not enough Courage?
- Thread starter RobertScorpio
- Start date
Leaving the Courage theme until the end is was very, very smart.
This movie is about the Crew coming together. It isn't the Star Trek with Kirk as captain until the end of the movie.
The crew had to EARN the theme, otherwise it would be a nod to fans, and not mean anything in the movie.
This movie is about the Crew coming together. It isn't the Star Trek with Kirk as captain until the end of the movie.
The crew had to EARN the theme, otherwise it would be a nod to fans, and not mean anything in the movie.
I thought that the music was quite good, especially "Labor of Love" during the end of the Kelvin scene. I absolutely loved that, made the hair on the back of my neck stand up and brought a tear to my eye the first time I saw the movie. As for the TOS theme, I agree that it was best used at the end when the crew of the Enterprise was together for the first time. It doesn't sound antiquated, it works beautifully. The only thing I would like to have heard was some of Jerry Goldsmith's Trek theme. Which for me is the definitive Star Trek theme song.
They did the same thing in Casino Royale... subtle hints at the Bond theme throughout the movie, then belted it out over the credits.
The Star Trek rendition at the end was missing the bongos, though. JJ CAN GO TO HELL!
The Star Trek rendition at the end was missing the bongos, though. JJ CAN GO TO HELL!
darkwing_duck1
Vice Admiral
I remember you confessing to this in another theme thread...me to, man...me too...(tears, not humming)
By the way, for those of you who disliked the overall score, the composer has admitted it was "unpolished".
I especially liked the way the CGI planets and starfields were superimposed behind the beginning of the closing credits as the Courage fanfare played.
I agree with those here who say the theme was best used at the end of the film, once our crew was established and in place. And I find myself repeatedly listening to the closing credits cue -- the entire thing, not just Courage's part -- and liking all of the original portions too, so I think Giacchiano (sp?) did a good job.
My only real beef is that when they did use the theme, I think they should have used the complete theme. As it was, they used an abbreviated form of the theme and used it three separate times, I think. Maybe only repeat it twice but use the complete melody?
Other than that, I was happy with how they used it.
My only real beef is that when they did use the theme, I think they should have used the complete theme. As it was, they used an abbreviated form of the theme and used it three separate times, I think. Maybe only repeat it twice but use the complete melody?
Other than that, I was happy with how they used it.
Since Giacchino says that the choice to go with that "unpolished" quality was deliberate, "admitted" may not be quite the right word to use; it seems to suggest that the composer was trying for something else and made a mistake worthy of a confession after the fact.
http://www.trektoday.com/content/2009/06/giacchino-star-trek-score-was-unpolished.html
I initially wished that there had been more Courage-inspired cues, but on subsequent viewings (I have seen it 3 times now), I can't really think of any TOS cues that would fit.
I agree, as others have said, that Courage's music was better at the end, with the crew in their rightful places.
I agree, as others have said, that Courage's music was better at the end, with the crew in their rightful places.
Opinion of a film maker and film student, take with a grain of salt, as these philosophies are wide and varied...
I don't think Courage's theme would have been quite right at the top. It might have functioned there, but I don't think it would have been the best thing. Putting it at the end works because the point of this movie was to lead us up to the place where the characters were cemented together so the legend we are familiar with can begin.
Also... I don't think Courage's theme would have been quite right, emotionally, right after a scene as powerful as the Kelvin opening. It switches gears too hard. "Enterprising Young Men," as a cue, has a feeling of... gosh, "Introduction" or "Wonder", maybe. Sort of a ticking clock idea, leading into a declaration that this world we are entering is epic and dangerous. Courage's theme, as wonderful as it is, doesn't convey danger or scope in quite the same way.
Movies aren't television shows. A movie has to work as a cohesive whole, an arc all its own. Within the arc of the movie, Courage's theme at the end works beautifully, as our characters have completed their arc towards a point that we are then familiar with. The emotional arc has completed from, "strange new, dangerous world" to "world our characters have begun to make their mark in". I think this is what they were going for because we get the little hints of it when something cool and familiar shows up, like the in-construction ENTERPRISE at the shipyards or the epic transporter save. It's all about moving from unfamiliar to familiar.
I don't think Courage's theme would have been quite right at the top. It might have functioned there, but I don't think it would have been the best thing. Putting it at the end works because the point of this movie was to lead us up to the place where the characters were cemented together so the legend we are familiar with can begin.
Also... I don't think Courage's theme would have been quite right, emotionally, right after a scene as powerful as the Kelvin opening. It switches gears too hard. "Enterprising Young Men," as a cue, has a feeling of... gosh, "Introduction" or "Wonder", maybe. Sort of a ticking clock idea, leading into a declaration that this world we are entering is epic and dangerous. Courage's theme, as wonderful as it is, doesn't convey danger or scope in quite the same way.
Movies aren't television shows. A movie has to work as a cohesive whole, an arc all its own. Within the arc of the movie, Courage's theme at the end works beautifully, as our characters have completed their arc towards a point that we are then familiar with. The emotional arc has completed from, "strange new, dangerous world" to "world our characters have begun to make their mark in". I think this is what they were going for because we get the little hints of it when something cool and familiar shows up, like the in-construction ENTERPRISE at the shipyards or the epic transporter save. It's all about moving from unfamiliar to familiar.
This is how I feel as well. Using the TOS music before the end of the movie would have been premature. Used at the end, it has real meaning.
^
Agreed for the most part. I wouldn't have minded a couple of brief snippets earlier in the film to enhance some scenes but when it blasts at full volume as the end credits roll it has ten times more impact.
Agreed for the most part. I wouldn't have minded a couple of brief snippets earlier in the film to enhance some scenes but when it blasts at full volume as the end credits roll it has ten times more impact.
RobertScorpio
Pariah
I have since changed my mind on this after reading an interview with JJ recently. Having that music at the end when they group is all together, and kirk comes on the bridge in his new uniform, makes the it more dramatic playing the TOS fanfair at the end....
BUT!!!...
What about the sequel? Where do you put the TOS music in that movie? Will, at last, it be given it's just rewards and the honor of being the main theme to the movie?
I for one vote..YES!
Rob
RobertScorpio
Pariah
HOWEVER..I do like the new music. So...how about we agree to play TOS at the end of the movies? Deal?
Rob
No, the movie already has a main theme.
If they have an opening credits sequence at the star of the next movie, I think it could work to use the TOS theme there, similar to how it was used in the credits at the end of this movie.
First time i saw the movie i was disappointed. After the second viewing i realized it was done perfectly (for me, anyway).
My first viewing (and impressions) were totally skewered by my expectations and nitpicking.
I am very grateful that i went a second (and a third) time to see it. If i had only gone once i would be a very unhappy camper right now, instead of someone who wishes she could get another viewing in before it is gone!
My first viewing (and impressions) were totally skewered by my expectations and nitpicking.
I am very grateful that i went a second (and a third) time to see it. If i had only gone once i would be a very unhappy camper right now, instead of someone who wishes she could get another viewing in before it is gone!
RobertScorpio
Pariah
Agreed. But I do agree that the new music should take over, as much as Pine/Quinto have for Shatner/Nimsey.
Rob
Similar threads
