North Star opinions

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Enterprise' started by TrickyDickie, Jul 18, 2018.

  1. TrickyDickie

    TrickyDickie Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It looks like it's been 10 years since this episode had a thread of its own:

    https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/north-star.44963/

    So, I thought I would start a new one.

    I like this episode. I always liked the old TOS episode 'Spectre of the Gun' and I like this episode even better. I've always liked westerns, to an extent, and I'm quite pleased with the way they handled this episode. And I think it neatly stands on its own. It would have been interesting to go back to that planet later and see how things were going.

    What's your opinion?

    I was also thinking about Carpenter Street, which I seem to like more than most people do.

    These kinds of musings led me to wondering about a western-modern theme song for Trip and T'Pol, if they had gone back in time to the 1930s and been forced into living a life like Bonnie and Clyde, albeit on the less violent side. This little tangent got me to looking up country-western songs. The one I got stuck on was written in 1972, by Lee Clayton, but popularized by Waylon Jennings: Ladies Love Outlaws. The tune is nice, but the lyrics don't really make any cohesive sense or tell a single story. So, I decided to see what I could do with it. Here is the result, followed by Waylon's original version. This all just goes to show how you never know where Star Trek is going to lead you next:

    Ladies Love Outlaws (new version)

    Jessie was a lovely girl, from....West Tennessee
    Johnny was an outlaw, fleein' from the hangin' tree
    One night she dreamed him dyin', and it chilled her to the bone
    She knew she had to save him, and make that man her own

    'Cause ladies love outlaws
    Like outlaws love old dogs
    Ladies need someone, to snuggle when they're cold
    Outlaws touch ladies, somewhere deep down in their soul

    Johnny was a hold-up man, runnin' from his past
    Jessie was three husbands down, sure she'd seen her last
    But love for that outlaw, it surged up in her chest
    It made her go and run with him, farther to the west

    'Cause ladies love outlaws
    Like outlaws love old dogs
    Ladies need someone, to snuggle when they're cold
    Outlaws touch ladies, somewhere deep down in their soul

    Johnny'd never hurt someone, he'd carved his gun from wood
    But to all those banks and biz'nesses, he was just another hood'
    Jessie saw the warmth in him, when she looked into his eyes
    She knew she'd found the one for her, she was done with others' lies

    'Cause ladies love outlaws
    Like outlaws love old dogs
    Ladies need someone, to snuggle when they're cold
    Outlaws touch ladies, somewhere deep down in their soul

    Jessie had no Cadillac, or diamonds on her hand
    Johnny had no reputation, as a ladies' man
    But they had each other, and that is more than most
    Now we're hidin' out together, on the California coast!

    'Cause ladies love outlaws
    Like outlaws love old dogs
    Ladies need someone, to snuggle when they're cold
    Outlaws touch ladies, somewhere deep down in their soul

    'Cause ladies love outlaws
    Like outlaws love old dogs
    Ladies need someone, to snuggle when they're cold
    Outlaws touch ladies, somewhere deep down in their soul

     
  2. XCV330

    XCV330 Commodore Fleet Captain

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    Kind of felt like a failed opportunity. They'd done the "what if another planet devleoped like earth" thing so many times already. They could have had it simply be a lost post-sleeper ship colony with those same issues dealing with aliens that was essentially a space-western. I didnt hate North Star, but it did feel like season filler.
     
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  3. trekshark

    trekshark Commander Red Shirt

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    I like it . A followup could be interesting. I figure starfleet would send a ship with teachers to get them up to speed ,and engineers to start building new infrastructure
     
  4. ChristopherPike

    ChristopherPike Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    One of the highlights of Season 3 for me. Favourite moments include the whole bar scene with the Deputy goading the Skag kid into picking up a gun, and the moment Reed nullifies a hostage situation by just stunning T'Pol. The fight scene at the end has its awesome Peckinpah blood squib when Archer gets shot in the shoulder.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2018
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  5. Trapper Keeper

    Trapper Keeper Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I never cared for Trek stories in which the characters were placed in a historical setting due to: 1) time travel, 2) haywire Holodeck, or 3) parallel Earth with development identical to specific time/place (i.e. Cowboy Planet, Roman Planet, etc.). However, I do give them credit for being a little different with the "abducted and transported from Earth" set-up.
     
  6. Prax

    Prax Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I love this episode, but find the premise implausible. An "old west frontier town" wouldn't remain so for 30 years, let alone 300, but yes, it's very well done. I love the way they say "skag," Archer's heroics, and I like the bartender/Sheriff. And it's always fun to see ray guns vs revolvers.

    This episode is like a blend of Voyager's "The 37's" & "Living Witness"
     
  7. Graham

    Graham Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    It was okay, but it was in the middle of the whole Xindi arc. Pretty much anytime they did a standalone episode during that arc I was left wondering why Archer had decided not to bother trying to save the Earth from destruction this week,

    Seriously, how is Archer's response to finding that planet anything other than "Huh, that's weird. Make a note - somebody should follow this up at some point. Now, on with the mission."
     
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  8. HopefulRomantic

    HopefulRomantic Phloxist moderator Moderator

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    I love this episode. The washed out look, the great location (Universal Studios Western streets), the well cast guest roles, direction, production design, costumes, everything. Bakula and Trinneer looked so good in their Western duds. The shuttlecraft landing on Main Street and Archer and company getting out in their uniforms. I thought the premise, the mass abduction of Earthers by aliens, was fun. Would have loved to see a sequel.

    Plus the commentary on the original DVD release was a fascinating look at the process of making a Trek show, very entertaining. :techman::techman::techman:
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2018
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  9. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It was also sort of touching to think that this place was the closest thing to home for our NX-01 heroes, too. Not that it could offer anything tangible: no trained reinforcements to the crew, no spares or refined products or repair facilities, no defenses if the heroes needed shelter. But at least it was there, right in the middle of utter hostility.

    At some point, Archer must have wondered about the chances of mankind surviving through this settlement if he blows it and Earth blows...

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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  10. Reanok

    Reanok Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I really like North Star and the classic movie look to the episode and the costumes and the western sets I liked the story too.
     
  11. MacLeod

    MacLeod Admiral Admiral

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    At least we had a competent security officer (Reed) who remembers his weapon has a stun setting so stuns the hostage.
     
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  12. sekundant

    sekundant Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    ohh yes, T'Pol-Reed scene! :lol:
    As I watch North Star first time, I thought they will find there the next part of puzzle. If I am not very wrong, until this episode they had contact only with three indirect indication sources about the motive of Xindi aggression:

    -Archer get information at Suliban ship from time-traveler-shadow, who was also not best friend of humanity
    -Rajiin who couldn't help to much
    -Garlik who was not even informed about attack on Earth

    What would I do, in Archers place at situation I found a human settlement middle of Expanse? My first reflection will be "go and see"!

    It was for me second letdown episode after "Extinction" about main arch at the third season but as stand alone episode it was very entertaining. Not to forget similarities with La Amistad revolt!
    TnT scenes were not decisive about story, but somehow funny. Ahh, it was the last time we saw Trip with harmonica and I like it, since I was not very happy about Trip as a failed carbon copy of Riker.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2018
  13. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    All I can say is, the Skagarans must not have been very good soldiers if they let themselves be overrun by a bunch of people from the Old West. :lol:
     
  14. Mysterion

    Mysterion Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Even if I buy into the cowboys abducted from Earth and dropped onto alien planet premise; I cannot buy that they would still be at the same social/technical levels 300 years later. (have the same issue with the Amerinds of the TOS episode The Paradise Syndrome).
     
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  15. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    ^ yeah, they didn't bother to actually use any of the Skags' technology? There's a fully functional STARSHIP there for the taking...

    I mean, if nothing else, the humans could have forced the surviving Skag crew to actually bring them back to Earth. Instead of just burning the damn ship and wasting everything it contained.

    Well that one's understandable, as there was no Preserver technology left on the planet other than the obelisk, and there's nothing the Amerinds could have possibly taken from it.
     
  16. Mysterion

    Mysterion Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Even if the Preserver's (or Skags) didn't leave anything handy in te way of tech artifacts, these are still human beings with the same potentials for creativity, intelligence and inventiveness that human beings have. I mean we didn't have any advanced tech to stumble over in the mid 1800's and fifty years later were inventing airplanes. Sixty years after that we were putting people into earth orbit. The cowboys should have eventually started to invent stuff and progress.
     
  17. Nyotarules

    Nyotarules Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    They were too busy hating Skags
     
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  18. TrickyDickie

    TrickyDickie Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    What if they wanted to remain at the same level....sort of like the Amish?
     
  19. Prax

    Prax Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Paradise Syndrome? I could see that, but not the cowboys. The should at least have a horseless carriage by now.
     
  20. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    ...And this is rather likely - the revolt quite probably involved the Skags getting their mighty starship burned to cinder, before the slaves gained the upper hand. I mean, losing the power base would tactically have to be something that happens before the slaves succeed.

    Well, not really. There in all statistical probability only were about a hundred Wright Brothers in the whole of US, and only two of them made good. This small community might simply have nobody of worth. (Except on the Skag side of it, I guess. But that wouldn't be of actual help.)

    ...Out of materials and components mass-produced by factories employing tens of thousands of people in total and drawing on intercontinental resources. If all the Wrights had to go by in terms of raw materials were the nearest forests, they couldn't have put together a single bicycle, let alone a Flier.

    More probably, without steady imports from South America, they would have lost the ability to manufacture gunpowder. And it's back to bows and arrows, then. Or swords, but only assuming they had an iron mine and a supply of coal-like fuel for getting steel out of it.

    That's progress, too, in the sense of how evolution works: aim for the barely adequate, and if you fail, lower your expectations.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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