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Remake a Series

Which Trek television series would you remake?

  • TOS

    Votes: 10 10.1%
  • TAS

    Votes: 4 4.0%
  • TNG

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • DS9

    Votes: 2 2.0%
  • VOY

    Votes: 20 20.2%
  • ENT

    Votes: 17 17.2%
  • I'd make a new series.

    Votes: 37 37.4%
  • None.

    Votes: 9 9.1%

  • Total voters
    99
I still say that the very idea of a Trek prequel is a fundamentally bad and worthless one. We know too much about the era in question for there to be anything really worth making a show about.
And yet, TPTB saw fit to cluster 3 consecutive series in the same time period. Why not spread it out a little? The Trekverse has a history that spans centuries. Why not visit more than just the Super!!!!Future!!!!? :rolleyes:

I would argue that we actually know very little about the 150 years between Cochrane's first flight and Kirk/Spock. Most of the "historic" references in TOS are general.

I enjoyed Enterprise because it gave the series set in later centuries roots. The "history" we get in TOS, TNG, DS9 and VOY is usually a passing reference whereas seeing the history play out holds a richer possibility.
 
I'm intrigued by the idea of remaking ENT, but I'll go with VOY.

I would set VOY after the Dominion War. Voyager is pursuing a ship of Cardassian insurgents when both ships are pulled into the Delta Quadrant. The Starfleet crew and Cardassians would have to learn how to live and work together in a hostile environment.
 
I still say that the very idea of a Trek prequel is a fundamentally bad and worthless one. We know too much about the era in question for there to be anything really worth making a show about.
No we don't. We know next to nothing about the First Contact to TOS period, bar some throwaway lines about who was doing what. Think of all the races we saw in TMP. Where did they come from? Who made first contact with them? or did they make FC with us? Please enlighten me as to how much we know about this period that makes it so worthless.
 
Well, we have three to four seasons worth of empirical evidence.:p

Personally, though, I think a founding of the Federation series could have been great.
 
Well, we have three to four seasons worth of empirical evidence.:p

Personally, though, I think a founding of the Federation series could have been great.
I believe Anwar was referring to what we knew pre-ENT. And even if not, we still know next to nothing between 2063-2151 and 2156-2260s (barring the Romulan War and even then we know very little)
 
What I meant was that any "Birth of the Federation" type story they'd make wouldn't be worth it because we already pretty much know how it happened already: We already know that the races all fought together against the Romulans (who were never seen anyways) and formed the Federation afterwards because of that. What's the point in doing the series when we already know how it'll end?

And also, most of the other stuff about that time period would also constrain modern creators too much to make anything visually exciting either. Weaponry would all be primitive "atomic" stuff, ships would be slow moving bricks, there'd be little to no communications or visual contact between anyone, it just wouldn't be worth it.

And we already have a "Birth of the Federation" type story anyways, Babylon 5. The plot would be similar enough that it'd just get slammed by the sci-fi crowd as well.

Just not worth it.
 
BSG used "crude atomic weapons" and pulled off some bitchin' space battles.

And, as I've pointed out before, we know how every World War II story "ends" in the sense we know
victory for the Allies is assured :p
, but it's still interesting to watch whether the characters we care about live/die/face death/don't, and so forth.

Actually, thinking about it, we don't really know who won the Romulan War (it was probably the Federation, because Vulcan and Earth still exist, but it might only have been a more limited victory for the Roms). We also have no idea who started it--we might assume it was the Roms, but there's no guarantee of that.
 
BSG works because they had fighters for the fast velocity battles and the like. Take them out and the ship to ship battles are crap.

WWII, people keep bringing that up but it's a false argument. Because WWII is a real event that happened in the real world whereas with Trek it's just fiction. No point in trying to get people as invested in that as they would the real world.

Like I said, they told us TOO MUCH about the past of Trek for there to ever be good storytelling there.

Plus, if there HAD been a crew who went around doing important stuff like Archer's crew were doing they'd have been mentioned in TOS+. No one famous from the Rom War era was EVER mentioned meaning their very existence would be considered an irredeemable canon violation by the Canon-nutters. And conversely, no one would want to watch a show about a nobody crew who never ever accomplished anything even though canon says that's all the ENT crew could've been.
 
Ok I'm redoing TAS. Live Action, using the recast crew. I mean we have CGI now people. Perhaps as a follow up to the movie -- dealing with a now nomadic Vulcan people, Spock's dead mother, and his other self. Also there is a lot of distrust of Romulans who are suspected of having sent Nero. I'd probably have the distruction of Vulcan be the Federation's emotional 9/11 if you like. It makes people scared and tempts people into making the wrong decisions saber rattling. So there might be a moment where Kirk is ordered to destroy a planet or something, but he knows it's wrong.

Step one of course would be WATCHING TAS.

I'm all for updating TAS but I see NO REASON to use other voiceovers....

3 of the regulars are dead, and I don't do necromancy. I think that's a good enough reason.
 
Anwar, some of the canon isn't even canon and one can make the argument that large portions of data regarding the Earth (or Coalition)-Romulan War was classified in the aftermath, only being declassified when Kirk saw one face to face or sometime between then and the Tomed incident in 2311.

As for the "Birth of the Federation," yes we know it happened after the Romulan war ended in 2160/61, but we know little else besides that. Just because you know how an event ends, it doesn't mean that you don't read/watch a story about the event itself.

If a story is told well, then it doesn't matter what the end point is. The journey is the most important.
 
If we've already seen variations of said journey already then there really is no point in showing it again, we already had a "creation of interstellar community" story from Bablyon 5, we already had a long war arc from DS9, and we know too much about the era from the other Trek shows for there to be anything new and exciting about the ENT period. Plus all this talk of how it was more primitive back then would also mean that it wouldn't even be visually exciting so they couldn't make up for lame plot with good effects either.

And like I said, if there HAD been a famous crew who did important stuff back in the ENT era they'd have been mentioned in TOS. No one ever was, meaning there was no one important back then. Meaning everytime the ENT crew did anything important it would be a canon violation.

And even when the ENT staff DID do something that didn't expressly violate canon like the Vulcan-Andor wars and stuff, all they got was negative backlash for their efforts.

You just can't win with a Trek prequel, because the common audience and the fandom will never EVER appreciate anything you do becuase to them it's all canon violation.
 
Pretty interesting arguments here, but I'm on the side that the period between First Contact and TOS was pretty unexplored, fertile territory.

Just because the NX-01 was never mentioned on TOS doesn't mean that it wasn't an important ship. I don't think the Post-Atomic Horror was mentioned on TOS, but that doesn't negate it not happening. Nor the Eastern Coalition from First Contact for example, or the number of states in the US before it dissolved (if it ever did), or John Mark Kelly and the Ares IV mission. I'm sure there are a lot more examples.

The Romulan War was cloaked in mystery, that's what made "Balance of Terror" so good was the fact that not a lot was known about the Romulans at that point. And for the viewer we don't know a lot about the Romulans of the 24th or 23rd centuries, not to mention the 22nd.

I think ENT had a great opportunity to reveal this history to us that they largely squandered. Watching the early days of the Federation and how all of these disparate groups got together would've been great. On TOS we never learned much about the Andorians, Tellarites, Orions, etc. TOS, or the other series, never really explored how the Federation came together.
 
Actually, there were a lot of complaints over the Post-Atomic Horror that TNG introduced and how it messed with Canon, I'd imagine that pulling out a crew and ship that no other series had ever mentioned before would also be seen as a major canon violation as well. If there HAD been any heroic explorers from back then they'd have been mentioned, but TOS had it be that there really weren't any major figures before Kirk and co were out there.

As for the Rommie War, it was basically just a bunch of flying bricks shooting really slow missiles at each other because the ships were really primitive (meaning the effects they'd have to use for a "Canon-Friendly" ENT would be lousy effects to begin with), none of the vessels were able to communicate at all with each other, and the only interesting thing about the Romulan conflict was that they didn't know what they looked like. Since we already DO know what they look like, that just makes any attempt at a Rom-War story even more pointless. Especially when inevitable comparisons would be drawn to the Dominion War.

As for the "Early Federation" days, they DID try that and even did things that didn't mess with Canon (they did show their work) like the Vulcan-Andor thing. And the fans hated it, along with everything else. All they would have enjoyed were fights with the Romulans from Day One, even though obeyng the Canon would have made them lousy fights anyways.

And the "Federation coming together" thing's already been done, it's called Babylon 5. If they HAD tried for that they'd just get insulting criticisms that they were ripping B5 off in terms of how the story was going and how the ships looked/operated.
 
BSG works because they had fighters for the fast velocity battles and the like. Take them out and the ship to ship battles are crap.

I guess that's a matter of taste, but I probably liked watching the Galactica and the basestars more than the Vipers and raiders. The Pegasus ramming a basestar is the second coolest FX I ever saw in BSG (the Galactica jumping during planetfall is the first).

Besides, as far as we know the Romulan War had battles like Salamis, with a thousand ships on either side, as a matter of course. Lots of nukes going off every which way. I think that would be visually interesting.

WWII, people keep bringing that up but it's a false argument. Because WWII is a real event that happened in the real world whereas with Trek it's just fiction. No point in trying to get people as invested in that as they would the real world.
I think it's analogous. Saving Private Ryan is a fiction, with no bearing on the real world war--but it was interesting (yes, even beyond the pseudo-documentary first forty-five minutes :p ), not because we want to know whether Hitler is stopped, but because we want to know what happens to the fictional characters in the film. (Das Boot can be substituted for SPR for film snobs.;))

Just because we know the Allies beat the Romulans, we don't know if the characters we (theoretically, of course) care about survive. Archer's fate isn't written in stone. (Or was it? I can't remember. Well, either way, it didn't have to have been.)

Like I said, they told us TOO MUCH about the past of Trek for there to ever be good storytelling there.
I still insist we know very little about the Romulan War. It was discussed in any detail at all in only a single episode, where we learned shockingly little:

1)Atomic armaments were the mainstay of both forces.
2)We never saw the Romulans' faces, recovered a body, etc.
3)Some racist jerk navigator had some family members who died in it.

Plus, if there HAD been a crew who went around doing important stuff like Archer's crew were doing they'd have been mentioned in TOS+. No one famous from the Rom War era was EVER mentioned meaning their very existence would be considered an irredeemable canon violation by the Canon-nutters. And conversely, no one would want to watch a show about a nobody crew who never ever accomplished anything even though canon says that's all the ENT crew could've been.
Canon never dictated that no one ever did anything cool in the 2150s (until Enterprise aired, that is:evil:). Canon doesn't even dictate that the crew of the U.S.S. Constitution wasn't doing stuff just as awesome as the crew of the Enterprise. The only U.S. presidents ever mentioned are FDR and Lincoln (and maybe Kennedy?), but that doesn't mean that others didn't exist who were practically as important. The fall of the USSR is never referenced, and some evidence even suggests that it never happened (Chekov is from Leningrad, Leningrad is namechecked in TVH), but we can't assume that it didn't. The absence of evidence for cool stuff happening does not mean cool stuff never happened.

Sure, it strains credibility that the Xindi engaged in a genocidal effort against humanity and then disappeared, never to be spoken of again. It doesn't strain credibility nearly as much for, say, the Klingons to have threatened Earth, or to have Archer head up a task force that faced a Romulan fleet that bombarded Andor. There would be less canon violation!!1 in a whole season where they let their imaginations run wild with the Romulan War, short of completely glassing a Federation planet known to be habitable in the 2260s, than in the single episode they decided to bring the Ferengi into.

Or, hell, in the mere name of the show. I don't think I'd have called the NX-01 Enterprise. Maybe Challenger.
 
Anwar,

What does the events on Babylon 5 have to do with Star Trek? Forbidden Planet had dealt with a starship on a mission of exploration (of sorts), so that negated TOS? Did Lost in Space negate Voyager?

The building of the Federation in the Star Trek universe had never been explored or detailed by any of the previous Trek series. ENT did it, IMO haphazardly and too late in their run to really do a good job with it. Even before the Federation, I would've loved to see more Earth based stories, exactly what was the structure of United Earth, what was its relationships with Mars and Alpha Centuari, or other colonies, etc? There was a lot of potential for political drama and social commentary there that ENT largely ignored.

I also think you are overgeneralizing what a lot of fans wanted. Different fans want different things. I wanted to see the Romulan-Earth War. It made little sense to place ENT right before its conjectural date and not deal with it in some capacity. You might've considered the ships primitive, but even the action scenes and FX on ENT were well done and though some ENT tech might've violated or tweaked canon, I wouldn't have minded if the war was handled well. I did like some of the steps ENT took leading to the Federation, with the Coalition of Planets, the Vulcan Reformation, the Romulan interference with the Andorians and Tellarites. Manny Coto was moving the series in the right direction when it got cancelled.
 
I still say that the very idea of a Trek prequel is a fundamentally bad and worthless one. We know too much about the era in question for there to be anything really worth making a show about.

I would argue that we actually know very little about the 150 years between Cochrane's first flight and Kirk/Spock. Most of the "historic" references in TOS are general.

I enjoyed Enterprise because it gave the series set in later centuries roots. The "history" we get in TOS, TNG, DS9 and VOY is usually a passing reference whereas seeing the history play out holds a richer possibility.

We don't know bupkis about the Birth of the Federation era other than general outlines of how it turned out. Band of Brothers, and other historical epics are interesting even when you know who wins the war.

Heck I just watched Ken Burns' The Civil War documentary - not even with the fun of fictionalized characters - and was fascinated despite having a pretty clear idea of not only how the war turns out but also most of the battles. Being spoiled on Gettysburg sucked, but overall it was riveting. :D
WWII, people keep bringing that up but it's a false argument. Because WWII is a real event that happened in the real world whereas with Trek it's just fiction. No point in trying to get people as invested in that as they would the real world.
That makes absolutely no sense. Sci fi "history" is interesting for precisely the same reasons real historical fiction is interesting - we don't give a frak about the big picture, but we can be induced to care about the fates of individual people caught up in dramatic events. Whether the larger events are real or fictionalized makes no difference.

A lot of historical fiction is about made up characters anyway - or if based on real life characters, they are often fictionalized to a great degree. Why is the life of a Roman solider more or less interesting than the life of a Cardassian soldier? Both can be fascinating if handled correctly and what makes or breaks the characters will be the same general things.

I can see how a documentary about science fiction events might fall flat, lacking the interest provided by the fictional or real-life characters being dramatized, but as long as we have characters to carry us through the story, whether the story is based on real life events or totally made up hardly matters.

For that matter a lot of non sci fi is based on totally made up events. Sherlock Holmes just to cite a random example - none of that shit ever happened in addition to Sherlock not existing. Both the plotline and the characters are inventions. Is it therefore totally uninteresting?

And the "Federation coming together" thing's already been done, it's called Babylon 5. If they HAD tried for that they'd just get insulting criticisms that they were ripping B5 off in terms of how the story was going and how the ships looked/operated.
If you're going to worry about fans bitching their heads off that X is a ripoff of Y or X is not as good as Y, then no sci fi should ever be made ever again. :rommie: Because that is utterly and completely predictable and can never be avoided under any conceivable circumstances.

And for Star Trek to swipe a bit or even a lot from B5 is fine with me. B5 was a long time ago, most folks who would watch a new Trek series have never seen B5, and if they saw it, have forgotten big chunks of it (I sure have), and there's nothing new under the sun anyway so general plotlines are going to be repeated regardless of how hard you try to be original.

If you don't want to watch BOTF, then don't. There are plenty of people here who are very interested in this topic and I suspect we're representative of a lot more people out there who might appreciate such as series as well.
 
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Well, yes people do say that FP did have a lot to do with TOS and LiS did inspire VOY a lot.

Like I said, B5 had the same type of "building a joint-community" story with it's warring races and the like and as such it's the chief example ENT's own take on the Birth of the Federation would be. As such the core similarities would draw comparisons and inevitable negativity from the fanbase in the form of "they're just ripping off B5 with thei insterllar community stuff" no matter how well it could be done by the ENT team.

As for politics, ENT did try that even in it's first season and got nothing but negative reactions for it which would discourage any further attempts. Why bother doing it when our every attempt has been rejected by the fandom no matter what? At best they'd just get "this is nice and all but it's not what Trek is about because it's just about the humans".

Most fans just blathered on about "I don't care about Vulcans and Andorians being enemies, I don't care about how Humans and Vulcans weren't always okay with each other, I don't care that maybe there were other enemy races, I just want to see fights with the Romulans!".

Spock said they were primitive ships with primitive weapons, meaning even the effects would have to be even more dated from what we saw in TOS otherwise it's just inciting another "The tech and effects are too good looking! This is a slap in the face to everyone who worked on TOS!".

The war couldn't be done well, if canon was preserved, because this means that the opposing sides would never even meet or anything. They wouldn't even be able to use the Remans as soldiers the Allies could see because the fandom would be in an up-roar over the Remans being in the war even though it would make sense. Why? Because TOS never said the Remans were in the war.

The Coalition of Planets, Vulcan Reformation, Andor-Vulcan tensions, none of this stuff violated canon yet STILL got nothing but negativity from the fandom. It's all the proof needed to know that they'd never accept anything the staff could come up with no matter HOW well done or canon-friendly it was.

As mentioned by Myasishchev, the Xindi made the "fans" have a field day even though they don't violate canon either. If it had been the Klingons or the Romulans who did it, the fans would have howled their guts out over it too since no other show mentioned Florida getting zapped.

As for naming the ship Enterprise, they'd just incit further fan wrath by doing so because they'd go "TOS+ never mentioned a ship with that name, so it doesn't exist!" along with "TOS+ never said there were famous people back then, and if they HAD existed they would've been mentioned! The whole show is a slap in the face to everyone who made every episode of Trek before this series!".
 
Well, I would remake ENT, only because I know more about it than any other series, and I think the basic concept was really solid and could have made for a fantastic series. The problem was in the execution. I posted this a couple months ago in the ENT forum, but I haven't really changed my mind on any of it since then, so I might as well just repost it.

This list is more about the characters than the plot, but the plot is already pretty obvious--Earth is expanding, the Vulcans are wary, the Andorians and Tellarites are bickering, the Orions are scheming, the Klingons are marauding, and the Romulans are behind the scenes, plotting to destabilize them all so they can conquer the region.

  • Earth wouldn't be so helpless. The hero ship being Earth's newest and most advanced ship is fine, but it being the only exploratory vessel was beyond stupid. There would be human colonies in Alpha Centauri, Vega, and Sirius, and these four systems would have a "Home Fleet," a non-exploratory fleet used primarily for defense and policing.
  • The hero ship would not be called Enterprise. My personal choice is Endeavour, a classic ship name that hasn't really been used in Trek. Plus there's an historical quote by James Cook that would be perfect for its dedication plaque: "Ambition leads me not only farther than any other man has been before me, but as far as I think it possible for man to go."
  • Give the Endeavour a real mission from the start. I had no problem with them having to return Klaang, so that could remain the basis for the pilot. But the trip to Qo'noS would take much longer. After that, the Endeavour would venture out to A) seek out new worlds for Earth's booming population to colonize, B) secure diplomatic ties with other spacefaring races aside from the Vulcans, such as the Andorians and Tellarites, and C) watch out for any potential threats to Earth's safety.
  • No Temporal Cold War, and no Suliban. The Orion Syndicate would be the early villains.
  • The Romulans would be influencing events from the very beginning. Their attempts to weaken the Humans, Vulcans, Andorians, and Tellarites, so that they would have an easier time of conquering them, would be gradually revealed over the course of the first few seasons, leading up to the Romulan War in the later seasons.
  • The pulse cannons and non-photonic torpedoes we saw in the pilot and early episodes would remain the Endeavour's primary weapons throughout the majority of the series. Eventually they'd receive some upgrades during the war, mainly thanks to the Vulcans, Andorians, and Tellarites sharing some of their weapons technology. There would be no phase pistols, either. The EM-33 would be Starfleet's standard sidearm, and it wouldn't have a stun setting.
  • There would be talk of scientists developing transporters, but they wouldn't be ready for use by anyone for some time. That means no transporters on the Endeavour.
  • Archer would still be played by Bakula. However, he wouldn't come across as an inconsistent, irritable jerk with zero charisma. This is supposed to be James T. Kirk's childhood hero, for God's sake.
  • Trip would be slightly older (but not outside of Trinneer's age range) to make his close friendship with the decade-plus older Archer a bit more believable. He would also be Archer's first officer.
  • T'Pol would remain as science officer, but would be outside of the Starfleet chain of command. Her presence was specifically requested by Starfleet, but only because there isn't a single human being alive as qualified as her. Unbeknownst to her, she has a Romulan father (one of those unused ideas that I really liked), and has always had problems suppressing her emotions. Eventually her relationship with Trip, and the fondness she develops for her fellow crewmates, would lead to her resigning from the Vulcan High Command and join Starfleet.
  • Travis would be older, and more jaded and cynical. Gone would be the wide-eyed "wow, neato!" naivete. Born and raised on an interstellar cargo ship, constantly in fear of pirate attacks, he knows how the universe operates. He's been with Starfleet for the better part of a decade, but is only a Lieutenant JG because of his attitude and a desire to remain a simple helmsman. His hands-on knowledge of the space lanes and various species out there would be one of Archer's most useful tools.
  • Major Malcolm Reed of the United Earth Marine Corps (no more MACOs) would be the weapons/security officer, commander of the Marine detachment assigned to the Endeavour (as both the security team and as extra muscle in case the ship gets into any trouble), and Archer's third-in-command. He would also still be a member of the proto-Section 31 (yeah, yeah, hindsight's 20/20--it was a good idea). He grew up in a rich and aristocratic English family and can trace his lineage all the way back to the Crusades. Bored with his life in England, he joins the Marines in search of excitement and is recruited into the Section at some point in his career. The Section already knows of the Romulans, and Reed's primary mission is to gather intel on them at every opportunity. He covertly sends back sensitive information, and even sabotages events on occasion if he finds them potentially harmful to Earth's security. Eventually Reed's growing respect for Archer, his friendship with Trip, and his budding relationship with Hoshi Sato (I know, I'm terrible) would lead to his leaving the Section (well, his trying to do so, anyway).
  • Phlox would not be a Denobulan, but a human by the name of Philip Knox (ain't I clever? :p). An older, spirited man, he's a former enlistee who served as a corpsman in the UEMC before leaving to go to medical school. After spending some time in the Interspecies Medical Exchange, Knox has learned quite a lot about both human and alien physiology, and is excited to meet new lifeforms and expand his medical knowledge.
  • Hoshi Sato would be descended from an Augment (an idea that, I think, JiNX also mentioned at some point in the ENT forum). Her intelligence and physicality are above human norms--she's not superhuman, thanks to 150 years of her Augment DNA being mixed with regular DNA, but she's not quite normal, either. She particularly excels in linguistics, and mastered every major human language before graduating high school. She can pick up the sounds and structure of a language far more quickly than most people, which makes her the perfect communications officer. A byproduct of her Augment heritage was a somewhat aggressive streak during her youth--this got her into trouble during her early days in Starfleet, after she broke her CO's arm, and since then she's done her best to suppress such behavior, hiding it under a nervous, quiet facade. Still, this repressed aggression draws her naturally to the Marines, particularly Reed, with whom she eventually starts a relationship.
But, honestly, at this point I think I'd be more interested in doing a series about a ship and crew set between ENT and the Kelvin era. That's one of the least explored eras in Trek, and one I've been the most interested in for some time, now.
 
Anwar, you seriously aren't getting it. The simple reason nothing prior to TOS was mentioned in TOS was because Roddenberry was telling stories about that crew on that ship. He never imagined at the time that it would expand into a much richer, much broader universe. When the writers for TNG/DS9/VOY put in throwaway lines about this or that happening the past, people went "oh so that's what happened" or "WTF?" The Eugenics Wars is a good indication of that since when TOS was on the air, it was thirty years before the EW supposedly happened.

The current TrekLit writers have taken some of those throwaway lines, or events from the past and turned them into entire novels, even though we know what happened, or know that it happened, doesn't make it less entertaining.

I am assuming that you didn't like Enterprise because it was a prequel. Well, what would you have done? kept going forward? making Trek like Bond and his gadgets, getting more and more hi tech and ridiculous? Doing a prequel was a way to get around all that, and make a kind of reboot trek that would appeal to a new, younger audience, hence the reason the first season didn't even have Star Trek in the title.

Enterprise wasn't done as well as it could have been, but my personal choice would have been for a 23rd or 24th century Starfleet Academy, so you can have a 4 year series before they graduate and then move on to a ship/station based series, a retooling and keeping it fresh. But TPTB never really give series a chance to find their feet these days.
 
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