Paramount going ahead with ST4 according to Engage

[a thousand-yard stare]

and was incredibly disappointed to have no Trek merch in the nearby Forbidden Planet

re. merchandising.
I walk into the local shop and I'm astonished to see the first part of Eaglemoss' Graphic Novel Collection on display.
I think "****** hell! Somebody's finally pushing 'Trek' stuff. Small start, but the way to go..."
Then I reach the end of the road and a bus goes past.
Plastered all over the side is an ad. for "Marvel Universe Live!" to be held at a huge venue nearby.

 

[jamestyler]

re. merchandising.
I walk into the local shop and I'm astonished to see the first part of Eaglemoss' Graphic Novel Collection on display.
I think "****** hell! Somebody's finally pushing 'Trek' stuff. Small start, but the way to go..."
Then I reach the end of the road and a bus goes past.
Plastered all over the side is an ad. for "Marvel Universe Live!" to be held at a huge venue nearby.

It's the same here - though in fairness to them thats two very different businesses. The Marvel Live stuff has been very well advertised!

The Eaglemoss stuff is usually everywhere on launch. Starships (and everything else, really!) were at every shop on their first issue, but like all others only the large retailers stock them as time goes on with smaller places only buying them in if there's interest in the first few weeks - and interest always fades!

With Beyond it was disappointing that the only merch available has been the Pop figures - and those only came to stores a few weeks after release. Other than that the best we found was a stuffed Romulan Bird of Prey that no one wanted to buy.

I did ask retailers and they said there was no demand for Trek. Meanwhile the Trek fans I know (of which there are many!) are complaining to the retailers that there's nothing available. It's a weird circle.

 

[wayoung]

It's not a cycle, it's confirmation bias. Of course if you're asking other Trek fans who collect merchandise they're going to say "Yes we want and will buy merchandise" but your sample is skewed. You're only looking at a limited consumer base, not the general consumer base.

The store managers / owners saying they don't have any demand mean that the products they do have aren't selling and nobody is coming up to them asking for more. So there's no point wasting shelf space on it. If the products they had sold / enough people came up to them asking for more merchandise than they would dedicate shelf space to it. They're telling you that isn't happening.

Eaglemoss is an online retailer specializing in a niche product without the overhead of a brick and mortar retail store. They can dedicate the time and effort to make these products while turning a profit. Your local retailer can't, because every piece of Trek merchandise they have sitting on the shelf not selling is taking away space for an item that does sell and thus is costing them money.

 

[fireproof78]

It's not a cycle, it's confirmation bias. Of course if you're asking other Trek fans who collect merchandise they're going to say "Yes we want and will buy merchandise" but your sample is skewed. You're only looking at a limited consumer base, not the general consumer base.

The store managers / owners saying they don't have any demand mean that the products they do have aren't selling and nobody is coming up to them asking for more. So there's no point wasting shelf space on it. If the products they had sold / enough people came up to them asking for more merchandise than they would dedicate shelf space to it. They're telling you that isn't happening.

Eaglemoss is an online retailer specializing in a niche product without the overhead of a brick and mortar retail store. They can dedicate the time and effort to make these products while turning a profit. Your local retailer can't, because every piece of Trek merchandise they have sitting on the shelf not selling is taking away space for an item that does sell and thus is costing them money.

Yes, just because customers are requesting a product, doesn't mean they will buy it if a store gets them in. Too many stores end up getting product and just sitting on it because it doesn't sell. And that gets expensive, not only due to taking up space, but taxes and the like stack up too.

So, if fans want the product (which I do) then there is going to need to be some purchasing to show interest to the retailers (which I need to work on).

 

[jamestyler]

It's not a cycle, it's confirmation bias. Of course if you're asking other Trek fans who collect merchandise they're going to say "Yes we want and will buy merchandise" but your sample is skewed. You're only looking at a limited consumer base, not the general consumer base.

I'm only quoting this part as, well.... the people I'm speaking of are from a less niche market than you imagine. I'm not even speaking of people within my social circle and only a select few are collectors. My wife and I are traders, and Trek fans - both long term, newcomers and casual - are some of our biggest customers. The reason being that even at conventions drawing tens of thousands of people, no one is catering to them.

While a con in itself is a niche market (ish), one generic, normal people store local to us (The Works) got in a batch of Star Trek books. Obscure books most retailers are embarrassed to sell as they fit into this niche market you speak of. They were gone in a matter of days.

The stores I was thinking of while posting is asked regularly - not by people making enquiries, but with cash in hand wanting the thing (Beyond Pin). And thats not a guess - I know people workign in the stores.

Yes, just because customers are requesting a product, doesn't mean they will buy it if a store gets them in. Too many stores end up getting product and just sitting on it because it doesn't sell. And that gets expensive, not only due to taking up space, but taxes and the like stack up too.

On the same front, one of the recently requested items in a specialist store (I have a friend who works there) are the new Beyond pins. I'm told there's no interest, but people are going wish cash in hand wanting to buy them. The same store had the same requests several years ago with the 2009 pins. A rival store heard about it and bought them in. They sold very quickly.

I don't want to sound condescending (and sincerely hope I don't - apologies if I do!) - but... there is a market. Trek sells. If it didn't, I'd be in a very bad position right now as thats half our merch! The problem is (or rather, was) the elitist pricing. Forbidden Planet used to stock high end merch - £30 for a Worf figure. No ones buying that. A tenner for a Pop? Sold out. £50 for a Diamond Select ship? Nope! £15 for a Playmates? Sold.

There is a demand - but the few products out there are focused on collectors. That needs to change and that has done more damage than it gets credit for.

 

[Relayer1]

It's not a cycle, it's confirmation bias. Of course if you're asking other Trek fans who collect merchandise they're going to say "Yes we want and will buy merchandise" but your sample is skewed. You're only looking at a limited consumer base, not the general consumer base.

The store managers / owners saying they don't have any demand mean that the products they do have aren't selling and nobody is coming up to them asking for more. So there's no point wasting shelf space on it. If the products they had sold / enough people came up to them asking for more merchandise than they would dedicate shelf space to it. They're telling you that isn't happening.

Eaglemoss is an online retailer specializing in a niche product without the overhead of a brick and mortar retail store. They can dedicate the time and effort to make these products while turning a profit. Your local retailer can't, because every piece of Trek merchandise they have sitting on the shelf not selling is taking away space for an item that does sell and thus is costing them money.

I work in one such retailer and we occasionally sell a few items, but there really isn't the demand.

Now Pop! Vinyl........they keep us open !

 

[jamestyler]

I work in one such retailer and we occasionally sell a few items, but there really isn't the demand.

Now Pop! Vinyl........they keep us open !

Could be regional - but then opening that can of worms will make my mind work in overdrive! Glasgow is becoming a geek hub right now.

And pops.... gods, they annoy me just as they've taken over everywhere! Two of the major gek stores are pretty much pop vendors now. Even Forbidden Planet is lined with them now.

 

[wayoung]

Again, you're only relating a small sample, and a skewed sample at that. You're trying to assert your anecdotal "Well, I heard this person wants go buy stuff" over the stores that retail merchandise actual sales data. You talked to the managers. They told you the merchandise isn't selling and doesn't have enough of a demand so they aren't carrying much of it. If it was flying off the shelves then the shelves would be full of it. The people who make the merchandise have no doubt done tons of controlled surveys to figure out what the market is and the people running the stores that track the merchandise no doubt know exactly what is selling and isn't. You're comparing your anecdotal conversations against their hard data.

Of course there's a market - there's a market for everything, hence eBay - but that question is how big the market is. You're relating your own sales in geek markets to general consumers in mass market retail stores and saying that if you have this much demand these other stores must secretly have it too and just aren't fulfilling that demand - and the actual stores are telling you no, that's not the case.

My anecdotal evidence? My Walmart's had the same foot of shelf space with the same unbought Trek merchandise sitting there for months. Same $7 - $15 action figires/dolls, same hot wheels toys.


I don't know what cons you went to this year but I feel bad for you. The ones I went to were loaded with Trek merchandise and cast members. Since this was the 50th, Trek had the biggest floor space in the events of any franchise. All of it overpriced, I totally agree with you there, but it was everywhere.

 

[fireproof78]

I'm only quoting this part as, well.... the people I'm speaking of are from a less niche market than you imagine. I'm not even speaking of people within my social circle and only a select few are collectors. My wife and I are traders, and Trek fans - both long term, newcomers and casual - are some of our biggest customers. The reason being that even at conventions drawing tens of thousands of people, no one is catering to them.

While a con in itself is a niche market (ish), one generic, normal people store local to us (The Works) got in a batch of Star Trek books. Obscure books most retailers are embarrassed to sell as they fit into this niche market you speak of. They were gone in a matter of days.

The stores I was thinking of while posting is asked regularly - not by people making enquiries, but with cash in hand wanting the thing (Beyond Pin). And thats not a guess - I know people workign in the stores.



On the same front, one of the recently requested items in a specialist store (I have a friend who works there) are the new Beyond pins. I'm told there's no interest, but people are going wish cash in hand wanting to buy them. The same store had the same requests several years ago with the 2009 pins. A rival store heard about it and bought them in. They sold very quickly.

I don't want to sound condescending (and sincerely hope I don't - apologies if I do!) - but... there is a market. Trek sells. If it didn't, I'd be in a very bad position right now as thats half our merch! The problem is (or rather, was) the elitist pricing. Forbidden Planet used to stock high end merch - £30 for a Worf figure. No ones buying that. A tenner for a Pop? Sold out. £50 for a Diamond Select ship? Nope! £15 for a Playmates? Sold.

There is a demand - but the few products out there are focused on collectors. That needs to change and that has done more damage than it gets credit for.

You'll get no argument from me that there is a demand. I recognize that, but I don't think every retailer is willing to step up and risk it again. Retailers are going through a lot of upheaval right now so risk is not always considered a good idea.

I personally think that the problem isn't lack of demand, but the mix of products that is out there right now. The one Star Trek product I saw at Target the other day was a remote control Ent-A model that looks really cool and retailed for $119 US. Which, ok, that's great, but not what I'm really looking for.

Maybe I'm too picky, but I personally wouldn't mind seeing more action figures that can be utilized with other figures out there on the market. That's just my preference, but I think that Trek lends itself to more playsets and figures than just vehicles.

I also think that Star Trek merchandising would do well to shy away from the collectors ideas and allow some more independent play style ideas. I think that if they find the right mix that it might work again at the store level.

 

[Relayer1]

Let's face it, the Blurays don't sell anywhere near enough to get DS9 and Voyager remastered, the new movies are underperforming and uninspiring and Trek could probably be described as circling the drain as a major franchise. If ST4 is as bad as Beyond and Discovery tanks, that's it.

I love Trek. I'm one of the few who buy the novels and there's not that many of us. I never saw the appeal of 'merchandise' but Trek's not going to sell a lot of toys either.

 

[wayoung]

The one Star Trek product I saw at Target the other day was a remote control Ent-A model that looks really cool and retailed for $119 US. Which, ok, that's great,

It IS great. I pre-ordered the thing (two times due to store availability changing)and then a defective model coming my way that I had to exchange, but, damn, when you go outside at night under the stars with the TWOK soundtrack blaring your inner 12 year old dies of happiness.

They're half the price in stores now as what I paid in the summer.

 

[fireproof78]

It IS great. I pre-ordered the thing (two times due to store availability changing)and then a defective model coming my way that I had to exchange, but, damn, when you go outside at night under the stars with the TWOK soundtrack blaring your inner 12 year old dies of happiness.

They're half the price in stores now as what I paid in the summer.

I don't mind the model, but that was the only Star Trek merchandise they had. That's my frustration. If I don't want a remote control vehicle or, more to the truth, can afford it, then???

That's my frustration is the lack of a middle ground.

 

[Relayer1]

I don't mind the model, but that was the only Star Trek merchandise they had. That's my frustration. If I don't want a remote control vehicle or, more to the truth, can afford it, then???

That's my frustration is the lack of a middle ground.

The high end collectors market is pretty much the only viable area, appealing to older, wealthier, long term fans.

The cheaper, entry level merchandise is really for 'pocket money' stuff, purchased by kids that are into Trek. Which don't exist...

 

[fireproof78]

The high end collectors market is pretty much the only viable area, appealing to older, wealthier, long term fans.

The cheaper, entry level merchandise is really for 'pocket money' stuff, purchased by kids that are into Trek. Which don't exist...

Or fans who are not wealthy...that's a ridiculous disparity to me.

 

[Relayer1]

Or fans who are not wealthy...that's a ridiculous disparity to me.

Neither wealthy nor numerous, it's a demographic that won't exactly excite merchandisers.

 

[wayoung]

? There are ships ranging in price from $2 -$15, there are $2-$5 hot wheels cars done up in Trek themes, there are action figures, pops, kubos, orbitz, etc. There are mega blocks sets that are less than $50.

There's a bunch of the above at my local Walmart that have even sitting there forever. Right beside the NuGhostbusters merchandise. Which should tell you pretty clearly how in demand it Trek toys are.

There were quite a few cheap toys out this year - it's just that people don't buy them, so they don't get the shelf space / replenished when they finally sell out and the companies don't make any more different toys since the ones they are making aren't selling.

 

[Noname Given]

I think that's not the problem though, I think part of the problem is that Paramount has tried to make Star Trek into something cool and more mainstream but in doing so has taken away some of it's magic.

^^^
That's a load of crap.

 

[fireproof78]

? There are ships ranging in price from $2 -$15, there are $2-$5 hot wheels cars done up in Trek themes, there are action figures, pops, kubos, orbitz, etc. There are mega blocks sets that are less than $50.

There's a bunch of the above at my local Walmart that have even sitting there forever. Right beside the NuGhostbusters merchandise. Which should tell you pretty clearly how in demand it Trek toys are.

There were quite a few cheap toys out this year - it's just that people don't buy them, so they don't get the shelf space / replenished when they finally sell out and the companies don't make any more different toys since the ones they are making aren't selling.

Since there is no local retailer handling the action figures, the Mega Blocks or the like, you'll forgive my frustration since I don't actually see it at the stores.

 

[wayoung]

...Well there is this thing called the internet, I hear most things can be found on it. Free shipping too if you order enough....

If you're frustrated that your local retailers aren't selling it imagine how frustrated those same retailers would be to sacrifice shelf space to a product that's not selling. That's their livelihoods.

 

[fireproof78]

...Well there is this thing called the internet, I hear most things can be found on it. Free shipping too if you order enough....

If you're frustrated that your local retailers aren't selling it imagine how frustrated those same retailers would be to sacrifice shelf space to a product that's not selling. That's their livelihoods.

I have this thing about seeing and handling products first.

Also, I was a retail assistant manager for ten years-I don't have to imagine it. I lived it.