisiting Star Trek TOS/TAS...
- Thread starter Warped9
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Been on that particular ride way too many times.
Happy Fathers' Day Ubik and to all the Trek Dads out there.
I've just finished Alan Dean Foster's adaptation of "Beyond The Farthest Star."
It's good and fleshes out the story better than the aired episode. That said sometimes ADF adds bits of dialogue that don't quite ring true (in my opinion) for the characters, but if this had served as basis for a script for a filmed episode then I've little doubt that would have been corrected.
One new feature seen in TAS, or at least in this one episode, was the bridge's Intruder Defense System. This was a clever idea and something that might have been handy during TOS. That said because we never actually saw the topmost part of the bridge ceiling in TOS (from the inside) there is no real reason to believe the IDS wasn't there.
The adaptations feel like whole unedited stories and avoid that truncated feeling many of the aired episodes have because of the half-hour format. Although in the '70s (and even today, really) you could never have gotten an hour long animated series launched TAS' stories often impress as needing that amount of running time to be told properly.
But in this revisit the adaptations serve the purpose of filling in some apparent holes of the aired episodes. Still, in the end I have to assess the episode on its own because that's how it was put together and aired. It would be curious to know if there had ever been any bits or scenes planned or finished for any of the episodes that were aborted or deleted in order to fit the alloted running time.
It's good and fleshes out the story better than the aired episode. That said sometimes ADF adds bits of dialogue that don't quite ring true (in my opinion) for the characters, but if this had served as basis for a script for a filmed episode then I've little doubt that would have been corrected.
One new feature seen in TAS, or at least in this one episode, was the bridge's Intruder Defense System. This was a clever idea and something that might have been handy during TOS. That said because we never actually saw the topmost part of the bridge ceiling in TOS (from the inside) there is no real reason to believe the IDS wasn't there.
The adaptations feel like whole unedited stories and avoid that truncated feeling many of the aired episodes have because of the half-hour format. Although in the '70s (and even today, really) you could never have gotten an hour long animated series launched TAS' stories often impress as needing that amount of running time to be told properly.
But in this revisit the adaptations serve the purpose of filling in some apparent holes of the aired episodes. Still, in the end I have to assess the episode on its own because that's how it was put together and aired. It would be curious to know if there had ever been any bits or scenes planned or finished for any of the episodes that were aborted or deleted in order to fit the alloted running time.
I recall reading or watching some interview somewhere...
It was noted that several TAS eps were originally written as TOS eps and the scripts reflected that. Specifically, the page count of TAS scripts were about equal to that of TOS script page counts, despite the difference in eps length.
There might well be some bits and scenes in TAS eps that were written but never made it onscreen. I guess we'd need to start looking at some original scripts to compare.
It was noted that several TAS eps were originally written as TOS eps and the scripts reflected that. Specifically, the page count of TAS scripts were about equal to that of TOS script page counts, despite the difference in eps length.
There might well be some bits and scenes in TAS eps that were written but never made it onscreen. I guess we'd need to start looking at some original scripts to compare.
“Yesteryear” ****
Spock travels back to the time of his youth to restore history.
For Saturday morning television this was clearly far above what else was being offered. This episode was no less than ideal subject matter for TOS. And looking at the episode I think there is very little they would have been challenged to do had this story been done live-action.
The lematya and Spock's sehlat would have been quite a challenge and would have had to be rethought. The flying "cars" could have been referenced though not actually seen. And a matte painting could have served for the city of Shi-Khar. If they could bring back Mark Lenard and Jane Wyatt as Spock's parents then there really wouldn't have been anything else left as a real obstacle. Oh, and you would have needed the Time Guardian set again as well. For the outdoor scenes it would have been best to have shot on-location, perhaps the same place they shot "Arena" and "Friday's Child."
Granted the avian alien historian would have had to have been rewritten. But no reason you couldn't have done the Andorian Thelin in Starfleet uniform. I've always been intrigued by Thelin and I really wish we could have seen an Andorian Starfleet officer in TOS. It really would have nailed home the idea that there were other aliens in Starfleet.
I also liked that when this episode was made they chose to dress Sarek in more contemporary style clothing rather than robes which seemed to become almost standard fare later on in the films and other series.
It's also easy to see why this story is so well regarded. It's far removed from standard run-and-jump action fare which was the province of superhero type Saturday morning cartoons. It's a thoughtful and moving story.
The only reason I'm grading it a 4 instead of 5 is again because of the limited half hour running time and limited animation.
Spock travels back to the time of his youth to restore history.
For Saturday morning television this was clearly far above what else was being offered. This episode was no less than ideal subject matter for TOS. And looking at the episode I think there is very little they would have been challenged to do had this story been done live-action.
The lematya and Spock's sehlat would have been quite a challenge and would have had to be rethought. The flying "cars" could have been referenced though not actually seen. And a matte painting could have served for the city of Shi-Khar. If they could bring back Mark Lenard and Jane Wyatt as Spock's parents then there really wouldn't have been anything else left as a real obstacle. Oh, and you would have needed the Time Guardian set again as well. For the outdoor scenes it would have been best to have shot on-location, perhaps the same place they shot "Arena" and "Friday's Child."
Granted the avian alien historian would have had to have been rewritten. But no reason you couldn't have done the Andorian Thelin in Starfleet uniform. I've always been intrigued by Thelin and I really wish we could have seen an Andorian Starfleet officer in TOS. It really would have nailed home the idea that there were other aliens in Starfleet.
I also liked that when this episode was made they chose to dress Sarek in more contemporary style clothing rather than robes which seemed to become almost standard fare later on in the films and other series.
It's also easy to see why this story is so well regarded. It's far removed from standard run-and-jump action fare which was the province of superhero type Saturday morning cartoons. It's a thoughtful and moving story.
The only reason I'm grading it a 4 instead of 5 is again because of the limited half hour running time and limited animation.
Hey, Warped.
Preface: it's your rating system, so do whatever.
A suggestion: to give Yesteryear less than a five due to limited animation would be like giving "Babel" less than a five because of the obvious budget constraints, action-sequence requirements, and dramatic music stabs that were part and parcel of '60s action/adventure TV.
I'm not communicating this well, but TAS likewise "was what it was," and it might be fairer taking its limitations as a given like we do with TOS, and still give some of its eps five stars if they deserve.
Be well. Enjoying the thread immensely.
Preface: it's your rating system, so do whatever.
A suggestion: to give Yesteryear less than a five due to limited animation would be like giving "Babel" less than a five because of the obvious budget constraints, action-sequence requirements, and dramatic music stabs that were part and parcel of '60s action/adventure TV.
I'm not communicating this well, but TAS likewise "was what it was," and it might be fairer taking its limitations as a given like we do with TOS, and still give some of its eps five stars if they deserve.
Be well. Enjoying the thread immensely.
^^ I understand your point and I gave this a great deal of thought. But in all honesty while I can easily get past whatever limitations someone might see in TOS none of them detract or interfere with the story. But while watching these animated episodes I find myself experiencing a bit of frustration. I keep thinking this deserves more, deserves better. Indeed I've just finished reading ADF's adaptation of "Yesteryear" and it such a different experience. It has so many small touches that make it feel whole and complete.
One of the advantages of the adaptations is you needn't accept sometimes less than impressive voice acting. We know that some of the regular cast were employed to voice other characters and this could often undermine the effectiveness of a given scene. A case in point would be the voice of the Guardian. Remember the way it spoke and sounded originally in "The City On The Edge Of Forever"---you can imagine that voice when you're reading it. But in the animated episode we get this weird sounding substitute that sounds like he's barely awake. It's laughable...and not in a good way. It's simply another point underlining that Paramount and Filmation were doing this on the cheap when this really deserved better. And there will be other examples of this throughout the series.
One of the advantages of the adaptations is you needn't accept sometimes less than impressive voice acting. We know that some of the regular cast were employed to voice other characters and this could often undermine the effectiveness of a given scene. A case in point would be the voice of the Guardian. Remember the way it spoke and sounded originally in "The City On The Edge Of Forever"---you can imagine that voice when you're reading it. But in the animated episode we get this weird sounding substitute that sounds like he's barely awake. It's laughable...and not in a good way. It's simply another point underlining that Paramount and Filmation were doing this on the cheap when this really deserved better. And there will be other examples of this throughout the series.
The on small complaint I have with Yesteryear: In City On The Edge of Forever, Kirk specifically asks the Gaurdian of Forever, "Can you change the speed at which yesterday passes?"
Its response: "I was made to offer the past in this manner. I cannot change."
Yet, in Yesteryear we have varios Federation research teams and Spock calling out specific dayes, and places. I have to thimnk that if anyone was reviewing a modern live action episode ffrom any later series (IE TNG, DS9, ENT, etc.); the writer of the episode would have been torn a new one, but I guess D.C. Fontana gets a break, eh?
Its response: "I was made to offer the past in this manner. I cannot change."
Yet, in Yesteryear we have varios Federation research teams and Spock calling out specific dayes, and places. I have to thimnk that if anyone was reviewing a modern live action episode ffrom any later series (IE TNG, DS9, ENT, etc.); the writer of the episode would have been torn a new one, but I guess D.C. Fontana gets a break, eh?
You're absolutely right and I noticed the same thing. I also found it amusing that the Federation would risk sending research teams back into the past. Perhaps the events in "Yesteryear" will make them reconsider that practice.The on small complaint I have with Yesteryear: In City On The Edge of Forever, Kirk specifically asks the Gaurdian of Forever, "Can you change the speed at which yesterday passes?"
Its response: "I was made to offer the past in this manner. I cannot change."
Yet, in Yesteryear we have varios Federation research teams and Spock calling out specific dayes, and places. I have to thimnk that if anyone was reviewing a modern live action episode ffrom any later series (IE TNG, DS9, ENT, etc.); the writer of the episode would have been torn a new one, but I guess D.C. Fontana gets a break, eh?
Now it's possible I suppose that in the intervening years between first finding the Guardian and the events in "Yesteryear" it was learned how to communicate with Guardian in a particular way and now it is possible to ask for specific times and places.
That was James Doohan voicing the Guardian in “Yesteryear,” and he sounded like a ghost — a tired ghost. Bartell LaRue, who did the Guardian’s voice in “City on the Edge of Forever,” must have been either unavailable or too expensive. In fact, James Doohan did a total of six voices in that episode.
At least they got Mark Lenard to do Sarek’s voice (although the voice of Spock’s mother Amanda was provided by Majel Barrett).
Or Fleshlights.
Animation's an expensive process, so it's seldom there are deleted finished scenes. Usually material is cut at the storyboard stage. My personal feeling, given the languid pace of most TAS episodes, is that they were rather padding them. I doubt there was anything much to cut.
Or laser beams! Sharks with frickin’ laser beams attached to their heads!
"One Of Our Planets Is Missing" ***
The Enterprise encounters an enormous cloud like lifeform that consumes planets.
This is a watchable enough episode, but not really special in any way. It's something of a cross between "The Immunity Syndrome" and Fantastic Voyage. It's pretty much a bottle show, but one that TOS might have had some challenge producing. It would all depend on how much of the cloud creature they wished to depict and how well they could do it.
There's a neat bit of continuity in that we see the return of Commodore Robert Wesley from "The Ultimate Computer" only here he is now governor of a Federation colony, the planet threatened by the cloud creature.
Yes, the ADF adaptation feels more complete, but it doesn't seem such a big difference this time.
I do have one issue with the story, though. When they beam aboard a chunk of antimatter to reenergize the warp engines why is Kirk assisting Scotty in doing this?
You would think there would be any number of more skilled engineering personnel to handle a procedure of this type rather than the ship's Captain.
The other somewhat moment is when Spock uses the ship's sensors as a telepathic booster or extension of himself to make contact with the creature to ascertain its intelligence. I suppose it's not much different than him communicating with Nomad or the Horta, but it does push suspension of disbelief.
The Enterprise encounters an enormous cloud like lifeform that consumes planets.
This is a watchable enough episode, but not really special in any way. It's something of a cross between "The Immunity Syndrome" and Fantastic Voyage. It's pretty much a bottle show, but one that TOS might have had some challenge producing. It would all depend on how much of the cloud creature they wished to depict and how well they could do it.
There's a neat bit of continuity in that we see the return of Commodore Robert Wesley from "The Ultimate Computer" only here he is now governor of a Federation colony, the planet threatened by the cloud creature.
Yes, the ADF adaptation feels more complete, but it doesn't seem such a big difference this time.
I do have one issue with the story, though. When they beam aboard a chunk of antimatter to reenergize the warp engines why is Kirk assisting Scotty in doing this?
You would think there would be any number of more skilled engineering personnel to handle a procedure of this type rather than the ship's Captain.The other somewhat
moment is when Spock uses the ship's sensors as a telepathic booster or extension of himself to make contact with the creature to ascertain its intelligence. I suppose it's not much different than him communicating with Nomad or the Horta, but it does push suspension of disbelief.
I do have one issue with the story, though. When they beam aboard a chunk of antimatter to reenergize the warp engines why is Kirk assisting Scotty in doing this?
Two Words..Budget Cuts...
I think you might find it a tad shocking to see just how many voices Jimmy Doohan wound up doing throughout TAS.
I am not surprised you gave it much thought. Good explanation. The limited animation gets in my way too. Another is the calm tones ALL the actors use, since the mic was a few imches away, rather than acting on a stage with actors several to many feet away. I might follow your lead and read the logs. I purged my old original ones. Hello, ebay. Be well!
As someone who's done sopme VO (and directed too); it's just a fact that some TV actors seem to need the trappings (ie set, costumes, etc.) to 'get into character' and give a good performance. With just a mic and a small room, and street clothes, some just can't get into character or puch up and 'act' the dialogue too well.
Add to that that they usually have the script in front of them; will in fact read off it (and it'll sound just like that they're reading too); and if the VO director doesn't care or speak up to try and get a line the way he wants it - they'll just read it and walk off.
Given what I've heard from TAS, I have to wonder if the VO director was just of the mentality, "These guys played these characters for 3 years. Don't want to upset them, as long as I can understand what they say, it's fine.
I still remember as a kid, the TAS episode with teh Orion Pirate ship, and William Shatner mis-pronounced "Orion" through the entire thing; so either teh VO director was clueless too; or hedidn't have teh nerve/guts to correct Mr. Shatner's pronunciation.
“The Lorelei Signal” ***
A strange signal lures the Enterprise to a remote world inhabited solely by women.
Toss in a bit of "The Deadly Years" and this is really a retelling of the ancient fable of seagoing mariners lured by sirens to their death. I don't really care for this story much, but it has one really good saving grace: when Uhura takes command because the male members of the crew are effectively incapacitated. She not only takes command but also leads an all female security team planetside to retrieve Kirk and his landing party. We get to see them phaser stun the female inhabitants, but I'd have liked to see some good old-fashioned hand-to-hand ass kicking.
Actually this story would have been worth doing live-action just to see the Enterprise's female contingent in action. Uhura and company doing a little Avengers' Emma Peel style action.
The ADF adaptation works somewhat better because he fills in little plot holes from the episode. In the episode I'm wondering why they just don't turn the speakers off or try to block the signal, but in the adaptation Uhura does try to do this very thing but to no effect. In the episode I couldn't understand why the Taurean women didn't just use their "magical" viewer to locate Kirk and company, but in the book it explains that Uhura's security team arrive just before the Taureans are about to consult the viewer.
I was initially going to grade this a 2-star, but the story picks up when Uhura takes command. It doesn't make it enough to be rated as good, but it does make it better and watchable.
A strange signal lures the Enterprise to a remote world inhabited solely by women.
Toss in a bit of "The Deadly Years" and this is really a retelling of the ancient fable of seagoing mariners lured by sirens to their death. I don't really care for this story much, but it has one really good saving grace: when Uhura takes command because the male members of the crew are effectively incapacitated. She not only takes command but also leads an all female security team planetside to retrieve Kirk and his landing party. We get to see them phaser stun the female inhabitants, but I'd have liked to see some good old-fashioned hand-to-hand ass kicking.
Actually this story would have been worth doing live-action just to see the Enterprise's female contingent in action. Uhura and company doing a little Avengers' Emma Peel style action.
The ADF adaptation works somewhat better because he fills in little plot holes from the episode. In the episode I'm wondering why they just don't turn the speakers off or try to block the signal, but in the adaptation Uhura does try to do this very thing but to no effect. In the episode I couldn't understand why the Taurean women didn't just use their "magical" viewer to locate Kirk and company, but in the book it explains that Uhura's security team arrive just before the Taureans are about to consult the viewer.
I was initially going to grade this a 2-star, but the story picks up when Uhura takes command. It doesn't make it enough to be rated as good, but it does make it better and watchable.
Much to my regret I did that many, many years ago back in the '80s or so. Then some years ago I had a change of heart and picked up the compilations that had two Log volumes per book for a total of five books. True I don't have those original covers anymore, but I do have the stories which is more important. And I'm so glad I have them.
Candidly in many respects ADF's adaptations feel more like the real episodes than TAS itself.
I'd also like to recollect the James Blish adaptations. I have the first collection with the cool James Bama cover, but I wish I had the rest.
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