No but feel free to interrupt anytime you want.
Remastered Shots vs. Original Shots
- Thread starter FalTorPan
- Start date
3D Master
Rear Admiral
Un ffing believable! I cannot believe the utter ridiculousness of this statement. No, the images prove the exact opposite, the images prove that it would look great, if not fantastic in HD.
Except that the San Francisco shown in the original is completely different from the DE. (The DE being in line with TNG, DS9 San Francisco.) The DE also misses the poignent, "We create our gods in our own image" line.
Also, whether or not the DE is better doesn't matter. What matters is that the original is gone. It's rewriting history. It's using a computer to make a "better" version and print over the Mona Lisa. One does not do this. If you wish to make a "better" version with a computer, you leave the original alone, and hope the museum deigns to put your version next to the original Mona Lisa.
Good lord. Did you even @#$%ing click on the HD images of the original VFX shots? I don't care how much clean-up one does to remove grain, dirt and scratches, they'd still look like blurry, double-exposed, 16mm shit. Do oyu think we're blind?
There are days where I cannot believe the deliberate obtuseness of some TOS Purists.
3D Master
Rear Admiral
Good lord. Did you even @#$%ing click on the HD images of the original VFX shots? I don't care how much clean-up one does to remove grain, dirt and scratches, they'd still look like blurry, double-exposed, 16mm shit. Do oyu think we're blind?
There are days where I cannot believe the deliberate obtuseness of some TOS Purists.
Obviously you've never seen the state of the Star Wars masters and other masters before they get cleaned up. They are ALL like that, and WORSE. Yet after the cleanup is over, they look pristine. It's the people who believe crap like "the SFX can't be properly made for HD", that are the obtuse ones. To blinded by blind belief in whatever anyone says to think for themselves.
ST-One
Vice Admiral
3D Master
Rear Admiral
3D Master, you and I agree on many issues. It's too bad you can't just express them and not resort to insulting the person that makes the opposite point.
And before he says it, Gep Malakai, you started it.
I don't insult anyone who doesn't insult me first.
Are you saying all the copies of the original theatrical version were destroyed?
If they can't be bought, it's the exact same thing.
ST-One
Vice Admiral
Have you seen what was done to the picture quality of 'Gone with the Wind'?
Up until the restoration the images were blurry, out of focus and in some cases even warped.
Do you know how they restored the original picture quality? They used the very original prints and re-cut, re-colored and re-composited the whole film from scratch.
This is not possible with the the TOS-VFX since the original (35 mm) prints of these shots no longer exist.
ST-One
Vice Admiral
3D Master, you and I agree on many issues. It's too bad you can't just express them and not resort to insulting the person that makes the opposite point.
And before he says it, Gep Malakai, you started it.
I don't insult anyone who doesn't insult me first.
Are you saying all the copies of the original theatrical version were destroyed?
So?
Robert Wise himself considered the DE as the final version - the version he wanted.
I've been saying the same thing for ages now. It's nice to see an expert shares my opinion.
The new special effects exist for two reasons. The first is that a certain kind of fan--including those behind the remastering project--wants TOS to look of a piece with the stuff that's on tv right now rather than as product of its time (which is the late 1960s, btw, not the late 2260s). I talked to one guy who would love to see the sets and uniforms cgi-ed to look more modern. The second is that Paramount saw an opportunity to make more money via syndication and via fans who will buy the new season sets while making very little investment in time or money--hence the rushed work on the first batch of episodes that required them to return to the drawing board.
3D Master
Rear Admiral
:sighs: Which doesn't matter. The Star Wars masters were every bit as bad, indeed far worse, than the TOS VFX. Yet, they still managed to get it back to perfect quality. Whether you have the masters or not, doesn't matter; what matters is HOW BAD the footage, of masters or otherwise, IS. And the fact is, they can be brought back from being all but destroyed.
They could do the same with the TOS VFX shots. May take more effort than simply CGI'ing new effects, but it can be done. You just have to be willing to put in the effort.
Are you saying all the copies of the original theatrical version were destroyed?
So?
Robert Wise himself considered the DE as the final version - the version he wanted.
That's nice for him, but it doesn't matter.
And if what's his name was here, he would be able to explain why it's rather ignorant as well. What's the TMP expert's name again?
^ TheGodThing, aka TGT?
And as for insulting somebody who insulted you first, what is this, the third grade? Personally, somewhere in grade school I learned to laugh off others, chuckling privately to myself how infantile they are.
And this whole thread is a hoot!
Oh, come on, now. I'm used to you being out on a limb, but this is exceptional. Your ability to buy something makes it real? A bit egocentric, don't you think?Are you saying all the copies of the original theatrical version were destroyed?
And as for insulting somebody who insulted you first, what is this, the third grade? Personally, somewhere in grade school I learned to laugh off others, chuckling privately to myself how infantile they are.
And this whole thread is a hoot!
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I see. So Robert Wise's opinion doesn't matter, but we should all take you very seriously, simply because you seem to know a little about special effects.
That's very funny.
The new soprano is good but Ms. Norman was great. And yes, the mix is all wrong.
3D Master
Rear Admiral
^ TheGodThing, aka TGT?
Oh, come on, now. I'm used to you being out on a limb, but this is exceptional. Your ability to buy something makes it real? A bit egocentric, don't you think?Are you saying all the copies of the original theatrical version were destroyed?
And as for insulting somebody who insulted you first, what is this, the third grade? Personally, somewhere in grade school I learned to laugh off others, chuckling privately to myself how infantile they are.
And this whole thread is a hoot!
You're obviously have a problem with thinking, do you?
Not making the original available to the public, is akin to making a new Mona Lisa on the computer, hang it in the place of the original, and lock the original away in a basement behind lock and key.
Hey, the Mona Lisa still exists, it's still real. Nobody can see it, but I'm sure you and every art lover one the planet would have no problem with it; after all, we get to so the better modern computer version and the original one still exists.
It's not about buying it, you moron, it's about WATCHING it. And if it's not available, and never again will be available, people can't anymore.
Ah, so when Leonardo DaVinci is resurrected from the grave, looks at the new computer generated Mona Lisa, and says; "Hey, it's okay! Yeah, I can live with this. It may even be better than my original." You have no problem with looking at the computer generated new one for the rest of eternity, while the original one gets locked away in a basement, right?
3D Master
Rear Admiral
^
Thank you for acknowledging you have lost the discussion.
'cept the original ain't locked away in a basement. In fact, I've got all the original versions on DVD in my living room, unless the Paramount stormtroopers come and take them away.
Oh, wait. I don't think Paramount has stormtroopers.
Besides. I like TOS-R. Also, you can still get the originals. And you can download them.
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And the theatrical version of TMP is shown in theaters every so often. It was shown in Los Angeles just a few months ago.
It's still out there.
There are many great performances by the Grateful Dead that are locked away in their vault. I am waiting for them to be released, sometimes patiently, sometimes impatiently. A clean copy of their run at Winterland in June of 1977 would be at the top of my list. The fact that all I have is a questionable sounding bootleg copy of those shows makes no impact on my enjoyment of the tapes. Yes, I would like a cleaner version, but if the only one that I can have is the one I've got now, then that's OK. At least I have that.
Or as the Grateful Dead once sang,
Nine mile skid
on a ten mile ride
Hot as a pistol
but cool inside
Cat on a tin roof
Dogs in a pile
Nothing left to do but
smile, smile, smile.
(An appropriate post, I must say, on the 13th anniversary of Jerry Garcia's death. We still miss you, Jerry.)
It's still out there.
There are many great performances by the Grateful Dead that are locked away in their vault. I am waiting for them to be released, sometimes patiently, sometimes impatiently. A clean copy of their run at Winterland in June of 1977 would be at the top of my list. The fact that all I have is a questionable sounding bootleg copy of those shows makes no impact on my enjoyment of the tapes. Yes, I would like a cleaner version, but if the only one that I can have is the one I've got now, then that's OK. At least I have that.
Or as the Grateful Dead once sang,
Nine mile skid
on a ten mile ride
Hot as a pistol
but cool inside
Cat on a tin roof
Dogs in a pile
Nothing left to do but
smile, smile, smile.
(An appropriate post, I must say, on the 13th anniversary of Jerry Garcia's death. We still miss you, Jerry.)
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