Post nBSG sci-fi sex and Star Trek

[Arpy]

What do you think of Trek's portrayal of sex post nBSG? Where should it go from here? How could it have been different?

Note, I don't think nBSG did it the way it "should" be in genre television or it is/should be in television overall.

Simply, where Trek sex next? ...or is that

 

[T'Girl]

I thought the early sex scene between Starbuck and Baltar was the limit of what could be shown on cable plus TV. The new Stargate Universe had a simular sex scene in the first episode, it added nothing to the plot. Were the two charactors in a relationship or simply having janitor's closet sex? Hard to say.

We "know" that Data and Yar had sex, Riker and Ro too, even in the late eightys more could of been shown, but it wasn't important to the plot advancement.

Star Trek Twelve can certainly show a soft R rated sex scene and still recieve a PG-13, if the script is lame enough they might need it.

 

[docrice]

The safe, mainstream tolerance level for sex scenes (er, "adult situations of a sexual nature") will change over time. At this point since Trek has just been revived for a wider audience including potentially family audiences with a younger generation who previously didn't embrace the franchise, I doubt the producers are going to push the limits at all. A lot of Trek has to remain clean for general acceptance, I think. Although I don't mind such scenes in general as long as there's something meaningful to the overall story, in the past it's been used in Star Trek whenever the ratings went down and you could imagine the folks in the studio exec suites thinking, "We need to show some skin to bring the audience in!" Yeah, that's where it goes downhill.

 

[DevilEyes]

BSG's sex scenes were explicit compared to Trek or a lot of US network TV, but they were rather tame by HBO standards. (And let's not even mention European art film standards... ) Skiffy, sorry, I mean SyFy, is rather conservative for a cable station. They have rules about what exactly can and can't be seen on TV, such as 'no nipples on TV'.

What do you think of Trek's portrayal of sex post nBSG? Where should it go from here? How could it have been different?

Note, I don't think nBSG did it the way it "should" be in genre television or it is/should be in television overall.

What do you think?

 

[barnaclelapse]

I'm not too stressed out about it. The right circumstances can bring plenty of sex appeal to Star Trek without raising the rating. I have plenty of other places to get the sex to go with my violence, horror, comedy, etc.

 

[The Wormhole]

BSG showed people having honest sexual intercourse. Star Trek's idea of sex appeal is having people stip down to their underwear and rub gel all over each other.

 

[Caliburn24]

Sex should only follow the needs of the story. If the story has a sexual aspect to it so be it. If it not part of the story, keep it out.

If sex is just dropped in for shock value then it has been reduced to the level of popcorn violence, mindless explosions that bring in the lowest level of viewer.

 

[Kegg]

See the new movie? The one with Kirk making out with a girl, hitting on Uhura, a crack about bestiality, and a nice initimate moment with Spock?

Yeah, I think Star Trek now has a pretty tolerable handle on this 'sex' thing. I'd be pretty much happy with more of the same, though sure, more explicit is also good. Though, really, it's worth remembering Star Trek is a franchise that should remain accessible to kids, so how explicit should never really be more than what a PG rating would permit.

BSG showed people having honest sexual intercourse. Star Trek's idea of sex appeal is having people stip down to their underwear and rub gel all over each other.

Memo: It's not 2003 anymore.

At least say 'strip down to their underwear and make out until conveinently interrupted by another girl so we can see her strip too' or something. The B&B regime is long, long dead and not really worth mocking when discussing the future of Trek.

 

[Arpy]

I think we've seen sex be noble...Romeo and Juliet, and we've seen it be insultingly gratuitous - the aforementioned decontamination scenes...plus the magic Vulcan insomnia curing massage, while we're at it. On nBSG it was often a mind-fuck...Baltar betraying humanity with Six, Kara forcing herself on Lee to drown in it like one would in alcohol, etc.

Two things I'd like to see in the future. One thing that I'm sure is done everywhere in the Federation but nowhere on Star Trek, and the that's too rare on television, in movies, etc, is sex for the shear fun of it. Not for grand supernatural notions of undying love. or angsty couplings sure to go awry. or sad or angry debased lust...but for reveling in the joy of it..of life. ...Of each others' company and beauty and the fact that they're having all these great adventures. Basically, they should be having more sex because they're happy and it's a way to celebrate.

We seem to be re-examining sex in popular culture today. More people are having it in more ways at a wider array of ages. Too often when we're not exploring it as part of relationship drama, we putz around with it as a comical/hot weakness and usually portray it in less than noble light. But I think in Trek especially...showing a time when people are decent with one another and sexually mature, they'd be having a lot of sex for the "holy" fun of it.

The second thing I'd like to see sex explored in weird ways. What are the "unknown possibilities of existence" to explore in regards to sex/relationships? Two things I thought were really cool were the Human/Cylon Eve we're all descended from in nBSG, and the "Ew, that's just wrong" scene in Galaxyquest when Tech Sergeant Chen does it with the Thermian lady in her natural tentacled form.

So these are the types of things I'd like to see explored for all their good and ill on sci-fi, in Trek, and entertainment overall. If sex ain't bad, prove it, I say. Tickle my mind with a fine story as well as my...with fine fingers.

 

[DevilEyes]

See the new movie? The one with Kirk making out with a girl, hitting on Uhura, a crack about bestiality, and a nice initimate moment with Spock?

Yeah, I think Star Trek now has a pretty tolerable handle on this 'sex' thing. I'd be pretty much happy with more of the same, though sure, more explicit is also good. Though, really, it's worth remembering Star Trek is a franchise that should remain accessible to kids, so how explicit should never really be more than what a PG rating would permit.

Star Trek has dealt with genocide, torture, terrorism, organ harvesting, and let's not forget all the cases of attempted rape (at least twice in TOS) or mind rape (almost every time Deanna Troi had a centric episode in TNG, plus "Nemesis"). Is this all accessible for kids? If it is, then I don't see what the fuss is about sex, consensual sex between adults.

Sex should only follow the needs of the story. If the story has a sexual aspect to it so be it. If it not part of the story, keep it out.

Which is exactly the difference between the sex scenes in BSG, most of which had a real importance for the story or characterization, and the scene of Trip and T'Pol rubbing gel over each other, which isn't even a sex scene but it's obviously there just to be 'hot' and titillating.

 

[Browncoat]

I don't mind sex in the story if it in fact adds to the story. However, like Google Adsense, I think most of the time it's there less to connect you with what you might be interested in and more to raise ad dollars for the site owner, so to speak.

I was disappointed in Trek the several times they stooped to sex appeal to drag in the viewers because of poor ratings (7of9's catsuit, for instance) and yes, I was one of the viewers that was turned off by such an obvious grab for ratings. I have high standards in my SF.

In Firefly, sex was a key element to several parts of the story, and it was done very well. There was some gratuitous Inara bathing scenes, but those weren't really a highlight of the series.

 

[The Wormhole]

Memo: It's not 2003 anymore.

At least say 'strip down to their underwear and make out until conveinently interrupted by another girl so we can see her strip too' or something. The B&B regime is long, long dead and not really worth mocking when discussing the future of Trek.

Decon rubdowns were so stupid they should be mocked whenever the opportunity presents itself.

 

[Agent Richard07]

Two things I'd like to see in the future. One thing that I'm sure is done everywhere in the Federation but nowhere on Star Trek, and the that's too rare on television, in movies, etc, is sex for the shear fun of it.

That sounds like the very thing people call "gratuitous sex" and don't want to see.

 

[Anwar]

Yep, that's the core difference: Sex in shows like Firefly or nuBSG was done for characterization or story purposes, and thus interwoven into the actual plot. The sex in VOY and ENT was just there to grab viewers and if removed nothing would be affected.

 

[Agent Richard07]

^ People have complained about the sex on BSG just because it was sex.

I should add that I've never understood why putting in a sex scene just for the hell of it is a problem for a lot of people. Movies and TV shows contain all sorts of things that don't "drive the plot". Sex scenes that don't "add to the story" can be treated like any other establishing shot.

 

[Greg Cox]

Two things I'd like to see in the future. One thing that I'm sure is done everywhere in the Federation but nowhere on Star Trek, and the that's too rare on television, in movies, etc, is sex for the shear fun of it.

That sounds like the very thing people call "gratuitous sex" and don't want to see.

No, "gratuitous" usually refers to sex scenes that don't advance the plot, not recreational sex in general.

 

[Agent Richard07]

^ A lot of people don't even want to see that, so to them it would fall under the term "gratuitous sex". From what I've seen, the term tends to be relative and dependent on one's attitude toward sex on TV or in movies.

 

[Kegg]

Star Trek has dealt with genocide, torture, terrorism, organ harvesting, and let's not forget all the cases of attempted rape (at least twice in TOS) or mind rape (almost every time Deanna Troi had a centric episode in TNG, plus "Nemesis"). Is this all accessible for kids?

It all comes down to presentation. Not one of those things were shown or depicted in a particularly graphic way, and certainly not more graphic than Star Trek's sexual material.

Decon rubdowns were so stupid they should be mocked whenever the opportunity presents itself.

Quite, but the opportunity was not presented.

Yep, that's the core difference: Sex in shows like Firefly or nuBSG was done for characterization or story purposes,

Come now, let's not pretend there isn't any titillation factor here. Firefly for example was admittedly quite shameless in how Inara's beautiful female client was there for fantasy fodder ('I'll be in my bunk', indeed).

 

[Agent Richard07]

^ What's wrong with that?

 

[Kegg]

^ What's wrong with that?

Nothing at all!

I just don't think we should pretend it's there for some other reason. Integrating the titillation into the plot rather than presenting it as something completely independent of the plot or character (as Seven's skintight catsuit was) doesn't mean it's any less intentionally titillating, just better integrated.