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Please convince me to re-watch DS9!

The details of the Occupation and the Federation/Cardassian border wars has never been pinned down exactly, but it goes something like this:

Bajor was an artistic and very spiritual culture before the Cardassians developed warp drive and the Bajorans were originally the ones to make contact with the Cardassians using solar-sail style ships (season 3, Explorers). The Cardassians were also a very artistic culture with a strong focus on family values, but they were impoverished by a lack of resources and their society began to fall into a shambles. In response there was some sort of coup and the military took control of the government, they expanded the Cardassian Union in order to attain the resources they needed to feed the people. One of the worlds they conquered was Bajor some time in the 2310s because it was rich in mineral deposits. They put in place an occupational government of Bajoran collaborators, but the Cardassian military held nearly all the power.

In 2346 the Cardassians used Bajoran slave labour to build Terok Nor (later renamed Deep Space Nine by Starfleet) and this was used as an orbital ore refinery and the seat of Cardassian military power. The occupation began to get out of control due to Bajoran resistance fighters using guerilla tactics, so around 2360 Gul Dukat was put in charge of the occupation with the task of getting the planet under control. He wanted the Bajorans to love him and supposedly tried to end the resistance through peaceful means, but under his rule the resistance and occupation got worse (season 6, Waltz).

Odo was found in the Denorious belt (near the wormhole which had not been discovered yet) in 2337 and was trained by a Bajoran scientist called Mora Pol into mimicking the humanoid form (season 2, The Alternate). He did some investigative work on Bajor and developed a reputation as an impartial figure who had no loyalty to the Cardassians or Bajorans, so Gul Dukat recruited him to investigate a murder on the station (season 2, Necessary Evil). This led to him meeting Kira for the first time and Dukat decided to keep him as the full-time police chief on the station.

The Federation/Cardassian border wars ran between the 2340s to the 2360s and seem to be based on Cardassian attempts to annex worlds with Federation colonies, probably in an attempt to acquire resources. O'Brien was involved in a particularly nasty incident when the Cardassians attacked Setlik III and this experience haunts him for the rest of his life (TNG season 4, The Wounded). The border wars never seemed to erupt into a full-scale conflict, it was mainly contained to skirmishes along the border. A ceasefire was eventually reached, but in 2369 the Cardassians decide to make a another attempt at annexing some border worlds in the Minos Korva incident. Starfleet managed to prevent the invasion before it began (TNG season 6, Chain of Command Parts 1 & 2).

The Minos Korva incident seems to have been a huge blow to the Cardassians, and mixed with the increased pressure from the UFP government for the Cardassians to end the occupation of Bajor, and the failure of Dukat to crush the resistance, Bajor proved too costly to maintain as part of their Union so the Cardassians withdrew. They damaged a lot of the infrastructure during the withdrawal, including Terok Nor, so the Bajoran provisional government contacted the Federation and asked for assistance. Starfleet decided to send a team headed by Sisko to Bajor in order to administer the space station and act as a liaison to their government. And that's where Emissary kicks off...
 
Season 1 of DS9, despite its flaws, still had much going for it. It was like an average season of TNG, or a good season of Voyager :devil:. I must admit, aside from Garak, I didn't much care for Past Prologue or A Man Alone, but, like you, I thought Captive Pursuit was one of the better early episodes. Throughout the rest of the season, I enjoyed Babel, Dramatis Personae, In the Hands of the Prophets, and of course, Duet. The rest of the season was fairly average, watchable episodes, with the exception of two, Move Along Home (fairly widely regarded as a bad episode) and Progress, which I personally hate. The series gets better, in my opinion, from Blood Oath onwards, after which there is only about one bad episode each season (Meridian, The Muse, Profit and Lace, Prodigal Daugher).
 
OH...can someone fill me in on the Cardassian/Bajoran back story? As i am understanding it, Bajor was occupied by the Cardies for (60?) years. And DS9 was a mining post? Did i understand that correctly from the couple of eps i've watched.

And the Chief mentions fighting against the Cardassians. I dont remember there being a Cardassian - Federation war ever mentioned TNG.

So why did the Cardassians give up DS9? And why was ODO working there as security chief? One would think the Cardassians would have one of their own as security chief.

You understand the Cardassian/Bajoran backstory perfectly.

Not a TNG fan so I don't really understand the Chief's anti-Cardie war, but maybe a TNG fan can explain that one.

It's never exactly explained why Cardassians gave up DS9; it is implied a couple of times that it is because they stripped all of the resources from Bajor; it is also implied a couple of times that terrorists like Kira caused them to give up the occupation. Not sure if you are asking why they gave up the occupation or just the station. It's never explained why they didn't destroy the station when they ended the occupation.

Why Odo was Chief of Security during the occupation is explained excellently in the episode Necessary Evil so feel free to go ahead and watch that episode right now to find the answers you seek. :techman:
 
OH...can someone fill me in on the Cardassian/Bajoran back story? As i am understanding it, Bajor was occupied by the Cardies for (60?) years. And DS9 was a mining post? Did i understand that correctly from the couple of eps i've watched.

And the Chief mentions fighting against the Cardassians. I dont remember there being a Cardassian - Federation war ever mentioned TNG.

So why did the Cardassians give up DS9? And why was ODO working there as security chief? One would think the Cardassians would have one of their own as security chief.

You understand the Cardassian/Bajoran backstory perfectly.

Not a TNG fan so I don't really understand the Chief's anti-Cardie war, but maybe a TNG fan can explain that one.

It's never exactly explained why Cardassians gave up DS9; it is implied a couple of times that it is because they stripped all of the resources from Bajor; it is also implied a couple of times that terrorists like Kira caused them to give up the occupation. Not sure if you are asking why they gave up the occupation or just the station. It's never explained why they didn't destroy the station when they ended the occupation.

Why Odo was Chief of Security during the occupation is explained excellently in the episode Necessary Evil so feel free to go ahead and watch that episode right now to find the answers you seek. :techman:

You can make the argument that Terok Nor was left as a lasting symbol of Occupation for the Bajorians to remember and deal with. Now it is the fact that they left Empok Nor derelict I can't explain.
 
the Klingon sisters and their Klingon Kleavage

OMG, I will never see the word "cleavage" again w/o remembering this and laughing. Great phrase!

LOL! Glad you like it!

GODBEN & DEVILEYES, thank you for 'splainin' the history to me. It helps alot!

So, last night we rewatched Q-less and Dax as i was still thinking i shouldnt skip any episodes. Last night's viewing convinced me that i MUST skip episodes or else i might give up the whole 'giving DS9 another try.' They were both awful in my opinion. The little information or character traits garnered from those two episodes were NOT worth the two hours of my life that i will never get back. (yeah, i know, its less than two hours in reality)...

The Dax episode encouraged me rewatch TNG's "The Host" but that only annoyed the hell out of me that the Trill makeup was redone. Although, i actually DO like the spots better than the nose/forehead piece (Terry Farrell is so gorgeous i wouldnt have LIKED her face being hidden even in such a small way.)

BUT after re-watching "The Host" i came away with the feeling that Trills were more or less empty shells until the symbiant was implanted. That may be my own impression though as we didnt see much of the female host before Odan's procedure. BUT in "DAX" we are given a completely different view of the hosts before implantation.

Did anyone else get that impression (hosts being empty shells more or less) from TNGs The Host?

OK, so i am going to skip the 'bad' episodes and only watch the ones recommeneded. At least for this go round.
 
The Trills were retconned like the Klingons, but since they're less important they never felt the need to come up with a stupid explanation.
Q-Less is a very poor advert for DS9, but I quite liked Dax, even if the titular character doesn't actually do much. The show did take some time to really find its feet and it definitely improved in season 2, but do not skip Dramatis Personae, I love that episode. Also, the other ones people have mentioned need watching.
 
If the poster hated most of "Past Prologue" and "Dax," it may be a lost cause. But hey, definitely worth continuing and not making a snap judgment.

My thoughts: I kinda think people are going a little heavy on the "you must set the necessary background!" thing. A selective run through Season 2 is plenty to establish the characters and tone pre-"The Jem'Hadar." It is in no way essential to one's appreciation of DS9 to watch something like "Move Along Home." Not even remotely needed. One can pick up the flavor of, say, the O'Brien-Bashir dynamic just fine in later eps without suffering through "The Storyteller." There's certainly stuff to appreciate in the early going, I don't dispute that at all. But Yeoman Randi acts like he's on the verge of giving up on DS9 entirely. It's best to jump to some highlights.

The only episodes other than the season finale that in any significant way affect long term storylines are "The Nagus" and "Battle Lines." And neither of them are really essential either. "The Nagus" is a comedy/farce episode, and introduces many of the recurring Ferengi characters and themes. If you watch it and despise that style of show, skip most or all future Quark-centric episodes. If you like it okay... well, you can still skip most of Quark's episodes, because they're generally not as good as "The Nagus." Despite the fact that "Battle Lines" contains one fairly major event, and a pretty decent premise, one can figure out what happened from context later, so I would not call it an "essential" episode.

As far as standalones go, "Vortex" is a pretty good action episode (Odo focused), and "Progress" is an unheralded quiet gem (Kira focused) which show the characters - and actors - growing into their roles. However, they are very easily skipped by an impatient viewer; you can always come back to them later, if you're sold on DS9 as a series. (Some people like "Dramtis Personae" too.)

"Duet" is a standalone that's widely regarded as one of the very best the early years have to offer. "In The Hands Of The Prophets," the finale, is the closest S1 gets to being essential viewing. (But even if you don't like that one, it would still be too soon to abandon the series. DS9 eventually masters telling stories about things other than Bajoran politics.)
 
If the poster hated most of "Past Prologue" and "Dax," it may be a lost cause.

I don't agree with that. There's plenty more to like about DS9 other than Dax and Bajoran politics, like those episodes deal with.

I am bewildered by all the recommendations for Dramatis Personae. I'd say that episode is a barely-watchable, and a lame 'space disease of the week' rehash of countless other likewise-bad Trek episodes from serieses like TNG.
 
If the poster hated most of "Past Prologue" and "Dax," it may be a lost cause.

I don't agree with that. There's plenty more to like about DS9 other than Dax and Bajoran politics, like those episodes deal with.
And furthermore, there are many later episodes that explore Dax or Bajoran politics in more compelling and memorable ways than those did.

I am bewildered by all the recommendations for Dramatis Personae. I'd say that episode is a barely-watchable, and a lame 'space disease of the week' rehash of countless other likewise-bad Trek episodes from serieses like TNG.
I agree, this is the type of episode that made me not care about season 1 of DS9.
 
Reading trentman's "My journey through DS9" thread, I got reminded that some season 2 standalones I almost forgoet about were actually quite good, even though they had nothing to do with the overall arc and weren't very specifically DS9-ish, but they were quite good as a classic Trek episode that could have been a part of TOS or TNG ("Paradise", and especially "Shadowplay").
 
The difference between TNG and DS9, as explained by Sisko to Worf:
Hippocratic Oath said:
SISKO: Starfleet officers often have trouble learning the unofficial rules of the station. There's no manual to study. You have to learn things as you go. A little different than life on a starship.
WORF: When I served on the Enterprise, I always knew who were my allies and who were my enemies.
SISKO: Let's just say DS Nine has more shades of grey. And Quark definitely is a shade of grey. He has his own set of rules and he follows them diligently. Once you understand them, you understand Quark. I'd say that's true for everyone here. You'll fit in, Commander. Just give it time.
 
I am confessing here and now that i havent put DS9 back into the dvd player since watching "Dax". I'm now rewatching TNG.

I do hope to go back to DS9 in a couple of weeks...once i've forgotten how much i didnt enjoy the first season so far....(not counting Captive Pursuit).
 
Season 1 was certainly the weakest season of DS9 (and therefore one of the weakest seasons of all Trek).

However, the show becomes progressively better: Season 2 is stronger than Season 1, Season 3 is stronger than Season 2 and so on.

IMO, the best episodes of Season 1 are:
1x01/02 Emissary
1x06 Captive Pursuit
1x11 The Nagus
1x19 Duet (this one actually belongs in my "Top 5" of all DS9)
1x20 In the Hands of the Prophets

So, you could say that Season 1 starts and ends on a high note, with a lot of crap in-between. :D Fortunately, by the time you reach Season 3 or Season 4 most episodes will have the quality of those mentioned above.
 
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Season 1 was certainly the weakest season of DS9 (and therefore one of the weakest seasons of all Trek).

However, the show becomes progressively better: Season 2 is stronger than Season 1, Season 3 is stronger than Season 2 and so on.
Except for season 7.

It's questionable if 6 is better than 5... I'd say no, only for the Pah-wraiths arc.
 
I am confessing here and now that i havent put DS9 back into the dvd player since watching "Dax". I'm now rewatching TNG.

I do hope to go back to DS9 in a couple of weeks...once i've forgotten how much i didnt enjoy the first season so far....(not counting Captive Pursuit).

I just started rewatching DS9 myself - haven't seen it for years and years, but I bought season 1 and season 2 a couple weeks' back. I've now rewatched it up through "Vortex."

My impressions are different than yours. My recollection was that "Emissary" was a good beginning and that season 1 was a pretty good first season.

However, on rewatching, I found "Emissary" much better than I remembered - better even than "Far Point," which I still really like despite some awkward moments and costuming weirdness. On second viewing, I was really impressed with "Emissary" - with what a great job it did in introducing us to the characters and in drawing us into this new Trek setting, a lonely outpost orbiting a stricken planet.

I thought Avery Brooks' Sisko was sensational - and I am not always an Avery Brooks kind of gal. And I thought Kira was absolutely right, too - yeah, she was bitchy and aggressive. But that was exactly right for her character, IMO. A more sympathetic character would have been far less real.

But I must say that while "Emissary" has gone up - WAY up - in my estimation, the other episodes have been pretty "meh," more "meh" than I remembered. But there have been some pretty good ones - "Captive Pursuit," for sure, and while "Q-Less" isn't my favorite Q episode by any means, I did enjoy it.

So...I'm not sure why you're not enjoying DS9, Randi. Maybe it's not your thing, but maybe, just maybe, you need to watch it for what it is instead of what it is not. It isn't TOS and it isn't TNG. It's something a bit different. Maybe if you watch it with different expectations, you'll enjoy it more.
 
I have been rewatching a slew of dvd's of late ever since america went reality show nutz.There is nothing on anymore !!!!! I will eventually get around to rewatching the dvd's so,no prodding needed here .
 
OK, heres the deal. I own all of DS9, because i owned all the other series on DVD and i figured one day i'd want to see DS9 again....so i bought it. But i didnt love it the first time around and it has been YEARS since i saw it when it originally aired.

So last night i decided i was going to pop in the DVDs from the beginning and give it another try.

And after watching The Emissary i remembered why i didnt like the show. Sisko's delivery. Kira's bitchiness (yes, i know, she has been living under the Cardis etc), blah blah blah.

Yes, i know there are some awesome episodes. But the way i remember it, there were more BAD than good.

i need to hear WHY you all love it so much. Why you recommend it. Can you guys convince me that it is worth my time to watch it again?? Please?

You should watch it again because it was the best (along with TNG) of all the series.

You should watch because it was the last good Star Trek series before things went south.

But mostly you should watch because you will earn $10.00 an episode. Not from me, you understand, send the writers and actors a bill.
 
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