Question, is Scotty a murderer?

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by Exigeous, Mar 8, 2017.

  1. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    I am aware I'm generalizing the matter, obviously both the military and law enforcement agencies will avoid taking a life if it can be prevented. But my point is, if an actual soldier or police officer were in Scotty's place, they would not face any consequences for killing the guard in those circumstances.
     
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  2. Pauln6

    Pauln6 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Lol - yes I am going for parody. The closing scenes from the Rookie are an example of a cop who should be prosecuted for murder but it's that kind of writing, that genre of violent wish-fulfillment revenge that makes me queasy in a Star Trek movie.

    The base is sitting, perfectly visibly in the Sol system. If it's not a Starfleet base then why have none of the thousands of ships that fly in and out on a daily basis or the automated defence systems not noticed it?

    You also forgot when a black man is all busy being black in hte vicinity of a police officer - and that's not a parody, it's a F****ing scandal.
     
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  3. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Neil The Hippy Premium Member

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    Never seen the Rookie. So I've no idea if its comparable to anything in Star Trek. Though the version of Star Trek in your universe sounds very bland.

    You're really going OTT here.
     
  4. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, I'm not touching that one.
     
  5. Pauln6

    Pauln6 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yeah sorry. We had one incident over here of an innocent plumber being shot because he looked a bit suspicious. It's just jaw dropping that it happens so often in the US that its inspired a whole movement.

    Nonetheless, it does still factor into the notion that just because someone might be a villain does not always justify lethal force.
     
  6. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Neil The Hippy Premium Member

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    I don't think that's in question.
     
  7. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    There's a difference between shooting someone who "looks suspicious" and shooting someone who actually is threatening you. The guard was not an innocent plumber, he was a member of a criminal organization, wearing that organization's uniform, serving on that organization's warship, holding a gun. And besides, Kirk, Khan and Scotty were careful enough to stun everyone else they shot, despite the fact the Vengeance crew had their phasers set to kill, and that Marcus had killed several of the Enterprise's crew, and nearly destroyed the entire ship. Granted, Khan eventually killed Marcus, and everyone else was probably killed in the crash anyway. But still, Kirk and Scotty between the two of them only had one confirmed kill and that was a kill or be killed situation. That's remarkable restraint given the situation and the odds stacked against them.
     
  8. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Neil The Hippy Premium Member

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    And they took Khan prisoner at the end.
     
  9. Pauln6

    Pauln6 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yes, the Rookie, this was not.

    Actually, there is an interesting arc in the NuTrek movies, largely Kirk's arc. If you look at Pike romanticising Kirk's tendency to leap before he looks in the first movie, then the clearly reckless Kirk at the start of STiD, and even the way Kirk hogs the spotlight by sacrificing himself at the end, compared to the more measured, introspective Kirk in the third movie.

    It's like the writers yo-yo'd from gung-ho Team America, to, "Oh actually gung-ho self-righteousness is bad" so let's make that our villain, to something in between.

    Mind you, my jaw hit the floor watching Scotty preparing to raze and entire planet in a Taste of Armageddon. I bought the Gold Key comics and nearly wet myself laughing when the crew commits genocide before continuing on its mission of 'scientific exploration.' The Federation has at least softened some of his less progressive policies in NuTrek.
     
  10. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Neil The Hippy Premium Member

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    No sure a yo-yo works that way.
     
  11. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    You'd almost think Beyond had different writers than the other two, yeah?
     
  12. Pauln6

    Pauln6 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    A pendulum?
     
  13. Nyotarules

    Nyotarules Commodore Commodore

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    yeah when it comes to Star Trek plot is to holes what Swiss is to cheese. Just sit back and enjoy the ride and try not to think too hard.
     
  14. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Neil The Hippy Premium Member

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    Nope. Both would require Kirk to return to where he was at the start of '09.
     
  15. M'Sharak

    M'Sharak Definitely Herbert. Maybe. Moderator

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    While this is unquestionably an important real-world topic worthy of discussion elsewhere, it has nothing whatsoever to do with Star Trek Into Darkness specifically nor Star Trek generally. Let's try to keep this discussion within reasonable boundaries.
     
  16. Pauln6

    Pauln6 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The gently swaying rear of a curvaceous officer with the walk of a strip-tease queen? I am paraphrasing here...
     
  17. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Neil The Hippy Premium Member

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    That would be Roddenberry's preference
     
  18. Imweasel

    Imweasel Ensign Newbie

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    The scene reminds me of the convo Mandrake has with Col. Bat "guano" from Dr. Strangelove.

    "You know what's going to happen to you if you don't get the president on the phone"