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Trekkie2000
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Regarding Canon: Mr Nimoy say................
- Thread starter Photon
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^ So, which one is you?
Well, it wasn't intended to be a swipe. I was merely pointing out how I thought someone would read your post.
It's always 'okay'. It only has to be entertaining. Because this is what all of this is about. I want to be entertained. Merely adhering to a fictional history isn't necessarily entertaining in and of itself.
I wouldn't.
Exactly.
Yeah, because everyone liking this movie doesn't do it because he really liked it all by himself, but because others are telling him so. How incredibly presumptuous.
It's not. It's the very same thing.
^ So, which one is you?
Yeah, because everyone liking this movie doesn't do it because he really liked it all by himself, but because others are telling him so. How incredibly presumptuous.
I wasn't referring to Nimoy. I'm referring to the lovefest being spread aroud the net by Trekkies/Trekkers regarding this movie. By the way Nimoy was paid to be in this film. What else is he going to say?
Actually, no. Its not even close. Just a difference of opinion I guess.
I knew exactly to whom you were referring to. That's why I thought it was presumptuous.I wasn't referring to Nimoy. I'm referring to the lovefest being spread aroud the net by Trekkies/Trekkers regarding this movie.Yeah, because everyone liking this movie doesn't do it because he really liked it all by himself, but because others are telling him so. How incredibly presumptuous.
Well, my opinion of Nimoy just dropped a couple of notches because of that statement.
Of course when you are making BIG BUCKS off of this stuff that probably affects you opinion.
But I am a sci-fi fan not a Star Trek fan. My standards for television and movies are not as high as my standards for literature. I don't regard Star Wars as science fiction at all. It is barely better than Harry Potter.
But the TV people showed what they think of science fiction with the very first Star Trek pilot, The Cage. And then when they put the show on the air they didn't show the second pilot first they did that Salt Monster episode. They expect sci-fi fans to be dummies and Star Trek fans don't have high enough standards.
This ain't about minutiae this is about doing whatever they think will bring in the BUCKS.
What is SCIENCE fiction really about? The next time you take a flight on a jet do you want the airline mechanics to get the minutiae correct in the engines? People that say they like science fiction but then don't care about SCIENCE just kill me. So how can a person be even somewhat serious about science and throw the canon of the most successful SF series out the window. But if success is measured by $$$$$....then.
But the Federation doesn't use money. LOL
psik
Of course when you are making BIG BUCKS off of this stuff that probably affects you opinion.
But I am a sci-fi fan not a Star Trek fan. My standards for television and movies are not as high as my standards for literature. I don't regard Star Wars as science fiction at all. It is barely better than Harry Potter.
But the TV people showed what they think of science fiction with the very first Star Trek pilot, The Cage. And then when they put the show on the air they didn't show the second pilot first they did that Salt Monster episode. They expect sci-fi fans to be dummies and Star Trek fans don't have high enough standards.
This ain't about minutiae this is about doing whatever they think will bring in the BUCKS.
What is SCIENCE fiction really about? The next time you take a flight on a jet do you want the airline mechanics to get the minutiae correct in the engines? People that say they like science fiction but then don't care about SCIENCE just kill me. So how can a person be even somewhat serious about science and throw the canon of the most successful SF series out the window. But if success is measured by $$$$$....then.
But the Federation doesn't use money. LOL
psik
I think what Nimoy is going through right now is called cognitive disonance.
(Just kidding)Oh and to NCC-1701, really, I respect your opinion, however, you have made quite clear what it is and you do not have to imply that everyone who does not take your view is missing one of their marbles. You get enjoyment from things that are purely made to be entertaining no matter what. Great, what ever rocks your boat. But some of us have a different perspective from you. We have grown accustomed to following stories unfold in a universe as part of a greater narrative tradition which has been built on all that has come before (for better or for worse). Star Trek, in this respect, was unique in its richness compared to other movie and television franchises. The new movie leaves a lot of this behind and in future installments most of the past will be of little consequence. This takes away the fun we had of dwelling on the relationships between each chapter in the narrative, which of course was most interesting when new chapters were continued to be added. So if you can't appreciate that for yourself, fine. Just accept that others see this differently from the way you do.
"Canon is only important to certain people because they have to cling to their knowledge of the minutiae," Nimoy told Reuters. "Open your mind! Be a 'Star Trek' fan and open your mind and say, 'Where does Star Trek want to take me now'."
ok............
I hope it's somewhere internally consistant! YAY!
I don't see where else they could go in the old universe. If they did a movie or show with new characters, they'd just wind up with rehashed versions of previous characters. And that would only appeal to the same dwindling niche audience that they were trying to serve when the franchise died.
The new film needed to be some sort of reboot of TOS. Its the best way to freshen things up and attract new fans. Even if we had to wait 20 years for a new Trek, it would have been a reboot anyway ( someone mentioned rather waiting 20 years then getting the new movie).
The general public associates Star Trek with TOS, Star Trek is never going to escape that. TNG was a huge success, but that was in a different time. And the TNG cast is no longer big enough to carry a film franchise ( and really aside from First Contact, their films are really as highly regarded as the TOS films).
Personally, I consider this new movie a alternate universe. I think the previous universe we have known for 40 years still exists somewhere. Notice how the end of "Countdown" still leaves the 24 Century in tact. With Spock seemingly sacrificing himself to stop the Supernova. I think Spock and Nero either went to a parrallel version of the past or created a new parallel universe by their actions.
I don't think doing a straight up prequel movie would have really worked in the long run. Since then you'd have to bend over backwords to match continuity. And lets make no mistake, that continuity would have been overlooked in a lot of areas. The idea of the Enterprise Crew all meeting in their acadamy days seems kind of contrived for the old Universe. And in the end it would limit you're ability to do sequels without serious violating continuity.
The new film needed to be some sort of reboot of TOS. Its the best way to freshen things up and attract new fans. Even if we had to wait 20 years for a new Trek, it would have been a reboot anyway ( someone mentioned rather waiting 20 years then getting the new movie).
The general public associates Star Trek with TOS, Star Trek is never going to escape that. TNG was a huge success, but that was in a different time. And the TNG cast is no longer big enough to carry a film franchise ( and really aside from First Contact, their films are really as highly regarded as the TOS films).
Personally, I consider this new movie a alternate universe. I think the previous universe we have known for 40 years still exists somewhere. Notice how the end of "Countdown" still leaves the 24 Century in tact. With Spock seemingly sacrificing himself to stop the Supernova. I think Spock and Nero either went to a parrallel version of the past or created a new parallel universe by their actions.
I don't think doing a straight up prequel movie would have really worked in the long run. Since then you'd have to bend over backwords to match continuity. And lets make no mistake, that continuity would have been overlooked in a lot of areas. The idea of the Enterprise Crew all meeting in their acadamy days seems kind of contrived for the old Universe. And in the end it would limit you're ability to do sequels without serious violating continuity.
Sure, they didn't need to reboot, but I'm kinda glad they did.. at least for the movies. The franchise has been languishing for awhile, and JJ Abrams had the juice to pull it back from the edge. Abrams doesn't know diddly squat about Trek, so maybe it's better for him that he doesn't have to learn 50 years of Star Trek history in order to get money flowing in again.
Technically, it isn't actually a reboot. A total reboot would have been far easier, and the vast majority of cinema goers wouldn't have noticed or cared. Instead they bent over backwards to establish some sort of means to reconcile the new film with the established Trek lore.
Simply put, attention to canon is necessary to maintain the integrity of a shared universe. Without it, inconsistencies quickly add up, as different writers so their own things, and eventually this reaches the point that the universe ceases to make any sort of sense, and consumers loose the ability to follow what is going on.
That being said, insignificant details can be corrected or overlooke. Most importantly, the new reboot is a damned good thing.
That being said, insignificant details can be corrected or overlooke. Most importantly, the new reboot is a damned good thing.
