Replacing Star Trek and Star Wars

[Mudd]

Can we make a little way for Serling here. Thanks.

As a writer? Always. For his personal opinion on what boxes to sort things into? Not particularly.

damon knight proposed the only workable definition: "Science fiction is whatever we point to when we say it."

 

[Mudd]

Exactly. People have been pronouncing STAR TREK "dead" for longer than I want to think about. But if THE FINAL FRONTIER didn't kill the franchise, nothing will

The franchise won't die - it's a product line that makes it's corporate owners a lot of money. But that's the context in which it matters now.

 

[JD]

Maybe Tarantino's rumored project, if it ever happens, will breathe some fresh life into it, but as of now Star Trek has already failed.

I don't see that at all, right now we have a movie in the works with an A list director, and a streaming series that set records when it premiered. For years now we had multiple comics every month, and while they are on a break now, up to this year we've been getting at least one Trek book a month. The break in novels is temporary and once the issues are resolved we should be to the regular schedule.

Star Wars probably has some life left in it. Fans may have hated TLJ (to no one's great surprise), but it made money and normies liked it well enough.

Star Wars definitely still has a ton of life in it. Some of the hardcore fans might now have been happy with TLJ, but a lot of people did like, and it's still one of the top movies of all time. I also see stuff about Solo almost every day, Star Wars: Rebels is pretty popular, we are getting multiple comics every month, we are getting several books a year, and there is a pretty constant flow of merchandise on store shelves. The franchise is really on an upswing in popularity right now, and not even close to being in any kind of trouble.

 

[Mudd]

Tarantino's movie may well be an interesting act of creation. STD is product and matters in the same sense that a Big Mac does: to satiate the present appetite of those who like it.

 

[Valenti]

As a writer? Always. For his personal opinion on what boxes to sort things into? Not particularly.

damon knight proposed the only workable definition: "Science fiction is whatever we point to when we say it."

Sure, let's not listen to Serling here. I mean what did he know, right?

 

[Mudd]

Sure, let's not listen to Serling here. I mean what did he know, right?

Certainly he knew no more than other writers who thought differently.

Your attempt at an argument from authority utterly fails in this context, sorry.

 

[Greg Cox]

Sure, let's not listen to Serling here. I mean what did he know, right?

Nobody is denigrating Serling. Just saying that he's not the final authority. Lots of knowledgeable people have tried to define.science fiction, with varying results. Heck, Jules Verne didn't consider H.G. Wells to be "scientific" enough, so this debate has been going on for a long, long time.

And, yeah, I've always liked Damon Knight's take on the subject, too. (Then again, Knight didn't consider The Incredible Shrinking Man science fiction so we part company there.)

It's easy to point to specific examples at the far ends of the spectrum. The Lord of the Rings is clearly fantasy. The War of the Worlds is clearly science fiction. Dracula is clearly horror. But in-between there's a vast twilight zone (if you'll pardon the expression) and any attempt to explicitly define SF will inevitably exclude some celebrated examples of the genre.

Science fiction is like pornography. I can't define it, but I know when I see it.

 

[Dream]

Serling was astonishingly versatile and talented. He could do science fiction ("The Lonely," "The Obsolete Man"), fantasy ("One for the Angels," "The Night of the Meek"), and horror ("The Dummy," "The After Hours"), and all on the same TV show.

And I've often argued that PLANET OF THE APES (which he co-scripted) is basically the biggest and most expensive TZ ep of all time, right down to Serling's trademark twist ending.

STOP IT! You are making me want to rewatch TZ again.

 

[The Old Mixer]

They are just generic space operas - one's metaphysical, one mythological. They have their differences but can say something just as iconic or game changing come along and throw a monkey wrench into the whole greedy system?

Can something be generic and iconic at the same time?

 

[Greg Cox]

STOP IT! You are making me want to rewatch TZ again.

My work here is done.

 

[Noname Given]

What to replace them with? How about this?

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