• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Rassilon

Why did they have to make it Rassilon (i.e, the Timelord President in TEOT)? People gnash their teeth at the thought of ideas which have even a hint of 'fanwank', but surely making the President of Gallifrey be Rassilon (presumably Rassilon the Great) is the biggest fanwank possible?
You'd almost think that was Davies modus operandi in his cut-and-paste repetitive specials. Fanwank + Earth in imminent dangger + bigger fanwank + solved by BIGGER fanwank = call it a day.
 
An extension of my theory would have been that when the Time Lord Council resurrected Rassilon (taking a book out of Romana's book when they resurrected the Master at the start of the war) they always intended of deposing him as well after the war but his power grew to overwhelm the Council and no one dared to question his authority or orders (or else they ended up like the Time Lady we saw got zapped at the start of End of Time). I thought too that Romana was leading some kind of underground opposition to Rassilon's leadership and that she might've been the Lady in White we saw lol.
 
^ My theory was that the Time Lord Council was growing tired with Lady President Romana's tactics in the war and felt that a more aggressive stance to defeat the Dalaks so they chose to depose Romana and resurrect Rassilon.

Your theory is definately in character with that the Time Lords we saw in The End of Time would do. And indeed I do like the idea that they foolishly started themselves down the path that would eventually lead to their extinction. It shows how truly twisted the Time Lords had become.

But I like to think they were simply desperate andout of this desperation, they made the unfortunate mistake of choosing the leader with the agenda that gets everyone killed. This makes things more tragic for the Time Lords (all they wanted was peace and it cost them their lives) and why I like this particular theory.

Dude, all but two of them voted to commit genocide against everything else that had ever existed, ever. They were literally not only going to kill everything other than the Time Lords, they were going to destroy the entire fabric of time so as to prevent anything else from having ever existed in the past, too.

They didn't just want peace. They were just as murderous and genocidal as Rassilon.
 
^ Thus the reason they decided to resurrect Rassilon in the first place was because he reflected their own aggressive nature and thirst to end the war in any way possible. I just think even as murderous and blood thirsty as the High Council was they weren't prepared to deal with Rassilon's level and intensity.
 
He did save the timelords during their fight against the giant vampires. So it seems perfectly reasonable they'd revive him to help with another desperate war.
 
He did save the timelords during their fight against the giant vampires. So it seems perfectly reasonable they'd revive him to help with another desperate war.

Well it doesn't take a tactical genius to realize that spaceship-sized vampires can be destroyed using ships that fire shuttlecraft-sized stakes at them.

I can see the Time War going something like this...

Time Lords: RUN AWAY!!!

Daleks: Aha, you silly Gallifreyan ker-niggets! Run! And don't come back, or we shall exterminate you a second time!

Rassilon: Look, if we built this giant transdimensional staircase...

Time Lords: SHUT UP!!
 
Actually, I think it makes for an interesting parallel with Davros. Both were the founders of their respective societies, and both were brought back to lead both sides during the Time War.

And, in the end, both tried to bring their side ultimate victory by destroying everything else.

That's an interesting parallel I'd never considered. Nice idea! :techman:
 
^ My theory was that the Time Lord Council was growing tired with Lady President Romana's tactics in the war and felt that a more aggressive stance to defeat the Dalaks so they chose to depose Romana and resurrect Rassilon.

Your theory is definately in character with that the Time Lords we saw in The End of Time would do. And indeed I do like the idea that they foolishly started themselves down the path that would eventually lead to their extinction. It shows how truly twisted the Time Lords had become.

But I like to think they were simply desperate andout of this desperation, they made the unfortunate mistake of choosing the leader with the agenda that gets everyone killed. This makes things more tragic for the Time Lords (all they wanted was peace and it cost them their lives) and why I like this particular theory.

Dude, all but two of them voted to commit genocide against everything else that had ever existed, ever. They were literally not only going to kill everything other than the Time Lords, they were going to destroy the entire fabric of time so as to prevent anything else from having ever existed in the past, too.

They didn't just want peace. They were just as murderous and genocidal as Rassilon.

What I meant was they were only seeking peace when they chose to resurrect Rassilon. Then during his reign most Time Lords simply fell into place and followed him without question due to their fear of him. Note the Time Lord sitting next to the Time Lady proposing they allow Gallifrey to be destroyed seemed to be agreeing with her until Rassilon silenced her. For all we know there may have been other Time Lords who opposed the idea, but simply didn't have the guts to oppose Rassilon.

Either way, it doesn't matter. Both my theory and Admiral_Young's work and could be applicable. The Time Lords could have overthrown the sitting Lord President, or the Lord President could have been killed by the Daleks, both resulting in Rassilon being brought in to take over. In the absence of canonical facts, all we can do is speculate.
 
Provided their method for resurrection was never compromised in anyway, there is no reason why they couldn't bring back anyone they felt would lead to victory in the Time War.
 
I wonder if the Time Lords resurrected other war-like former leaders. Morbius, perhaps?

I doubt there was enough left of him to fill a thimble.

Surprised they didn't try and contact Omega though.

And by surprised, I mean "that's how Gallifrey secretly survived in my fanfics, getting pulled into the antimatter universe just before the Eye of Harmony went foom".
 
I wonder if the Time Lords resurrected other war-like former leaders. Morbius, perhaps?

I doubt there was enough left of him to fill a thimble.

Surprised they didn't try and contact Omega though.

And by surprised, I mean "that's how Gallifrey secretly survived in my fanfics, getting pulled into the antimatter universe just before the Eye of Harmony went foom".

Well, Morbius is resurrected, more or less from a thimble's worth of goo, in the 8th Doctor radio episodes. But you suspect that, as he was executed, he might not have been saved into the Matrix as normal.

Of course, a good reason for not resurrecting Morbius is that megalomaniacs - in the long term - don't win wars. They win initial successes, but eventually they over-reach and get defeated because of their own mistakes.
 
Well it doesn't take a tactical genius to realize that spaceship-sized vampires can be destroyed using ships that fire shuttlecraft-sized stakes at them.

In hindsight thats true. But who knew what a 'vampire' was a million or so years ago? All the TL's knew was there were these giant 'things' rampaging through space, sucking the life out of planets and that were immune to more traditional weapons.
 
I'm still curious as to how they managed to resurrect the Master after the events of the Eighth Doctor movie and the fact that the Master could no longer regenerate. It would seem that when they resurrected he got fresh regenerations (of which he only used the one to regenerate from Professor Yana to Harold Saxon), the second regeneration of course we saw in The End of Time was botched. Did the Time Lord's just pluck their essences from somewhere? My pre-2005 Who history is sketchy still at best so this is why I bring it up.
 
I wonder if the Time Lords resurrected other war-like former leaders. Morbius, perhaps?

I doubt there was enough left of him to fill a thimble.

The Master was sucked into a black hole and utterly destroyed, yet he was brought back.

The Master - according to the books - was only trapped in the TARDIS's Eye of Harmony, and seems to have been influencing the ship from within there, providing a good reason for the Doctor to get him out (it's very much a matter of hints, but...).
It's also possible that he'd set up some way to store himself in the Matrix without the Time Lords' permission - after all, he hacks into it in Deadly Assassin and Trial of a Time Lord.
 
Perhaps the Doctor wasn't being quite literal when he addressed Dalton's character. It's possible the President's actual name was something completely different, but by calling him "Rassilon", the Doctor was speaking derisively, comparing the man's policies to those of Rassilon.
 
Perhaps the Doctor wasn't being quite literal when he addressed Dalton's character. It's possible the President's actual name was something completely different, but by calling him "Rassilon", the Doctor was speaking derisively, comparing the man's policies to those of Rassilon.

RTD confirmed the character's name is Rassilon. But, to my knowledge he hasn't commented one way or the other if he's that Rassilon or someone else named Rassilon. We all just assume he is that Rassilon, since there's no reason why he can't be.
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top