NFL Discussion - 2013 Season

[Scout101]

Even if it's deemed not catchable, that still leaves you with defensive holding or illegal contact, which (if I understand correctly) don't require the ball to be catchable to still be a penalty.

I'm not sure that's right. I've never seen a ball that was uncatchable that was originally pass interference get amended to some other penalty. Instead, they pick the flag back up.

Usually because it's a boundary thing, where the ball sailed way out of bounds. Or they decide their feet just got tangled up, or hand fighting on both sides, or whatever. This was in bounds, bear hug and carry the guy out of the play. Ball was a little short, but hard to say where Gronk would have ended up had he not been taken out of it. If it's not PI, still at least holding or illegal contact.

We don't know which call the flag was for originally, they just said they picked it up. No call to overturn. Tough to believe they decided on 'no penalty' though, out of the obvious options. Doesn't have to be catchable for holding or illegal contact; you can draw those penalties without the ball even being thrown in your direction. Edelman got an illegal contact call earlier in the game from the left side of the field when Brady threw to someone on the right. DB just held him and then knocked him down, still a penalty.

 

[Use of Time]

Even if it's deemed not catchable, that still leaves you with defensive holding or illegal contact, which (if I understand correctly) don't require the ball to be catchable to still be a penalty.

I'm not sure that's right. I've never seen a ball that was uncatchable that was originally pass interference get amended to some other penalty. Instead, they pick the flag back up.

Usually because it's a boundary thing, where the ball sailed way out of bounds. Or they decide their feet just got tangled up, or hand fighting on both sides, or whatever. This was in bounds, bear hug and carry the guy out of the play. Ball was a little short, but hard to say where Gronk would have ended up had he not been taken out of it. If it's not PI, still at least holding or illegal contact.

We don't know which call the flag was for originally, they just said they picked it up. No call to overturn. Tough to believe they decided on 'no penalty' though, out of the obvious options. Doesn't have to be catchable for holding or illegal contact; you can draw those penalties without the ball even being thrown in your direction. Edelman got an illegal contact call earlier in the game from the left side of the field when Brady threw to someone on the right. DB just held him and then knocked him down, still a penalty.

Bingo. Those defending the ruling might be able to tapdance their way into convincing me it wasn't PI but there is no way in hell it isn't defensive holding. In fact if someone asked me what defensive holding was I would probably show them a GIF of this play. The Patriots got jobbed and the referee behavior after the game was bizarre and a little cowardly to be honest. I'd even bet that if Luke Kuechly were to be honest, he would tell you that he knew he got beat and conceded the penalty over the game losing catch.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

I'll just leave this here

 

[1001001]

I'll just leave this here

 

[Scout101]

Yep, obviously a missed call there. Was there a flag (admitting they saw something) that was then picked up, or did the refs just completely miss it? Missing it is a little easier to understand than saying you saw it, video backing that up, and then just putting the flag in your pocket.

Hell, if you want to play that game, could probably play with screencaps all day. Watch the video of Eli right before the Helmet Catch in the superbowl. About 8 kinds of holding there, but the refs let it go. After that, during the hail mary to Moss, Moss had his arms basically tied to his sides, but nothing there either. It happens.

But if you say you saw it and throw a flag, hard to justify saying you didn't see anything after...

 

[Kirby]

The Pats are a 2 1/2 point underdog AT HOME against the Broncos on Sunday. I wonder when the last time the Pats were ever the underdog in a home game. Hell, a road game for that matter.

 

[tighr]

Here's another good one, from 2010. Ball intended for Pierre Garcon. No flag on the play:

 

[Tom Servo]

Here's another good one, from 2010. Ball intended for Pierre Garcon. No flag on the play:

And the point of posting these are what? So you can continue you I hate the Pats tirade? Non-calls happen to every team.

Its one thing to miss the play. Its another to call, then uncall the pentalty, especially where there hasn't been any evidence in statements by the officials, or in the video replay that justified that call being overturned.

 

[Scout101]

^basically. Kinda blurry photo, but if the point was that he was interfered with, isn't that pretty obviously not catcahble for the guy on the left? Pretty clearly about 10 yards away, if the guy in the middle is catching it. Gronk missed by a couple feet, and was carried away. Either way, Tighr, really just stop. You hate them, got it, move on. Or just put it in your sig to save the typing every time. It's like a conditioned response at this point: someone says the word Patriots, you get an alarm going off, then pop in here to whine about something or other from years ago. Most of the time, the Tuck Rule, or something generic about how Tom Brady sucks (presumably because he's got a bunch of rings, millions in the bank, married to an even RICHER super-model wife, got a kid with her as well as another model/actress, attractive, uh... what were we bashing him for again? Can't seem to remember, gotta be a flaw there somewhere. Oh yeah, he wore Uggs a couple times! Then again, part owner in the company, so... )

Also, the further back you go the more the rules have changed in that regard. Admittedly the Patriots are to blame for part of that, because they used to essentially murder the Colts' receivers, and the Colts whined about it every offseason until the rules changed. Now you can't even look at a WR funny without some sort of penalty, which has made it very much a passing league. Go watch ANY of the games from the Pats' old superbowl runs. Almost every play, on both teams, is a penalty now.

I mean, we got a game-losing penalty a couple weeks back for... pushing. Their own teammate...

 

[Neroon]

I have to confess, the more I listen to the explanation by the ref in the booth, the less confident it sounds. To me, he sounds now more like he's sticking up for the other officials than he is confident in the rightness of the call or rather no-call.

It's a shame this all happened, because Carolina really played a whale of a game.

 

[archeryguy1701]

The Pats are a 2 1/2 point underdog AT HOME against the Broncos on Sunday. I wonder when the last time the Pats were ever the underdog in a home game. Hell, a road game for that matter.

I can't speak to road games, but when it comes to being home underdogs.... a very, very long time.

 

[1001001]

I think we can all agree that the New England Patriots are a front company for Satan, and Tom Brady is his Cabana Boy...



But that was a crappy (non) call. Pats got screwed. JMHO

 

[Tom Servo]

I think we can all agree that the New England Patriots are a front company for Satan, and Tom Brady is his Cabana Boy...



But that was a crappy (non) call. Pats got screwed. JMHO

You all hate seem to hate Belichick, but I'm sure if he was up to coach your team you'd have him in a hearbeat.

 

[1001001]

I think we can all agree that the New England Patriots are a front company for Satan, and Tom Brady is his Cabana Boy...



But that was a crappy (non) call. Pats got screwed. JMHO

You all hate seem to hate Belichick, but I'm sure if he was up to coach your team you'd have him in a hearbeat.

Hey! I was on your side!



I hate the Patriots for a lot more than Belichick. Great coach, though. No question about that.

 

[Scout101]

I'm good with whatever they traded to Satan for their football powers. Pats have only been relevant for the past 20 years, and only good for the past 15, so want to ride this out as long as I can. Smart enough to look around the league and see the mediocrity, so when you've got HOF coach and QB, gotta enjoy it, you'll be 8-8 with a middling draft pick again soon enough...

 

[Caligula]

It's happened again. Only difference is that it wasn't the last play of the game. This time, against Miami, Luke Kuechly prevented a TD catch with what seemed to be a pretty obvious helmet-to-helmet hit which was initially penalized, only to have the flag picked up. Apparently, Kuechly is immune from all end zone penalties. At least, that is my interpretation.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

Fucking Bears

 

[1001001]

Okay Timby, come get your whoopin'!!



Good grief does anyone remember when the Bears used play defense? The Rams rack up 260 yards on the ground with Zac Stacy and Benny Cunningham (!!).

And Kyle Long kicking a guy on the ground...nice. He should have been ejected. And I'll just throw in that roughing the passer call toward the end was total bullshit. Didn't matter in the end, but still that was terrible.

Go Rams!!!

 

[archeryguy1701]

All 4 NFC North teams played today, including 2 that played against each other, a none of them won. Somehow, it's fitting. The only way it would be more fitting is if this happened in the NFC East.

 

[Use of Time]

Another day, another game winning drive for the quintessential choke artist Tony Romo! Love it.