"O'Brien Must Suffer"

[Rom's Sehlat]

Do you know if Colm Meaney was aware of the "O'Brien Must Suffer" concept? Or did he become aware of it after so many tragic things happened to his character?

Do actors care what happens to their characters? Or do they generally say, "Oh, OK. I can play a person in that situation," and not really mind whatever bad things happen to them?

Also, discuss any other aspect of "O'Brien Must Suffer" that you want to.

 

[Ro_Laren]

I never heard of the "O'Brien Must Suffer" concept...

 

[CoveTom]

I vaguely recall reading an interview with Colm Meaney where the interviewer mentioned this, and he basically said that he hadn't thought about it before, but in retrospect he could see that the Chief did seem to get into an unusually large share of such situations. But I didn't a quick search around the interwebs and I can't seem to find that interview.

EDIT for Ro: The "O'Brien Must Suffer" concept was mentioned on one of the DS9 DVD's in the special features. Look at the Wikipedia article on O'Brien under the "Fan Reception" section.

 

[Kaziarl]

Memory Alpha has information about this too. I believe it was stated that because O'Brien was the "Every Man" that people related to him more. So they put him through all this stuff to tug on the audiences heartstrings.

Edited to add:
http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Miles_O'Brien

According to DS9 executive producer/writer Ira Steven Behr, "O'Brien is everyman. In a show about humans and aliens, he's as human as you get." Similarly, Behr's writing partner for the first four seasons of the show, Robert Hewitt Wolfe, says, "He's just a regular guy, a guy doing his job. He's just the most unlikely of all heroes because he's a family man with a daughter and eventually a son and a wife and they have arguments and a real relationship, and he's just a working class schmo, I mean obviously he's a really bright guy and very good at what he did, but basically, a working class schmo just trying to get through his day." (Crew Dossier: Miles O'Brien, DS9 Season 5 DVD, Special Features)

The DS9 writing staff had a running joke with a semi-annual "O'Brien Must Suffer" episode. Among these were "Whispers", "Tribunal", "Visionary", "Hard Time", "Honor Among Thieves" and "Prodigal Daughter". (Star Trek: Deep Space Nine Companion) According to Ira Behr, "Every year in one or two shows we try to make his life miserable, because you empathize with him." Robert Hewitt Wolfe further explains, "If O'Brien went through something torturous and horrible, the audience was going to feel that, in a way they wouldn't feel it with any of the other characters. Because all the other characters were sort of, I wouldn't say larger than life, but nobler than life, but O'Brien was just a guy, trying to live his life and so if you tortured him that was a story." (Crew Dossier: Miles O'Brien, DS9 Season 5 DVD, Special Features)

 

[indolover]

Miles from the get go was supposed to be a hardened character. The Wounded in TNG established this IMO.

I feel sorry for him though, I guess the Prophets chose a bad path for him lol....

And of course actors care, but I get the feeling Colm Meaney may not have cared about the O'Brien must suffer aspect. I think an actor in general wants his character to be well developed and to be alive, so to speak, and also display a wide range. As long as an actor can fully develop/play out his/her art, then that's all of consequence. This is why Beltran disliked his role in Voyager, and I think most actors in his position would have said the same thing.

 

[Anwar]

Each series had a "Must suffer" character" character:

- Chekov in TOS
- TNG had three: Laforge, Worf and Troi (and O'Brien, occasionally)
- O'Brien in DS9
- Kim in VOY
- Trip and Archer in ENT

 

[Kaziarl]

Each series had a "Must suffer" character" character:

- Chekov in TOS
- TNG had three: Laforge, Worf and Troi (and O'Brien, occasionally)
- O'Brien in DS9
- Kim in VOY
- Trip and Archer in ENT

heh, good point about Kim. I hadn't really thought about it for the other shows.

Although for TOS, shouldn't the "Must Suffer" character just be Generic Crewman. May have been a different face each time, but they certainly went through a few of them.

 

[jwb]

I think of all the sufferers, O'Brien is the best. Colm can just knock it out of the park, because he comes across as such a natural everyman. He makes it look so easy, you have to remind yourself he's a talented actor and not his character. It creates a natural sympathy for O'Brien, and it's one of the reasons why episodes like "Hard Time" are among Trek's best.

 

[Ro_Laren]

Memory Alpha has information about this too. I believe it was stated that because O'Brien was the "Every Man" that people related to him more. So they put him through all this stuff to tug on the audiences heartstrings.

Edited to add:
http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Miles_O'Brien

According to DS9 executive producer/writer Ira Steven Behr, "O'Brien is everyman. In a show about humans and aliens, he's as human as you get." Similarly, Behr's writing partner for the first four seasons of the show, Robert Hewitt Wolfe, says, "He's just a regular guy, a guy doing his job. He's just the most unlikely of all heroes because he's a family man with a daughter and eventually a son and a wife and they have arguments and a real relationship, and he's just a working class schmo, I mean obviously he's a really bright guy and very good at what he did, but basically, a working class schmo just trying to get through his day." (Crew Dossier: Miles O'Brien, DS9 Season 5 DVD, Special Features)

The DS9 writing staff had a running joke with a semi-annual "O'Brien Must Suffer" episode. Among these were "Whispers", "Tribunal", "Visionary", "Hard Time", "Honor Among Thieves" and "Prodigal Daughter". (Star Trek: Deep Space Nine Companion) According to Ira Behr, "Every year in one or two shows we try to make his life miserable, because you empathize with him." Robert Hewitt Wolfe further explains, "If O'Brien went through something torturous and horrible, the audience was going to feel that, in a way they wouldn't feel it with any of the other characters. Because all the other characters were sort of, I wouldn't say larger than life, but nobler than life, but O'Brien was just a guy, trying to live his life and so if you tortured him that was a story." (Crew Dossier: Miles O'Brien, DS9 Season 5 DVD, Special Features)

Wow, I can't believe I didn't know about this. I can totally see it!

 

[scottydog]

I think of all the sufferers, O'Brien is the best. Colm can just knock it out of the park, because he comes across as such a natural everyman. He makes it look so easy, you have to remind yourself he's a talented actor and not his character. It creates a natural sympathy for O'Brien, and it's one of the reasons why episodes like "Hard Time" are among Trek's best.

I agree. No one suffers better than O'Brien. I'd say LaForge from TNG is a close second, followed by Picard from TNG, e.g., remember the Cardassian torture episode -- excellent suffering going on there.

 

[Too Much Fun]

I love O'Brien and I think those episodes are really done, but I can't stand watching them, with the exception of "Whispers". This is a rare case because usually I don't watch episodes because I think they're bad. I have no problem with the "O'Brien must suffer" episodes quality-wise, they are just too painful to watch. One time was enough to see him pointing a phaser at himself contemplating suicide while Bashir tries to talk him out of it!

"Whispers" is a thing of beauty, though. I'll tough on through the difficulty of watching O'Brien's agony any time for that one, because it's such a superb piece of storytelling. The twist ending enthralls me every time and I think it's the first truly great episode of the series (yes, above "Duet") where it tries something really new for the Star Trek franchise and succeeds magnificently.

 

[DeepSpaceWine]

^
Yeah, "Whispers" is an excellent episode which doesn't get nearly the acclaim it should. It's up there with "Captive Pursuit" and "Duet" but doesn't get mentioned as much.

I'm not sure when the O'Brien must suffer concept got recognised. I do vaguely remember in the '90s, it was a bit of a joke that all the really weird things happened to him once a season, though it was like a half-formed thought.



Let's see
- Season 1. Not really clear. In "Captive Pursuit" he has to go renegade to help Tosk and risks his career, though that's been occasionally done in TNG & VOY (most prominently with Paris). In "The Storyteller", he's in a classically weird situation, but it's not quite to the "screw with O'Brien" level we expect.

- Season 2. "Whispers". Classic screw with O'Brien ep. And "Tribunal". And let's not forget "Armageddon Game" where he is infected with a biological weapon that wiped out the civilization he's hiding in. He's in "Paradise" too, but Sisko tells him to take five, he'll take O'brien's time in 'the box'.

- Season 3. "Visionary". They actually kill O'Brien and he has to save the space station from blowing up (the one time we saw it. TNG showed the Ent-D being destroyed a few times, Voyager also a few times, Babylon 5 twice).


I wonder if it was because O'Brien was an everyman, it was hard to write standard adventure plots for him or if it was his appearance resembling Gene Hackman a bit and other actors that made the producers think in terms of thrillers when writing O'Brien stories ("Whispers", "Visionary" are classic examples).

- Season 4. Just "Hard Time", though that covers the whole season. He's in "H. Oath" but the story doesn't go into screw O'Brien mode.

- Season 5. "The Assignment", only a Pah Wraith puts him through hell by threatening his wife, possessed by it, and their daughter. In fact, the only reason for this episode seems to be to screw with O'Brien. The Pah Wraith shows up "Hi. Chief O'Brien? It's a new season and I'll be your tormentor this time. I think I'll possess your wife and go that route.". O'Brien *didn't* end up in the Dominion internment camp. He is put in harm's way in the horror film-esque episode "Empok Nor" (let's all split up! brilliant idea!).

- Season 6. "Honor Among Thieves", which fits more of an undercover crime/noir style movie (thinking of Ronin and like movies). How about "Time's Orphan"? He not only loses all the sentimental years with his daughter and skips ahead to her tumultous teenage years, but not only that, she's a feral teenager. You'd expect at this point, O'Brien would look up and shout "Oh come on! What's with this s***!"

- Season 7. An O'Brien/Ezri story is uncomfortably sandwiched together in "Prodigal Daughter". No classic screw with O'Brien ep this season.

 

[lurok]

I hate to say this as a late-but-very passionate DS9 convert, but the 'O'Brien-must-suffer' episodes bored me senseless and along with the Ferengi sitcoms and bland Bajorans were the least appealing aspect for me. Slow, dull, obvious (well, it's obvious he's going to get out whatever hell he's in ) That criminal undercover DS9 episode was even worse than a bad episode of VOY and that's saying something. I appreciate it's probably because I wasn't a TNG fan (only watching now) so O'Brien had no nostalgic resonance. But I can totally see what the writers were trying to do.