"Quasi-Cardassian totalitarian!!"

[exodus]

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:
I was surprised when Capt. Braxton said that. I would have guessed by the 29th century the cardassians would be part of the federation.

No way, Cardies are xenophobic. They hate all other beings but their own. They never would intergrate into a Federation way of living.

But a lot can change after an apocalypse and 500 years. I mean look how fast earth changed from the 20th century to the 22nd century.

But there was still racism as evidence by Starfleet officers hating Klingons for just being Klingons. Kirk did very little to save any race or being that wasn't human. Even in the 24th century, O'Brian hates all Cardassians regardless of their content of character. Sisko wouldn't enter Vic's due to his prejudice relating to that time period. Everyone still has hate for Changlings because they still fear them.

Even though Starfleet officers & Federation citizens try to be better enlightened people, we still are victims to our own prejudice.

Yes but by the 24th century you see a klingon, Worf, in starfleet which is less than 100 years after kirk's time. As for O'Bian not liking cardassians, the first war was still fresh on his mind.
I am talking 29th century which is 500 years later. Anything and everything can change in 500 years. For all we know by the 29th century a ferengi can be president of the federation or romulans could have finally reunited with the vulcans.
If in star trek they can show the earth which has since the beginning of recorded history been warlike, prejudiced, greedy and violent turn into a peacful unified world in less than 200 years then why would it be beyond the realm of belief that the cardassians be federation members 500 years later?

How many Klingons like or accept Worf?

Worf isn't fully accepted by humans any more than he's accepted by Klingons. Worf himself has stated this several times.

Not everyone wishes to join the Federation, least of all Cardassians. Cardassians reject any other culture other than their own. They didn't even want the Dominion around, once they got what they needed from them they were going turn on them and get rid of them.

In 500 years even on Earth we haven't figured out ways to make race relations any better, why would that happen on Cardassia? A planet similar to how Earth is now?

 

[LiChiu]

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:
I was surprised when Capt. Braxton said that. I would have guessed by the 29th century the cardassians would be part of the federation.

No way, Cardies are xenophobic. They hate all other beings but their own. They never would intergrate into a Federation way of living.

But a lot can change after an apocalypse and 500 years. I mean look how fast earth changed from the 20th century to the 22nd century.

But there was still racism as evidence by Starfleet officers hating Klingons for just being Klingons. Kirk did very little to save any race or being that wasn't human. Even in the 24th century, O'Brian hates all Cardassians regardless of their content of character. Sisko wouldn't enter Vic's due to his prejudice relating to that time period. Everyone still has hate for Changlings because they still fear them.

Even though Starfleet officers & Federation citizens try to be better enlightened people, we still are victims to our own prejudice.

Yes but by the 24th century you see a klingon, Worf, in starfleet which is less than 100 years after kirk's time. As for O'Bian not liking cardassians, the first war was still fresh on his mind.
I am talking 29th century which is 500 years later. Anything and everything can change in 500 years. For all we know by the 29th century a ferengi can be president of the federation or romulans could have finally reunited with the vulcans.
If in star trek they can show the earth which has since the beginning of recorded history been warlike, prejudiced, greedy and violent turn into a peacful unified world in less than 200 years then why would it be beyond the realm of belief that the cardassians be federation members 500 years later?

How many Klingons like or accept Worf?

Worf isn't fully accepted by humans any more than he's accepted by Klingons. Worf himself has stated this several times.

Not everyone wishes to join the Federation, least of all Cardassians. Cardassians reject any other culture other than their own. They didn't even want the Dominion around, once they got what they needed from them they were going turn on them and get rid of them.

Worf was later accepted by the klingons. Look at what he accomplished by the end of DS9. He became the federation ambassador to the klingon empire.
The cardassians had their civilization practically destroyed thanks to the dominion. I think it would be obvious the federation helps them recover and one would think they would emerge with a different outlook. And again, 500 years is an incredibly long time for a culture to change its views.
In real history we have seen nations make radical changes in far less time.

EDIT:

exodus said:
In 500 years even on Earth we haven't figured out ways to make race relations any better, why would that happen on Cardassia? A planet similar to how Earth is now?

But in the world of star trek earth managed to solve all of todays problems in less than 200 years. So why not the cardassians in 500 years?

 

[exodus]

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:
I was surprised when Capt. Braxton said that. I would have guessed by the 29th century the cardassians would be part of the federation.

No way, Cardies are xenophobic. They hate all other beings but their own. They never would intergrate into a Federation way of living.

But a lot can change after an apocalypse and 500 years. I mean look how fast earth changed from the 20th century to the 22nd century.

But there was still racism as evidence by Starfleet officers hating Klingons for just being Klingons. Kirk did very little to save any race or being that wasn't human. Even in the 24th century, O'Brian hates all Cardassians regardless of their content of character. Sisko wouldn't enter Vic's due to his prejudice relating to that time period. Everyone still has hate for Changlings because they still fear them.

Even though Starfleet officers & Federation citizens try to be better enlightened people, we still are victims to our own prejudice.

Yes but by the 24th century you see a klingon, Worf, in starfleet which is less than 100 years after kirk's time. As for O'Bian not liking cardassians, the first war was still fresh on his mind.
I am talking 29th century which is 500 years later. Anything and everything can change in 500 years. For all we know by the 29th century a ferengi can be president of the federation or romulans could have finally reunited with the vulcans.
If in star trek they can show the earth which has since the beginning of recorded history been warlike, prejudiced, greedy and violent turn into a peacful unified world in less than 200 years then why would it be beyond the realm of belief that the cardassians be federation members 500 years later?

How many Klingons like or accept Worf?

Worf isn't fully accepted by humans any more than he's accepted by Klingons. Worf himself has stated this several times.

Not everyone wishes to join the Federation, least of all Cardassians. Cardassians reject any other culture other than their own. They didn't even want the Dominion around, once they got what they needed from them they were going turn on them and get rid of them.

Worf was later accepted by the klingons. Look at what he accomplished by the end of DS9. He became the federation ambassador to the klingon empire.
The cardassians had their civilization practically destroyed thanks to the dominion. I think it would be obvious the federation helps them recover and one would think they would emerge with a different outlook. And again, 500 years is an incredibly long time for a culture to change its views.
In real history we have seen nations make radical changes in far less time.

We have?

As I said before, in 500 years race relations haven't gotten any better on real Earth. Starfleet officers are prown to prejudice. What has changed?

Worf was accepted by one Klingon, not his entire people. Being put in a position like his doesn't mean you're accepted, how many like or accept the President?

To answer your question about why not Cardassians: Pride.

 

[LiChiu]

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:
I was surprised when Capt. Braxton said that. I would have guessed by the 29th century the cardassians would be part of the federation.

No way, Cardies are xenophobic. They hate all other beings but their own. They never would intergrate into a Federation way of living.

But a lot can change after an apocalypse and 500 years. I mean look how fast earth changed from the 20th century to the 22nd century.

But there was still racism as evidence by Starfleet officers hating Klingons for just being Klingons. Kirk did very little to save any race or being that wasn't human. Even in the 24th century, O'Brian hates all Cardassians regardless of their content of character. Sisko wouldn't enter Vic's due to his prejudice relating to that time period. Everyone still has hate for Changlings because they still fear them.

Even though Starfleet officers & Federation citizens try to be better enlightened people, we still are victims to our own prejudice.

Yes but by the 24th century you see a klingon, Worf, in starfleet which is less than 100 years after kirk's time. As for O'Bian not liking cardassians, the first war was still fresh on his mind.
I am talking 29th century which is 500 years later. Anything and everything can change in 500 years. For all we know by the 29th century a ferengi can be president of the federation or romulans could have finally reunited with the vulcans.
If in star trek they can show the earth which has since the beginning of recorded history been warlike, prejudiced, greedy and violent turn into a peacful unified world in less than 200 years then why would it be beyond the realm of belief that the cardassians be federation members 500 years later?

How many Klingons like or accept Worf?

Worf isn't fully accepted by humans any more than he's accepted by Klingons. Worf himself has stated this several times.

Not everyone wishes to join the Federation, least of all Cardassians. Cardassians reject any other culture other than their own. They didn't even want the Dominion around, once they got what they needed from them they were going turn on them and get rid of them.

Worf was later accepted by the klingons. Look at what he accomplished by the end of DS9. He became the federation ambassador to the klingon empire.
The cardassians had their civilization practically destroyed thanks to the dominion. I think it would be obvious the federation helps them recover and one would think they would emerge with a different outlook. And again, 500 years is an incredibly long time for a culture to change its views.
In real history we have seen nations make radical changes in far less time.

We have?

As I said before, in 500 years race relations haven't gotten any better on real Earth. Starfleet officers are prown to prejudice. What has changed?

Worf was accepted by one Klingon, not his entire people. Being put in a position like his doesn't mean you're accepted, how many like or accept the President?

I would say race realtions have improved a lot in 500 years. There are still prejudiced individuals but overall societies have and are shifting to a more inclusive philosophy. Just 150 years ago the united states still had slaves and today there is an african american running for president. I would say that is progress.
I doubt worf would be made ambassador to the klingons if just one klingon accepted him, even if it was martok. He would not get anything done if the entire high council and the klingon ambassador despised him.

 

[exodus]

^^That's why he isn't an Ambassador anymore.


If we have a more inclusive philosophy, Homosexuals wouldn't be fighting for their rights nor would minorities still be victims of hate crimes. Jena 6 anyone? How's about those "nappy headed Ho's" of the women basketball team?

 

[LiChiu]

exodus said:
^^That's why he isn't an Ambassador anymore.


If we have a more inclusive philosophy, Homosexuals wouldn't be fighting for their rights nor would minorities still be victims of hate crimes. Jena 6 anyone? How's about those "nappy headed Ho's" of the women basketball team?

I would think the fact that their are laws in nations that protect minorities says a lot as far as progress in the past 500 years. From slavery to shock jock remarks. You do not think that is progress?

 

[exodus]

LiChiu said:

exodus said:
^^That's why he isn't an Ambassador anymore.


If we have a more inclusive philosophy, Homosexuals wouldn't be fighting for their rights nor would minorities still be victims of hate crimes. Jena 6 anyone? How's about those "nappy headed Ho's" of the women basketball team?

I would think the fact that their are laws in nations that protect minorities says a lot as far as progress in the past 500 years. From slavery to shock jock remarks. You do not think that is progress?

Jena 6 is progress?

I have to question what you find so funny about derogatory remarks?

However, that would take us off topic.

 

[LiChiu]

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:
^^That's why he isn't an Ambassador anymore.


If we have a more inclusive philosophy, Homosexuals wouldn't be fighting for their rights nor would minorities still be victims of hate crimes. Jena 6 anyone? How's about those "nappy headed Ho's" of the women basketball team?

I would think the fact that their are laws in nations that protect minorities says a lot as far as progress in the past 500 years. From slavery to shock jock remarks. You do not think that is progress?

Jena 6 is progress?

I have to question what you find so funny about derogatory remarks?

However, that would take us off topic.

I do not even know what jena 6 is and as for derogatory remarks being funny, I don't think they are. However, I do find it surprising anybody considers what that man said as racist. What I find funny is that you think there has been no or little progress in the past 500 years.

 

[exodus]

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:
^^That's why he isn't an Ambassador anymore.


If we have a more inclusive philosophy, Homosexuals wouldn't be fighting for their rights nor would minorities still be victims of hate crimes. Jena 6 anyone? How's about those "nappy headed Ho's" of the women basketball team?

I would think the fact that their are laws in nations that protect minorities says a lot as far as progress in the past 500 years. From slavery to shock jock remarks. You do not think that is progress?

Jena 6 is progress?

I have to question what you find so funny about derogatory remarks?

However, that would take us off topic.

I do not even know what jena 6 is and as for derogatory remarks being funny, I don't think they are. However, I do find it surprising anybody considers what that man said as racist. What I find funny is that you think there has been no or little progress in the past 500 years.

I find it funny you don't know what Jena 6 is after being the top story in the news for weeks.

Why don't you look it up, read about it and then come back and talk to me about progress.

 

[LiChiu]

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:
^^That's why he isn't an Ambassador anymore.


If we have a more inclusive philosophy, Homosexuals wouldn't be fighting for their rights nor would minorities still be victims of hate crimes. Jena 6 anyone? How's about those "nappy headed Ho's" of the women basketball team?

I would think the fact that their are laws in nations that protect minorities says a lot as far as progress in the past 500 years. From slavery to shock jock remarks. You do not think that is progress?

Jena 6 is progress?

I have to question what you find so funny about derogatory remarks?

However, that would take us off topic.

I do not even know what jena 6 is and as for derogatory remarks being funny, I don't think they are. However, I do find it surprising anybody considers what that man said as racist. What I find funny is that you think there has been no or little progress in the past 500 years.

I find it funny you don't know what Jena 6 is after being the top story in the news for weeks.

Why don't you look it up, read about it and then come back and talk to me about progress.

Ah 6 black teens beat up a white teen and you use the one event to say there is no progress? I suppose the end of slavery counts for nothing, the civil rights act counts for nothing or the hate crimes laws you mentioned counts for nothing.
I have an idea, how about you read up on what europe was like 500 years ago or what the US was like 100 years ago and compare them with today then come talk to me about there not being any progress.

 

[exodus]

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:
^^That's why he isn't an Ambassador anymore.


If we have a more inclusive philosophy, Homosexuals wouldn't be fighting for their rights nor would minorities still be victims of hate crimes. Jena 6 anyone? How's about those "nappy headed Ho's" of the women basketball team?

I would think the fact that their are laws in nations that protect minorities says a lot as far as progress in the past 500 years. From slavery to shock jock remarks. You do not think that is progress?

Jena 6 is progress?

I have to question what you find so funny about derogatory remarks?

However, that would take us off topic.

I do not even know what jena 6 is and as for derogatory remarks being funny, I don't think they are. However, I do find it surprising anybody considers what that man said as racist. What I find funny is that you think there has been no or little progress in the past 500 years.

I find it funny you don't know what Jena 6 is after being the top story in the news for weeks.

Why don't you look it up, read about it and then come back and talk to me about progress.

Ah 6 black teens beat up a white teen and you use the one event to say there is no progress? I suppose the end of slavery counts for nothing, the civil rights act counts for nothing or the hate crimes laws you mentioned counts for nothing.
I have an idea, how about you read up on what europe was like 500 years ago or what the US was like 100 years ago and compare them with today then come talk to me about there not being any progress.

You didn't even get the events of Jena 6 correct.

BTW, I never said one reply either way about modern progress. I allowed you to assume whatever you pleased to see what your point of view would be. You seem to be saying because there is no slavery that I should accept hate crimes as progress.

However, once again this is all off topic.

 

[LiChiu]

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:
^^That's why he isn't an Ambassador anymore.


If we have a more inclusive philosophy, Homosexuals wouldn't be fighting for their rights nor would minorities still be victims of hate crimes. Jena 6 anyone? How's about those "nappy headed Ho's" of the women basketball team?

I would think the fact that their are laws in nations that protect minorities says a lot as far as progress in the past 500 years. From slavery to shock jock remarks. You do not think that is progress?

Jena 6 is progress?

I have to question what you find so funny about derogatory remarks?

However, that would take us off topic.

I do not even know what jena 6 is and as for derogatory remarks being funny, I don't think they are. However, I do find it surprising anybody considers what that man said as racist. What I find funny is that you think there has been no or little progress in the past 500 years.

I find it funny you don't know what Jena 6 is after being the top story in the news for weeks.

Why don't you look it up, read about it and then come back and talk to me about progress.

Ah 6 black teens beat up a white teen and you use the one event to say there is no progress? I suppose the end of slavery counts for nothing, the civil rights act counts for nothing or the hate crimes laws you mentioned counts for nothing.
I have an idea, how about you read up on what europe was like 500 years ago or what the US was like 100 years ago and compare them with today then come talk to me about there not being any progress.

You didn't even get the events of Jena 6 correct.

BTW, I never said one reply either way about modern progress. I allowed you to assume whatever you pleased to see what your point of view would be. You seem to be saying because there is no slavery that I should accept hate crimes as progress.

However, once again this is all off topic.

Actually I did get it correct and in no post did I say race crimes should be accepted as progress. Are you even bothering reading what I said?

 

[exodus]

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

exodus said:
^^That's why he isn't an Ambassador anymore.


If we have a more inclusive philosophy, Homosexuals wouldn't be fighting for their rights nor would minorities still be victims of hate crimes. Jena 6 anyone? How's about those "nappy headed Ho's" of the women basketball team?

I would think the fact that their are laws in nations that protect minorities says a lot as far as progress in the past 500 years. From slavery to shock jock remarks. You do not think that is progress?

Jena 6 is progress?

I have to question what you find so funny about derogatory remarks?

However, that would take us off topic.

I do not even know what jena 6 is and as for derogatory remarks being funny, I don't think they are. However, I do find it surprising anybody considers what that man said as racist. What I find funny is that you think there has been no or little progress in the past 500 years.

I find it funny you don't know what Jena 6 is after being the top story in the news for weeks.

Why don't you look it up, read about it and then come back and talk to me about progress.

Ah 6 black teens beat up a white teen and you use the one event to say there is no progress? I suppose the end of slavery counts for nothing, the civil rights act counts for nothing or the hate crimes laws you mentioned counts for nothing.
I have an idea, how about you read up on what europe was like 500 years ago or what the US was like 100 years ago and compare them with today then come talk to me about there not being any progress.

You didn't even get the events of Jena 6 correct.

BTW, I never said one reply either way about modern progress. I allowed you to assume whatever you pleased to see what your point of view would be. You seem to be saying because there is no slavery that I should accept hate crimes as progress.

However, once again this is all off topic.

Actually I did get it correct and in no post did I say race crimes should be accepted as progress. Are you even bothering reading what I said?

Nope because it's off topic.

 

[Akiraprise]

exodus, LiChiu the off topic portion of your posts needs to go to TNZ.
Why don't you start a topic in there about racism etc? I bet you'd get quite a bit of discussion on it.
Thanks

 

[LiChiu]

Akiraprise said:
exodus, LiChiu the off topic portion of your posts needs to go to TNZ.
Why don't you start a topic in there about racism etc? I bet you'd get quite a bit of discussion on it.
Thanks

What is TNZ?

 

[exodus]

LiChiu said:

Akiraprise said:
exodus, LiChiu the off topic portion of your posts needs to go to TNZ.
Why don't you start a topic in there about racism etc? I bet you'd get quite a bit of discussion on it.
Thanks

What is TNZ?

The Neutral Zone.

It's the last forum on the site. It's for mature debates ranging from politics to religion to race relations & sexuality topics. You have to ask permission to be allowed in. It's almost no holds barred and not for the thin-skinned.

 

[LiChiu]

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

Akiraprise said:
exodus, LiChiu the off topic portion of your posts needs to go to TNZ.
Why don't you start a topic in there about racism etc? I bet you'd get quite a bit of discussion on it.
Thanks

What is TNZ?

The Neutral Zone.

It's the last forum on the site. It's for mature debates ranging from politics to religion to race relations & sexuality topics. You have to ask permission to be allowed in. It's almost no holds barred and not for the thin-skinned.

Interesting, who do I ask?

 

[exodus]

LiChiu said:

exodus said:

LiChiu said:

Akiraprise said:
exodus, LiChiu the off topic portion of your posts needs to go to TNZ.
Why don't you start a topic in there about racism etc? I bet you'd get quite a bit of discussion on it.
Thanks

What is TNZ?

The Neutral Zone.

It's the last forum on the site. It's for mature debates ranging from politics to religion to race relations & sexuality topics. You have to ask permission to be allowed in. It's almost no holds barred and not for the thin-skinned.

Interesting, who do I ask?

Send me a PM and I'll show you.

We aren't supposed to talk about anything other than the main subjects of the post outside of TNZ or else you get a "warning" for it.