Now that I've finished Season Two ... (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Bad Thoughts, Aug 5, 2019.

  1. Bad Thoughts

    Bad Thoughts Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2013
    Location:
    Containment Area for Relocated Yankees
    I would normally be inclined to disagree. However, the mash-up video by MegaRando42, designed to make Discovery look contrived, actually elevates the line. Yes, "I like science" is as cool as "I like big butts!"
     
    serabine likes this.
  2. Rainard Fox

    Rainard Fox Lieutenant Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2019
    Location:
    Federation
    Starfleet is keeping in secret MU existance so they need to confirm that Captain Lorca was Prime Lorca all the time.
    So they confirm that Burham return to Starfleet was legal. AND they confirm that Prime Lorca was the one who has committed war crimes. How Starfleet "does not leave anyone overboard"? To sacrifice honest officer's reputation is a right solution?
    If DSC did it, it would be full satisfaction :beer:. In the moment I am incredibly angry that they just ignore all these questions.
     
  3. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2014
    Location:
    fireproof78
    The needs of the many...

    I've read that some where.
     
  4. ScottJ85

    ScottJ85 Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2016
    Location:
    Australia
    So far as they know, or at least knew at the end of S1, Lorca was Lorca and the mirror universe didn't exist. Section 31 knows, but they've gone so far without any oversight that they may as well not be a part of Starfleet at all.
     
  5. Rainard Fox

    Rainard Fox Lieutenant Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2019
    Location:
    Federation
    I quote myself if you don't mind:
    I would accept if there were an argument of something like that. But they just did it without reflection.
    All "Discovery" crew knew the truth at least. They are Starfleet. And they have accepted the order to keep secret and betray the memory of Lorca and their own former captain Georgiou without discussion. To comparsion, in S2 almost every Pike's order was disputed.
     
  6. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2014
    Location:
    fireproof78
    The main criticism was that they felt the audience couldn't connect with the characters on an emotional level. Though, it's interesting that violence is the solution in the next episode. Even Pike resorts to thinking violent thoughts to beat the Talosians.

    Ok...:shrug:

    Nowhere am I arguing that all of Starfleet is perfect, so I'm not sure what the point is. Not sure how Lorca was "betrayed" since he still operated somewhat in Starfleet's interests while putting forward his front as an officer. He even acknowledges his crew's frustration at not being able to save a Starfleet vessel.

    Georgiou is far more morally questionable and I think Burnham will continue to struggle with that. Maybe.
     
  7. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2011
    I believe they were referring to Prime Lorca. Acknowledging Mirror Lorca as Prime Lorca in the official record, betrays the memory of Prime Lorca.
     
  8. Bad Thoughts

    Bad Thoughts Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2013
    Location:
    Containment Area for Relocated Yankees
    Of course, TOS was not the series that made the commitment to show an enlightened humanity. TOS made an artistic commitment to do more than the creature of the week format and incorporate themes and ideas from science fiction literature in order to appeal to both adults and kids. It was also the series that happened to be blessed with writers, most notably Gene Coon, who felt they needed to comment on the political climate of the era.

    Being that they were trying to do something more than the Saturday serials and be more thoughtful, they were often inclined to resolve stories without the need for violence. However, that is different than saying that they were committed to non-violent solutions. Almost all of them lived through WWII in some way or other. They may well have felt that violence was a necessary part of their tool kit. Sometimes how they felt about violence was not really reflected in the episodes.

    Take three classic episodes written by Gene Coon. In "A Taste of Armageddon," Kirk uses violence and the threat of greater violence because the Eminians didn't take war seriously. It was Coon's commentary on how reporting on the Vietnam War was being sanitized, reduced only to numbers dead by the nightly news. "Errand of Mercy," an episode Coon wrote in order to avoid filming "Omega Glory," Coon dissected the rhetoric of the Cold War. However, in "A Private Little War," Coon explores the difficult decisions that come when foreign powers interfere with and fight over the Third World. Three episodes that show a consistent questioning of the politics of the era, that seem to be looking for a way out, but none that are specifically portraying pacifism.
     
    Gavin70 and Spectre Of The Fun like this.
  9. Gavin70

    Gavin70 Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    May 7, 2018
    Well done. I haven't managed to get my 14yo into any of the Star Treks yet (I still have hope though). On the other hand I finally convinced him to give Firefly a go and we're racing through that now.
     
    Bad Thoughts likes this.
  10. Gavin70

    Gavin70 Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    May 7, 2018
    That's been my main issue with the show so far, although it has improved somewhat. I've enjoyed Saru from the start and I'm becoming more attached to Tilly and Stamets.
     
  11. Gavin70

    Gavin70 Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    May 7, 2018
    Quite possibly the best line in all of Trek! :lol:
     
  12. ralfy

    ralfy Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2013
    Goes downhill in terms of storytelling. No problems with the actors and special effects. It's really the writers who need to be changed, which is sad because writing is the least expensive part of TV shows but the most important.
     
    johnjm22 and Rainard Fox like this.
  13. Rainard Fox

    Rainard Fox Lieutenant Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2019
    Location:
    Federation
    I believe they need to hire Anson Mount as a writer :vulcan:
     
  14. Attentiveluke

    Attentiveluke Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2017
    If they like Firefly they should like Star Trek Picard as I looks like it’s going to rip off the storyline....
     
    Gavin70 likes this.
  15. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2008
    Location:
    A type 13 planet in its final stage
    I can't wait for Picard to take on the Reavers!

    Seriously, "civilian ship and mysterious girl in the future" is a lot more than just Firefly.
     
  16. johnjm22

    johnjm22 Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2013
    Location:
    California
    The writing is terrible, but I think these writers are being told a million different things by producers/studio heads/market research etc. That's why the show is such an amalgamation.
     
  17. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2014
    Location:
    fireproof78
    Picard is captaining a ship fleeing from Federation influence after losing a war to separate from the Federation? And is in a constant battle to find jobs to survive?

    I mean, I love River's storyline in Firefly but is hardly the driving force of the show.
     
  18. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2011
    No it isn't.
     
    fireproof78 likes this.
  19. Noname Given

    Noname Given Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 22, 2001
    Location:
    None Given
    What's "Star Trek: Voyager" got to do with this discussion? ;)
     
    fireproof78 likes this.