Paul Wesley's incarnation of James T. Kirk

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

The one thing that wasn't really addressed in the episode, but I think they were going for... is that Kirk is apt to take decisive action because of the incident at Tycho IV with the bloodsucking cloud creature.

Kirk has seen first hand... even this version of Kirk... the consequences of hesitating. Of course, he doesn't yet realize how it wouldn't have made a difference anyway.

 

[Trekker4747]

Not in the beginning he was. James Cawley grew into the role as Kirk, IMO. Same with Vic Mignogna with his take on Kirk.

I don't think I've seen Cawley's Kirk, but I was split on Vic's Kirk but he eventually grew on me. Great series too.

 

[Nerys Myk]

n the first season alone, Kirk suffered at least six traumatic events. His college mentor framed him. He was split in two and reintegrated. He had to court martial His best friend. He let the woman he loved die. And twice was exposed to influences SPECIFICALLY DESIGNED TO CHANGE HIS PSYCHOLOGY in Dagger of the Mind and This Side of Paradise.

And he didn't change.

I would disagree. Kirk does change. Although the change is due to the writers picking up on what Shatner was bringing to the part and adjusting accordingly. In-universe we can attribute that to his experiences.

 

[Noname Given]

^^^
You know that's something I haven't considered, I.E that this James T Kirk hadn't had the same Adventures up to this point (just substituting the Farragut for the Enterprise).

But IDK in that I can't see any version of Kirk willing to express his command decision doubts in front of his/a bridge crew which he did in this episode.

Yes Kirk was sometimes self-doubting and introspective, but only with close confidants in private; and never on the bridge when he was giving orders.

And when speaking on the bridges of the Farragut and the Enterprise to Pike and others, this interpretation of Kirk didn't project the aura of self-confidence that I feel both Shatner and Pine always did when they were giving orders or speaking to crew on their respective Bridges.

It could have been a note the director of the episode gave Paul Wesley; I.E. that this version of Kirk should be less self-confident, it's a note I would not agree with. But then again I'm not the one tasked with giving the performance.

^^^
After posting the above I decided to give the The Quality Of Mercy another watch - and yeah, Paul Wesley as Kirk grew on me a bit, and I think I was a bit to harsh about his performance as Kirk here.

- Yes, he's more deferential to Pike, BUT, Pike is commanding a Starship, while Kirk is commanding a starship.

- Pike did one thing Kirk felt was questionable - not immediately opening fire when the Romulan decloaked for fear of hitting the Farragut; and Kirk DID confront/call him out for it in private.

- Wesley's Kirk was never questioning his own decisions/resolve in front of the crew; but he was questioning of Pike's response and lack of split second decision making in front of both crews.

So yeah, I guess I projected what I expected to see of Kirk in 2267 in this episode when Serveaux is absolutely right in that this Kirk isn't the 2267 Kirk I know, not because the actor is interpreting the character poorly; but because this isn't the Kirk I know that was in command of the 1701 for at least 6 months to a year prior to the incident depicted in this SNW episode - and wasn't forged into the character I know and love because his experiences to that point were significantly different, and made him (at this time and place) different from the James T. Kirk I know from TOS proper.

So yeah, I'm now more interested to see how Paul Wesley plays the younger Lt. James T. Kirk of 2259-60.

 

[Brainsucker]

Not in the beginning he was. James Cawley grew into the role as Kirk, IMO. Same with Vic Mignogna with his take on Kirk.

Who are James Cawley and Vic mignogna?

 

[fireproof78]

Who are James Cawley and Vic mignogna?

Fan film players who acted as Kirk in two different series.

 

[Cyrus]

I have watched a few of the fan films and whoever was playing Kirk was always terrible. Wesley is way better. The fan films usually have good sets (very faithful to TOS) and good VFX but acting is always the weak point (at least the ones I have seen)

 

[indranee]

I don't wanna but I fear I'm in danger of becoming a new-actor hater... you know, the ones who joined the Bond, not Blond compaign or the No Battinson campaign, etc...

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[F. King Daniel]

Who are James Cawley and Vic mignogna?

One's an Elvis impersonator who now runs the Official Star Trek Tour, the other did voices for anime until it came out he had a thing for underage girls.

 

[Mudd]

In the first season alone, Kirk suffered at least six traumatic events...
And he didn't change.

That's not a feature. It's a bug.

Let's let them improve on that kind of static characterization. There's every reason right now to expect that they can.

PeckSpock is not NimoySpock, and having seen ten hours of him now I would never want him to become the latter.

 

[starbuck]

His kirk is totally new and different from shats kirk ,maybe with spock and mcoy beside him it brings out the best in the kirk we know,as for looks not fussed as long as the stories ar great and the actors making it good then i'm ok , think by the time pike show finish's they will recast kirk with someone younger

 

[blssdwlf]

I've noticed that Wesley's Kirk is listened to by the viewers despite perceptions he isn't Shatner/Pine. His accusation that Pike hesitated and/or messed up seems to be accepted by many viewers without question despite it was Kirk's character that made the mistakes. So that's a plus for Wesley's as an actor and/or him as the character. IMHO

 

[DaveyNY]

I've noticed that Wesley's Kirk is listened to by the viewers despite perceptions he isn't Shatner/Pine. His accusation that Pike hesitated and/or messed up seems to be accepted by many viewers without question despite it was Kirk's character that made the mistakes. So that's a plus for Wesley's as an actor and/or him as the character. IMHO

Yeah, folks seem to be ignoring the fact that Kirk totally went against Pikes orders.
Orders from a Senior Commander, that Kirk disobeyed.

 

[Ssosmcin]

Maybe

OMG I totally forgot that! In reality Wesley grew up to be...well, Wesley with stubble.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

Yeah, folks seem to be ignoring the fact that Kirk totally went against Pikes orders.
Orders from a Senior Commander, that Kirk disobeyed.

When did that happen?

 

[KirkusOveractus]

When did that happen?

I was wondering that, too, since it was Kirk's plan that was being implemented and Pike issued no orders that I saw. Kirk was justified in raising an objection to the hesitation if he felt it could have meant a difference. It was Captain to Captain, with Kirk looking out for the protection of his ship and crew.

 

[blssdwlf]

I was wondering that, too, since it was Kirk's plan that was being implemented and Pike issued no orders that I saw. Kirk was justified in raising an objection to the hesitation if he felt it could have meant a difference. It was Captain to Captain, with Kirk looking out for the protection of his ship and crew.

Yeah Captain to Captain like team-mate to team-mate. Think of it as PVP match and one team-mate rushes in without proper cover and gets downed and the other team-mate follows into save the first team-mate and gets wounded too which cost them the match.

Pike said to Kirk to "get out of there" but Kirk instead looped to attack. Speaking of delayed firing... during the Farragut's looping maneuver Kirk never fired a single shot until he had his ventral phasers bearing which took 16 seconds to happen. That delay cost him the Farragut as it allowed the Romulan to charge up and fire it's plasma bolt.

We know Pike was out of position as he was on the other side of the comet and he is out of firing range when coming to save Kirk when Kirk requests for Pike to fire. Pike says they're out of range but Kirk says it could draw them off. Pike orders Mitchell to fire even though they are out-of-range. Mitchell thinks their phaser hit was sheer luck. The Romulan gets another plasma shot off and damages Enterprise's weapons control which hobbled any attempt by Pike to go on the offensive. So the fiasco is on Kirk, IMHO.

KIRK: Something isn't right.
SPOCK: The captain is correct. We should be seeing them by now.
KIRK: Enterprise, I don't like this.
SPOCK: Reading gravitational signature again. It's behind the Farragut.
PIKE: Kirk! Get out of there! Red Alert!
KIRK: Red Alert!
PIKE: Erica close that distance as fast as you can.
KIRK: Attack pattern Tiberius 4.
KIRK: Get behind them. (The Farragut loop instead steers head first into the Romulan.)
KIRK: Fire! (16 seconds transpire between "Attack pattern Tiberius 4" to "Fire!")
(Farragut gets hit by plasma bolt).
KIRK: Fire phasers, Captain.
PIKE: We're out of range. We're just as likely to hit you as them.
KIRK: Maybe you'll draw their fire.
PIKE: MItchell, full phasers, now. (Pike issues orders 5 seconds after Kirk says "Fire phasers, Captain")
MITCHELL: Holy... We actually clipped them. (Enterprise fires phasers 7 seconds after Kirk says "Fire phasers, Captain")
PIKE: Nice shooting, Jenna.​

If Kirk got the Farragut out of there they could of then teamed up to go after the Romulan. Instead the Romulan got them individually.

 

[KirkusOveractus]

Yeah Captain to Captain like team-mate to team-mate. Think of it as PVP match and one team-mate rushes in without proper cover and gets downed and the other team-mate follows into save the first team-mate and gets wounded too which cost them the match.

Pike said to Kirk to "get out of there" but Kirk instead looped to attack. Speaking of delayed firing... during the Farragut's looping maneuver Kirk never fired a single shot until he had his ventral phasers bearing which took 16 seconds to happen. That delay cost him the Farragut as it allowed the Romulan to charge up and fire it's plasma bolt.

We know Pike was out of position as he was on the other side of the comet and he is out of firing range when coming to save Kirk when Kirk requests for Pike to fire. Pike says they're out of range but Kirk says it could draw them off. Pike orders Mitchell to fire even though they are out-of-range. Mitchell thinks their phaser hit was sheer luck. The Romulan gets another plasma shot off and damages Enterprise's weapons control which hobbled any attempt by Pike to go on the offensive. So the fiasco is on Kirk, IMHO.

KIRK: Something isn't right.
SPOCK: The captain is correct. We should be seeing them by now.
KIRK: Enterprise, I don't like this.
SPOCK: Reading gravitational signature again. It's behind the Farragut.
PIKE: Kirk! Get out of there! Red Alert!
KIRK: Red Alert!
PIKE: Erica close that distance as fast as you can.
KIRK: Attack pattern Tiberius 4.
KIRK: Get behind them. (The Farragut loop instead steers head first into the Romulan.)
KIRK: Fire! (16 seconds transpire between "Attack pattern Tiberius 4" to "Fire!")
(Farragut gets hit by plasma bolt).
KIRK: Fire phasers, Captain.
PIKE: We're out of range. We're just as likely to hit you as them.
KIRK: Maybe you'll draw their fire.
PIKE: MItchell, full phasers, now. (Pike issues orders 5 seconds after Kirk says "Fire phasers, Captain")
MITCHELL: Holy... We actually clipped them. (Enterprise fires phasers 7 seconds after Kirk says "Fire phasers, Captain")
PIKE: Nice shooting, Jenna.​

If Kirk got the Farragut out of there they could of then teamed up to go after the Romulan. Instead the Romulan got them individually.

Where was Pike's direct order? He was telling Kirk to get out of there as a warning.

As for the delay in Farragut firing, do we know if she had any way of firing phasers or torpedoes from that angle in a safe and effective manner? None of her weapons may have been able to fire at that point, from a safe angle.

The Farragut looping may have counted on the opponent to still be moving. Since the plasma weapon takes all of the ship's power to fire, they may have even had to cut engines, which would have cut most of its forward motion beyond inertia.

Again, Pike in that moment to delay in saying that they were out of range instead of just firing could have made a difference. But, no way to tell since it didn't happen that way.

 

[blssdwlf]

Where was Pike's direct order? He was telling Kirk to get out of there as a warning.

If you're team-mates then it's as good as giving an instruction or order, IMO.

As for the delay in Farragut firing, do we know if she had any way of firing phasers or torpedoes from that angle in a safe and effective manner? None of her weapons may have been able to fire at that point, from a safe angle.

If you watch the sequence, any aft and dorsal mounted weapon on the Farragut (if they exist) would have clean firing lines to the Romulan behind them. Of course we're assuming that the Farragut had more than just the ventral forward phasers.

The Farragut looping may have counted on the opponent to still be moving. Since the plasma weapon takes all of the ship's power to fire, they may have even had to cut engines, which would have cut most of its forward motion beyond inertia.

The Farragut helmsman should've accounted for the Romulan's position regardless of where they were.

Again, Pike in that moment to delay in saying that they were out of range instead of just firing could have made a difference. But, no way to tell since it didn't happen that way.

Yes... Could have made a difference. It was by no means certain since they were Outside of Phaser Range. Now if Pike was in range and they had a phaser lock that's a different story if they hesitated. But that didn't happen.

 

[Ronald Held]

My question is how present SNW Kirk will behavior compared to alt-Kirk?