Potentially U.S. backed coup in Mali

[the 4th hanson bro]

Why isn't this in TNZ?

Because some posters can't take the heat.

That isn't an excuse. I remember back in the day many a political and controversial threads getting shut down in MISC and the other fora because they belonged in TNZ. This thread should be shut down, or at least moved to TNZ where it belongs.

It's just fine here. Misc, by its nature is for those topics that don't fit into other fora. Looking up and down the list on the front page, I don't see one titled "politics". I do, however see one called "Miscellaneous" for "Discussion of non-trek topics."

In the future, if you see a thread that you think doesn't "fit" in the forum it's posted, why don't you notify on it so that the mods can all be aware of it and discuss it instead of posting in the thread that it belongs somewhere else and dragging the thread off topic.

 

[Awesome Possum]

Thanks for admitting to not give a crap about what Jesus said despite using words like "Christian nation".

Can you please link to where I posted "Christian nation"?

I do not recall posting that.

It's from when you mentioned the use of the word "creator" implying that the Founding Fathers were Christian because of it.

 

[Knight Templar]

Thanks for admitting to not give a crap about what Jesus said despite using words like "Christian nation".

Can you please link to where I posted "Christian nation"?

I do not recall posting that.

It's from when you mentioned the use of the word "creator" implying that the Founding Fathers were Christian because of it.

Uh huh.

Once again, did I post "Christian nation"? If I did, link to it.

 

[Awesome Possum]

Can you please link to where I posted "Christian nation"?

I do not recall posting that.

It's from when you mentioned the use of the word "creator" implying that the Founding Fathers were Christian because of it.

Uh huh.

Once again, did I post "Christian nation"? If I did, link to it.

What part of "implying" do you have difficulty understanding?

 

[M'Sharak]

I can never keep tract of which member of gang green mods which fora. It was nice when they were listed on the front page.

We have tattoos now.

That doesn't help the rest of us, not members of the board meeting in your special room...

Look at the bottom of the index page for any forum and you will see listed—in plain sight—the names of the moderators for that forum. In Misc., for example:

There's also a 'View Forum Leaders' link at the bottom of the Main Index.

If I had my way I would force people into TNZ. I don't think it would work without some type of Saw-type situation though.

Bonzie just needs to OK you the power. Start moving all these threads into the zone. People will move there or get the idea and stop posting up MISC with fora inappropriate threads.

AP doesn't moderate this forum. One of those who actually do has already pointed out that this is not an "inappropriate" forum for political discussions.

Data Holmes may also wish to refer to this May 2009 post, which addresses the issue in slightly greater detail.

 

[Knight Templar]

It's from when you mentioned the use of the word "creator" implying that the Founding Fathers were Christian because of it.

Uh huh.

Once again, did I post "Christian nation"? If I did, link to it.

What part of "implying" do you have difficulty understanding?

horatio83 put quotation marks around "Christian nation" whe he claimed I had said it. Quotation marks do not mean that I implied something. Quotation marks mean I used those words verbatim.

Which I did not do.

Language matters you know.

 

[horatio83]

Looks like you are pretty pissed off that we totally debunked your claim that MLK was an abortion opponent.
I did indeed misquote you but this is fairly irrelevant as you clearly said, although not literally, that the US is a Christian nation.

Anyway, discussions with unethical reactionary people are fairly pointless. They are happily unethical and no matter how much you point it out to them, they will remain evil.

 

[Knight Templar]

Looks like you are pretty pissed off that we totally debunked your claim that MLK was an abortion opponent.
I did indeed misquote you but this is fairly irrelevant as you clearly said, although not literally, that the US is a Christian nation.

Anyway, discussions with unethical reactionary people are fairly pointless. They are happily unethical and no matter how much you point it out to them, they will remain evil.

Don't worry. I'll still talk to you whether you're evil or not.

 

[Awesome Possum]

Looks like you are pretty pissed off that we totally debunked your claim that MLK was an abortion opponent.
I did indeed misquote you but this is fairly irrelevant as you clearly said, although not literally, that the US is a Christian nation.

Anyway, discussions with unethical reactionary people are fairly pointless. They are happily unethical and no matter how much you point it out to them, they will remain evil.

Don't worry. I'll still talk to you whether you're evil or not.

Ah, the pot calling the dove black.

 

[Yevetha]

Could we go back to our original theme?

 

[Kemaiku]

Hmm, nah.

 

[Holdfast]

Data Holmes may also wish to refer to this May 2009 post, which addresses the issue in slightly greater detail.

I think my cocktail recipe in that thread is more useful, but whatevah...

 

[stj]

It appears that the French are operating through their man in Ivory Coast. Here's a link to source I've found fairly reliable on matters of fact in foreign affairs, mainly because they mostly rewrite mainstream foreign sources.
http://wsws.org/articles/2012/apr2012/mali-a05.shtmls.

 

[horatio83]

I am basically an anti-socialist but many left-wing publications shed important light on issues ignored by other media.
About the article, resource exploitation is something rarely talked about. Even we liberal folks in the West do not do what liberal logic tells us, to either socialize any natural resources or tax away all the resource rents (which is basically a proxy for the value of the pure, unprocessed resource; that part of the revenue of selling a resource that is not essentially labour or capital income).
So yeah, although I don't wanna have anything to do with the hammer and sickle I like it when liberals and socialists find some common ground.

 

[Yevetha]

So you are a classical liberal?

 

[horatio83]

Most of us folks in the West are to some degree.
Obviously there are limitations to liberal thinking but most of the times it is quite useful.
There is e.g. a wonderful old Krugman article about sweat shops. My spontaneous, social democratic reaction would of course be that sweat shops are bad but the liberal perspective allows an honest analysis of the issue. Arguments always beat gut feelings.

 

[stj]

So yeah, although I don't wanna have anything to do with the hammer and sickle I like it when liberals and socialists find some common ground.

The common ground being, I take it, that we in the western countries should try to base our opinions on the coup on the facts, as best we can determine them. Yes, I agree.

I put the hammer and sickle avatar up to remind people in another thread that the Democratic Party isn't leftist. I have a Spinoza avatar lined up, but I may end up sticking with this one. Strictly speaking, I would prefer a hammer and sickle with a 4 superimposed, but the only version I found was a lazy 4 (slanted) in black and white. That sucker was hideous, and this one achieves its purpose well enough.

 

[horatio83]

The purpose of the left is to make liberals do the right thing, the purpose of liberals is to moderate leftist ideas and make them mainstream-compatible.

While I favour fairly moderate, centre-left politics it takes a more radical and committed Left to actually achieve this. When there is no Left the natural reactionary tendencies that any society has become too dominant and we regress. Without a radical Left, without grassroots movement and power coming from the streets like in the beginning of the last century we will not even be able to undo the Reagan/Thatcher revolutions, we will not be able to get back to where we have once been during the few decades after WWII and we will certainly not be able to address the three big issues of our time, financial order, overpopulation and climate change.

I do not share your goals but I will not achieve mine without your efforts ... and I wished more centre-left folks would realize this.

 

[M'Sharak]

Data Holmes may also wish to refer to this May 2009 post, which addresses the issue in slightly greater detail.

I think my cocktail recipe in that thread is more useful, but whatevah...

Sounds lovely - I'll have one. Skip the cherry, though.

 

[stj]

Whether initial reports are propagandistic or I misinterpreted or they were just too fragmentary, I don't know. But the report is that some Tuareg are trying to set up an independent state. This indicates that the coup is in reaction to that, which is to say, aimed at the Tuareg. There is a report that the ECOWAS mission aimed at suppressing the coup diplomatically was turned back when crowds jammed the runways in Bamako. Any popular government is almost certain to pose a threat to French uranium interests, if only because it would be insane not to contemplate changing the current arrangements, which benefit only a handful of people in Mali. Carving up the country appears to be less of a problem for the French. This is the age of the new colonialism. Sudan has been carved up, Libya can be carved up if need be, so why not Mali? It's on the agenda in Katanga province of Congo-Kinshasa too.