P/C run amok...

[mon capitaine]

Just to go back to the films for a moment. Can anyone explain how Troi got such good parts compared to Bev? She's completely dropped the accent (and by Nemesis I'm not sure which side of the pond she's even pretending to be from), she looks like she's had some nip/tuck work, she was never the strongest actor in the cast and yet she keeps getting fairly meaty parts in the films. How come?

 

[Gold Grizzly]

Posted by mon capitaine:
she looks like she's had some nip/tuck work,

That may be it ...

Other than that, I think that they decided to focus more on the best known characters. Perhaps Troi is just better known than Bev?

 

[LISA_t]

*g* I'm soooo glad someone else mentioned Troi and nip/tuck. I was watching one of the on films last week- or maybe it was season 7?- and I remember thinking that she definitely looked a little touched up. Personally, I vote some kind of lip work. And if her hair was really so curly/frizzy naturally to start with, I want whatever she got for the movies...

I suppose TPTB felt that they had to keep the fans happy (!) by resolving at least one relationship and having pitched on R/T (silly, silly people) ... the rest was inevitable. Still not fair, though.

 

[mon capitaine]

^I've always rather liked the Riker/Troi thing so it's not that I have a problem with that per se. I just wonder how Troi got ahead of Bev in the pecking order for the film roles, especially as she has revamped everything so much.

Still, it would have been a short film if Shinzon had mind-raped Bev (I hope).

 

[LISA_t]

^ Does anyone know if this causes any friction between Gates and Marina? Hasn't Gates gone on record several times for criticising TPTB for their attitudes towards Beverly in the films?
.. or did the actresses just go along with the idea that the films would be male-centric and go with whatever they got?

 

[Gold Grizzly]

As far as I know, there haven't been any complaints about "the Picard and Data show" of the movies from the actors. LeVar Burton does express disappointment at not getting more to do during the series in the DVD special features though.

 

[Naraht]

Damn! I wrote a long post on Gates in the movies and a "cannot find server" message just wiped it out. I will try again later.

 

[mon capitaine]

^Looking forward to it. I'll be intrigued to see just how long a post you can manage on such skimpy filmatic appearances.

 

[Gold Grizzly]

While we're waiting, it's time for me to amaze you all with my photoshopping skills once again. This is the Tamarian version of "Attached". I've had to stretch the meanings of some of the phrases, but I think that they fit okay nonetheless.

 

[R.Barclay]

^ Great! Just great! :thumbsup:

 

[timtonruben]

Posted by LISA_t:
^ Does anyone know if this causes any friction between Gates and Marina? Hasn't Gates gone on record several times for criticising TPTB for their attitudes towards Beverly in the films?
.. or did the actresses just go along with the idea that the films would be male-centric and go with whatever they got?

I don't think there was any tension between Marina and Gates over Crusher's lack of screen time in the movies. I think it was slightly easier for the writers to put Troi in scenes because she was a Bridge officer, while Beverly was always in Sickbay. I know that during the TV days, Marina and Gates had become close because they were the only women on the show. I remember once Marina had stated during an interview that Gates was much more vocal about their lack of screen time than she was.

I know that Gates was less than pleased with the size of her role in the TNG movies. In fact, I remember reading once that she almost did not appear in Nemesis. I believe that both Rick Berman and John Logan promised her a bigger role. Crusher indeed did have a larger role in Nemesis, however, much of her scenes, particularly the ones with Picard, were cut from the movie during editing.

I also believe part of the reason for the lack of Gate’s screen time in Generations and First Contact, had to do with tension between her and Brannon Braga…they two apparently did not get on.

 

[Guest]

Hello, I'm back after a very long time. Naraht, you might remember me. I have been going through a divorce, move, school, and starting up a career, so had to be gone for awhile.

Anyway, about Jack Crusher, I so agree with you Naraht! I can't stand all the fanfics where he's a womanizer/jerk/chauvinist. As if Beverly would put up with that.

I saw "Second Chances" the other day, the one with the Riker double created by the transporter and left behind on the station. I was thinking about what would have happened had Jack been the duplicated and left behind person. Does anyone know of a fanfic like this?

 

[Naraht]

Grizzly, don't sell your Photoshop abilities short! It was a brilliant idea, although somehow it's even sadder this way than in the episode. *sniffle*

Posted by bevfan:
Hello, I'm back after a very long time. Naraht, you might remember me. I have been going through a divorce, move, school, and starting up a career, so had to be gone for awhile.

Welcome back! Yes, of course I remember you, and it's great to see you on the board again. I hope things are going better for you now.

I saw "Second Chances" the other day, the one with the Riker double created by the transporter and left behind on the station. I was thinking about what would have happened had Jack been the duplicated and left behind person. Does anyone know of a fanfic like this?

Hmm, good question. I have read quite a few "Jack is back" fanfics in my time, the most popular being Jack-is-impersonated-by-an-alien, and Jack-is-cloned, but I don't think I've ever seen a transporter duplication story. Part of that might be the constraints imposed by his manner of death as described in the series... that is, it just doesn't sound like he died in a transporter accident.

It also may be that most P/C writers simply don't want to bring him back in any permanent form. Either Beverly would have to reject him as Deanna did Tom in Second Chances, and they would have to get a divorce and go their seperate ways, or things would be very different onboard the Enterprise after that. The former option would make Beverly out to be pretty callous, as well as being a straight replay of the plot of Second Chances; the latter would be... well, very different.

Having said all that, though, it does still sound like an interesting idea. The fanfic-writing part of my brain is churning away already!

 

[mon capitaine]

Posted by Naraht:
It also may be that most P/C writers simply don't want to bring him back in any permanent form.

Poor Jack. The only people who care about him to bring him back are P/Cers who want him only to add some conflict to the P/C relationship. Jack inevitably dies again. Death is his natural state.

 

[WillsBabe]

Posted by Naraht:
It also may be that most P/C writers simply don't want to bring him back in any permanent form. Either Beverly would have to reject him as Deanna did Tom in Second Chances, and they would have to get a divorce and go their seperate ways, or things would be very different onboard the Enterprise after that. The former option would make Beverly out to be pretty callous,

I don't post often in this thread but I wanted to add something here. I don't think it would have to make Bev look callous if she rejected Jack. I think it could make a really interesting exploration of grief and how a person recovers from it if Jack returned. As someone who has lost a loved one, I have thought, over the years, how life moves on, and how my loved one would fit into my new life. I think it could be an interesting question to ask how long someone needs to be dead, how much the bereaved's life needs to have changed for the dead, if they were to return, to potentially, have no place in it. I think it could be a heart-rending story and Bev could still be sympathetic.

 

[mon capitaine]

I think you're right. In Beverly's case it might be an interesting yardstick to see how far has her life come on since Jack's death. In many ways, it hasn't and I guess given that her memories of Jack seem to always be just below the surface (violations) then it would be interesting to see a thoughtful account of how well they'd cope if reunited.

 

[LISA_t]

Especially given Beverly's comments to Amanda - why can I not remember the name of that episode!!!
I do remember one fanfic called 'Test of Time' that has Beverly shifting in and out of verious AUs- rather like 'Paralells' and it explores some of the issues mentioned above.

It sounds right up Naraht's street....

 

[Gold Grizzly]

/\ That's "True Q" that you're thinking of I think.

 

[mon capitaine]

Anyway, time to consider the Vash gal methinks (especially as Naraht is on vacation ).

How serious a threat to P/C is Vash? She gets to sleep with Picard, she gets the relationship known on board the Enterprise and she gets a declaration of love during Q-Pid., I'm thinking that's a pretty damn strong threat. What's your opinion?

 

[Gold Grizzly]

I can't really imagine them staying together in the long term, so perhaps the biggest threat is that since Vash is such an exciting, unpredictable character, he might find breakfast with Bev to be tame by comparison.