Orci strikes back

[trevanian]

Well if folks can bitch and complain about something he worked on, he's got as much right to snap back at them. It's not a one way street. Could he have been more tactful, sure. Did he have to be? No.

It slays me that when Kevin Smith lips off to fans knocking his stuff, people call him a crybaby, but if Orci does it, he is righteously defending himself.

He should be happy enough to take the money & beam out already. Christ, he got paid for these two movies and COWBOYS & ALIENS, isn't that enough of a snow job for one century?

 

[trevanian]

Why are people still bitching / brown-nosing the film?

The space cows haven't come home yet.

So the take away of this is: If you didn't like Into Darkness and you raise valid points about it's many flaws in a fairly civilized way your points are all invalid. Because STD made money. So you can FUCK THE FUCK OFF YOU FUCKING FUCKS!

Nope. That's not it.

Are you sure about that? And if so, can you use more than single syllable words in a somewhat longer sentence (take your time, i only check this part of the board every few days or so.)

 

[Opus]

When Trek did break out of the revenge story mold, excepting TVH most of those movies are not like by fans

Oh, Fuck The Fans!

 

[SeerSGB]

Well if folks can bitch and complain about something he worked on, he's got as much right to snap back at them. It's not a one way street. Could he have been more tactful, sure. Did he have to be? No.

It slays me that when Kevin Smith lips off to fans knocking his stuff, people call him a crybaby, but if Orci does it, he is righteously defending himself.

He should be happy enough to take the money & beam out already. Christ, he got paid for these two movies and COWBOYS & ALIENS, isn't that enough of a snow job for one century?

Hey, Kevin Smith can tell the fans off too. I find it funny when fans get themselves in a twitch over stuff like this.

Had Harlan Ellison when on one of his Trek rants, we'd all chuckle and say "oh that's just Harlan".

 

[JWPlatt]

For all the noise about it, Orci posted very little and nothing of substance. I was hoping for longer posts and more of them. I was hoping for a reply about the the Blu-ray extras going to retailer exclusives. I'm still waiting for someone involved to say something about that, such as "We're very sorry but we like money more than we like you." So overall, a big yawn.

Er...what? Why would Orci even talk about the Blu-Ray extras-controversy, other than as an aside? He only wrote the movie; he has nothing whatsoever to do with its home video release, or any of the marketing decisions that went into it, nor is he an executive at Paramount Home Video.

He has nothing to "reply" for, here -- any responsibilities he once had towards the film were discharged in the screenwriting and production stages, which are totally different topics of conversation.

Orci responded to other posts under the article, and, if you didn't notice, he was asked there about the Blu-ray issue. He could have replied, "I only wrote the movie. I have nothing whatsoever to do with its home video release, or any of the marketing decisions that went into it, nor am I an executive at Paramount Home Video" but he didn't do even that. He didn't touch it. He could also have mixed sympathy with insult to say, "I feel for you as a fan myself, but I didn't even know about it. You poor fucks were screwed. I'm just sorry I didn't get a piece of it in my contract."

 

[Leto_II]

Orci responded to other posts under the article, and, if you didn't notice, he was asked there about the Blu-ray issue. He could have replied, "I only wrote the movie. I have nothing whatsoever to do with its home video release, or any of the marketing decisions that went into it, nor am I an executive at Paramount Home Video" but he didn't do even that. He didn't touch it. He could also have mixed sympathy with insult to say, "I feel for you as a fan myself, but I didn't even know about it. You poor fucks were screwed. I'm just sorry I didn't get a piece of it in my contract."

Maybe he didn't notice it? Or one of a hundred other reasons aside from the one you seem so intent upon ascribing to him without any real actual evidence -- the bottom line is, we simply don't know why he hasn't responded to this question, and to insist upon other motivations without proof goes beyond the bounds of reasonable, civilized discourse.

Orci has about as much ethical accountability on this issue as you would if someone demanded that you, for example, condemn the Assad regime's use of chemical weapons on civilians in Syria. As in, none whatsoever. It's not his problem. If he wants to comment on it, fine; if not, that's his own private affair.

Perhaps he is ducking the question, but even if he is, again, he is under absolutely zero moral obligation to supply a response -- he had nothing to do with the authoring of the Blu-Ray, and bears no responsibility for those decisions, which were made by the studio above his head. Period.

 

[M'Sharak]

So the take away of this is: If you didn't like Into Darkness and you raise valid points about it's many flaws in a fairly civilized way your points are all invalid. Because STD made money. So you can FUCK THE FUCK OFF YOU FUCKING FUCKS!

Nope. That's not it.

Are you sure about that? And if so, can you use more than single syllable words in a somewhat longer sentence (take your time, i only check this part of the board every few days or so.)

Reasonably so, O Multisyllabic One - it's not quite as described by MrJ above. But don't take my word for it; see for yourself. The editorial piece cited by Gabe Koerner at TrekWeb and its attached comment thread may be found entire at the following link:

http://trekmovie.com/2013/09/01/star-trek-is-broken-here-are-ideas-on-how-to-fix-it/

 

[HaplessCrewman]

For all the noise about it, Orci posted very little and nothing of substance. I was hoping for longer posts and more of them. I was hoping for a reply about the the Blu-ray extras going to retailer exclusives. I'm still waiting for someone involved to say something about that, such as "We're very sorry but we like money more than we like you." So overall, a big yawn.

Er...what? Why would Orci even talk about the Blu-Ray extras-controversy, other than as an aside? He only wrote the movie; he has nothing whatsoever to do with its home video release, or any of the marketing decisions that went into it, nor is he an executive at Paramount Home Video.

He has nothing to "reply" for, here -- any responsibilities he once had towards the film were discharged in the screenwriting and production stages, which are totally different topics of conversation.

Orci responded to other posts under the article, and, if you didn't notice, he was asked there about the Blu-ray issue. He could have replied, "I only wrote the movie. I have nothing whatsoever to do with its home video release, or any of the marketing decisions that went into it, nor am I an executive at Paramount Home Video" but he didn't do even that. He didn't touch it. He could also have mixed sympathy with insult to say, "I feel for you as a fan myself, but I didn't even know about it. You poor fucks were screwed. I'm just sorry I didn't get a piece of it in my contract."

Gosh, I hope Orci wouldn't respond with the "mixed sympathy with insult" line from above but I guess, according to the posts in this thread, he would be in his rights to do so.

 

[HaplessCrewman]

Everyone's talking about Orci.

http://www.dailydot.com/fandom/star-trek-into-darkness-writer-rude-fans/

http://www.joblo.com/movie-news/star-treks-bob-orci-gives-the-fans-of-piece-of-his-mind

 

[JWPlatt]

Orci responded to other posts under the article, and, if you didn't notice, he was asked there about the Blu-ray issue. He could have replied, "I only wrote the movie. I have nothing whatsoever to do with its home video release, or any of the marketing decisions that went into it, nor am I an executive at Paramount Home Video" but he didn't do even that. He didn't touch it. He could also have mixed sympathy with insult to say, "I feel for you as a fan myself, but I didn't even know about it. You poor fucks were screwed. I'm just sorry I didn't get a piece of it in my contract."

Maybe he didn't notice it? Or one of a hundred other reasons aside from the one you seem so intent upon ascribing to him without any real actual evidence -- the bottom line is, we simply don't know why he hasn't responded to this question, and to insist upon other motivations without proof goes beyond the bounds of reasonable, civilized discourse.

Orci has about as much ethical accountability on this issue as you would if someone demanded that you, for example, condemn the Assad regime's use of chemical weapons on civilians in Syria. As in, none whatsoever. It's not his problem. If he wants to comment on it, fine; if not, that's his own private affair.

Perhaps he is ducking the question, but even if he is, again, he is under absolutely zero moral obligation to supply a response -- he had nothing to do with the authoring of the Blu-Ray, and bears no responsibility for those decisions, which were made by the studio above his head. Period.

I only said I was sorry he didn't respond to the question. I also said I hope someone involved [with the Blu-ray] will address the issue. Your speculation on why he did or didn't, what he knows or doesn't know is just as [in]valid as mine. And I think someone as close to the movie as he was would hear about it. I also understand that he would not comment if it was not his business to do so. I can still be sorry he doesn't have loose lips when they're already loose enough to use expletives at fans. Surely not the best of times for him.

As for your inexplicable analogy to Syria, I hope you'll notice I made no demands that he comment on the Hindenburg conspiracy or if he knows anything about a second gunman at the JFK assassination, or if Elvis was really a federal agent. I can be reasonable that way.

 

[Captain Mike]

Except Ellisison was and is an established writer through his profession other than "StarTrek"....Oh I forgot Orci started out with Hercules...

 

[Leto_II]

As for your inexplicable analogy to Syria, I hope you'll notice I made no demands that he comment on the Hindenburg conspiracy or if he knows anything about a second gunman at the JFK assassination, or if Elvis was really a federal agent. I can be reasonable that way.

Judging by your posts in this thread, you seem to be hell-bent on manufacturing a similar type of conspiracy-theory.

Also, you sort of missed the whole point entirely, there.

 

[SeerSGB]

Except Ellisison was and is an established writer through his profession other than "StarTrek"....Oh I forgot Orci started out with Hercules...

The point is the fanbase is selective about who they do and don't let back talk them.

Fans needs to get used to it: the barrier is gone. The 'net is allowing direct feedback between fans and creators. And not all creators are going to be nice, polite, or respond the way you think they should or want them to.

 

[Noname Given]

The rest is smug bullshit. Say what you will about plot holes and lens flares and rehashed scenes, but as far as characters and writing, ST09 and STID were spot on.

Not by a long shot.

The writing of Kirk and, to a lesser extent, Uhura is probably the low point of this entire series. McCoy is little more than a Buzz Lightyear who spouts a cute southern catchphrase when you press his button.

The flaws of the story have been covered enough around here to illustrate why it is far from "spot on".

To each his own. As a fan whom watch TOS first run, I feel they nailed Kirk to a tee.

 

[Gsam]

I too am a first run TOS watcher. I agree with both of you actually because you are both right for different reasons.

The bottom line is that TOS Kirk was developed over a period of time in the television episodes. I can not recall the exact titles but one episode that involved that cloud of "gas" that drained the people of their blood insinuated if not our right said that Kirk was much "younger" back then and made mistakes in times of crisis.

Also throughout episodes there were references made to Kirk's youth and allowing for young ensigns mistakes due to inexperience as was done for him.

That being said AOS Kirk did not have a chance to fully develop due to a lack of time and the fact he was not the only main character on the screen. I feel that they started to show that INTD Kirk had learned a great lesson on humility and what it meant to be selfless.

The great tragedy here is that Kirk is still left without Pike to help him develop some of the everyday skills that a captain needs to run a good ship. Plus Pike was like a father to him IMO and really helped build his character as a person. I think he attempted to guide him towards the correct way to make decisions and did the whole tough love thing.

So I guess I see it both ways. The movie could have used a lot more character development more in line with TOS but just didn't have the time that a weekly television show afforded.

thanks for letting me unload here...

 

[JWPlatt]

The great tragedy here is that Kirk is still left without Pike...

I'm more worried about Veena.

 

[serenitytrek1]

Sometimes we fans take things too far. Many Star Wars fans basically bullied George Lucas out of the franchise...his own franchise and here we are...well some of us trying to do the same with Orci.

Orci isn't perfect but he does seem to have a good heart when it comes to Star Trek. I do believe the man deserves some respect even if you hated STiD.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Trekweb are desperately trying to become The Daily Fail of Trek news sites.

As for Orci, I don't blame him for what he said. The level of discourse on Trekmovie is barely above Youtube. He's usually a lot more patient with fans there than I'd be.

 

[serenitytrek1]

Trekweb are desperately trying to become The Daily Fail of Trek news sites.

As for Orci, I don't blame him for what he said. The level of discourse on Trekmovie is barely above Youtube. He's usually a lot more patient with fans there than I'd be.

You mean the Daily Mail...haha

 

[Noddy]

Wtf Robby. So a couple hundred people at Vegas Con 2013 vote STID to be the worst film in the franchise.

Eh? STID may have its problems, but seriously, if those people think it's the worst Trek film ever, they obviously haven't seen the pile of excrement that was Generations, or Nemesis.