Please forgive the sloppiness...
Nice catch.
Didnt even notice the possible NuEnt up there.
New Ships Revealed!
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Nice catch.
Didnt even notice the possible NuEnt up there.
Trekkies are just that damn good!I love how trekkies have gotten so proficient in intelligence work like this.
I mean, to think that the Intelligence agencies of the US train people for years in Image analysis and such, so they can tell the type of ship, tank, airplane in a grainy photo...
And trekkies do it as a hobby. Something about that always gives me a chuckle.
Too smart for their own good sometimes as well...
Two great examples there... Especially the All Good Things Battle such a small taste of what ship combat in 3 dimensions could really be like.
I read somewhere once that as humans start living in space maintaining a 2D construction style for stations would develop because of problems adapting to long term 3D living... Ie once artificial gravity comes along, it just becomes simpler to keep all activitied alligned with the "up/down" of the gravity field to prevent something the writer refered to as situational spatial disruption. People would actually suffer from motion sickness like symptems from changing gravity orentation on a regular basis. This problem doesn't present itself in zero G situations.
Thus, zero G = 3D, Gravity = 2D design.
My first thought was "no", because the design departs so rapidly from the familiar mushroom design.
But the I remembered this:
And there is definitely a basic resemblance.
But the I remembered this:
And there is definitely a basic resemblance.
And it appears that design was adapted from a real-world conceptual model for a space station design proposed but never built by Douglas Aircraft, and which was later given to Roddenberry. There's mention of that here:My first thought was "no", because the design departs so rapidly from the familiar mushroom design.
But the I remembered this:
And there is definitely a basic resemblance.
http://drexfiles.wordpress.com/2009/02/27/welcome-to-k-7-now-go-home/
and I'm pretty sure I recall it coming up in discussion at TrekBBS before.
Thanks for that like- some good information and photos forthe library. When I saw the stepped pods I first thought it so they could open like giant hangar bay doors so a vehicle/cargo sould placed inside the hollow disk shape.
Nowhere Man
Commodore
That's no small moonNice looking station
I like the new ships too.
Its been a long while since we saw new starship desings in a Trek film, so its all good. I just hope we get closer peek at some of them in the film, besides Kelvin and Enterprise i mean
The center part reminds me of the Xindi super weapon.
Seems to me that the "Not the NuEnt" ship to the right, with the half-saucer, is repeated on the exact opposite docking dish, and on the dishtwo steps clockwise (or one step anticlockwise from the opposite dish). That is, it's the one with the joined nacelles.
So that'd be four distinct types:
1) the one with two joined nacelles atop and a secondary hull below
2) the one with one nacelle below and a secondary hull atop (USS Kelvin)
3) the one with three ventral nacelles and no secondary hull
4) the one with the nacelles on the secondary hull (USS Enterprise)
I'm rather happy with this selection, which not only cuts and pastes components (which is somewhat boring), but also seems to cut and paste two distinct sets of components (those of the Kelvin and the Enterprise). That, plus one of the ships doesn't use a round saucer. Better than your average kitbashing. Although I do wonder what would be the design intent and mission of the three-naceller, which seems to have the smallest and least substantial hull of them all (that is, just the saucer without add-ons). Does this combo mean extreme speed or what?
Timo Saloniemi
So that'd be four distinct types:
1) the one with two joined nacelles atop and a secondary hull below
2) the one with one nacelle below and a secondary hull atop (USS Kelvin)
3) the one with three ventral nacelles and no secondary hull
4) the one with the nacelles on the secondary hull (USS Enterprise)
I'm rather happy with this selection, which not only cuts and pastes components (which is somewhat boring), but also seems to cut and paste two distinct sets of components (those of the Kelvin and the Enterprise). That, plus one of the ships doesn't use a round saucer. Better than your average kitbashing. Although I do wonder what would be the design intent and mission of the three-naceller, which seems to have the smallest and least substantial hull of them all (that is, just the saucer without add-ons). Does this combo mean extreme speed or what?
Timo Saloniemi
Those connecting "hoops" for the various arrangements of kelvin style nacelles on the ships in view might infer more of a vulcan influence on ship design here than in the "prime" timeline. Perhaps the attack on the Kelvin spurred an acceleration of technical cooperation amongst federation member worlds. I wonder if the JJprise might even be the tactical equivalent of something beyond the TMP refit 1701 of the prime-line.
The curved engine pylons on the JJprise would make more sense as a follow-on to these hoop-ships. I can picture a version of the new E with the pylons continuing through the nacelles into a "roll-bar" connecting them with perhaps a Reliant/Miranda style centreline pod. I think there's a version of the Sovereign class in the ST Online gaming site with a similar connection between the engines.
The two types of shuttlecraft seen in that big hangar (Did they use the one for the Macon and its sister rigid airship?) suggest designs from before and after the timeline divergence operating together. The "prime" design would be what looks like a 23rd century precursor of the pre-TNG type 6 with traditional low-mount nacelles - it seems to be from the same generation as the evac shuttles seen leaving the Kelvin in trailer #2. The one with the high-mount baby nacelles looks like an early version of the late 24th century "Argo" type and is most likely a later model craft. This also seems to infer an accelerated pace of tech progression in this timeline.
The curved engine pylons on the JJprise would make more sense as a follow-on to these hoop-ships. I can picture a version of the new E with the pylons continuing through the nacelles into a "roll-bar" connecting them with perhaps a Reliant/Miranda style centreline pod. I think there's a version of the Sovereign class in the ST Online gaming site with a similar connection between the engines.
The two types of shuttlecraft seen in that big hangar (Did they use the one for the Macon and its sister rigid airship?) suggest designs from before and after the timeline divergence operating together. The "prime" design would be what looks like a 23rd century precursor of the pre-TNG type 6 with traditional low-mount nacelles - it seems to be from the same generation as the evac shuttles seen leaving the Kelvin in trailer #2. The one with the high-mount baby nacelles looks like an early version of the late 24th century "Argo" type and is most likely a later model craft. This also seems to infer an accelerated pace of tech progression in this timeline.
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It would depend a bit on whether we saw the larger, boxier shuttle do something else besides hauling large numbers of people from Earth to this orbital port near Earth. Perhaps the larger shuttles are fairly limited in capabilities, and are in fact much older than the "TOS style" or "pre-TNG style" craft? The angular shapes would IMHO rather suggest the past, if the smooth 1950'ness of the JJPrise is the look of the future...
We might of course be seeing retarded tech development in this parallel timeline, too. Perhaps lack of progress is the reason why PineKirk's ship still has so many display screens while ShatnerKirk's vessel makes do with fewer of them? And why PineKirk's ship sprouts smoke from the nacelles while ShatKirk's ship goes unleaded? And why PineKirk's shuttles are more Spartan from the inside than ShatKirk's, and rely on safety harnesses rather than IDFs? And why the transporters have to be aimed with a joystick rather than auto-aimed at the push of a button? Etc.
"Lack of progress" here might mean concentration on military matters at the expense of high tech innovation; possibly Nero's early actions precipitated military crises all over. Or it might mean laxness due to the absence of military threats; for all we know, Nero might have stopped George Kirk from launching a nasty war or two...
Timo Saloniemi
We might of course be seeing retarded tech development in this parallel timeline, too. Perhaps lack of progress is the reason why PineKirk's ship still has so many display screens while ShatnerKirk's vessel makes do with fewer of them? And why PineKirk's ship sprouts smoke from the nacelles while ShatKirk's ship goes unleaded? And why PineKirk's shuttles are more Spartan from the inside than ShatKirk's, and rely on safety harnesses rather than IDFs? And why the transporters have to be aimed with a joystick rather than auto-aimed at the push of a button? Etc.
"Lack of progress" here might mean concentration on military matters at the expense of high tech innovation; possibly Nero's early actions precipitated military crises all over. Or it might mean laxness due to the absence of military threats; for all we know, Nero might have stopped George Kirk from launching a nasty war or two...
Timo Saloniemi
Some interesting counterpoints Timo.
I'd be interested to know what type of shuttle is used for the commando raid on the drilling rig above Vulcan, if in fact it is one of the two I've referenced above. You'd expect the more advanced one to be on point for this type of duty. It does make sense though, that a boxier shuttle with winglets would possibly be more primitive. Alternatively, less aerodynamic could mean more reliant on "aero-buffer fields" or some such and thus more advanced. Hard to second guess future tech sometimes - those 31st century pods from ENT didn't look too flash.
As for the push button transporters of TOS, the entering of precise coordinates seemed central to the process, much like knowledge of various function keys and operating system quirks on earlier PC's was less user friendly than the point and click of more recent times. Once again, either perspective has valid points.
I'd be interested to know what type of shuttle is used for the commando raid on the drilling rig above Vulcan, if in fact it is one of the two I've referenced above. You'd expect the more advanced one to be on point for this type of duty. It does make sense though, that a boxier shuttle with winglets would possibly be more primitive. Alternatively, less aerodynamic could mean more reliant on "aero-buffer fields" or some such and thus more advanced. Hard to second guess future tech sometimes - those 31st century pods from ENT didn't look too flash.
As for the push button transporters of TOS, the entering of precise coordinates seemed central to the process, much like knowledge of various function keys and operating system quirks on earlier PC's was less user friendly than the point and click of more recent times. Once again, either perspective has valid points.
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The tech advancements may not all progress at the same speed- you would upgrade the most important syatems and vehicles first, then the tech tree would filter down as equipment gets replaced. As long as they still do the job they would keep the shuttles with old tech, newer designs would be built for special functions/Ops. Our current Navy is a good example- the newest next gen Carrier still has last gen support craft transporting supplies/crew.
You know, that's about what I was thinking - except I was thinking the one with two joined nacelles above and a secondary hull below might in fact have two secondary hulls - one per nacelle. In particular, you can see this if you look at the ship attached to far side of the left disc - it appears the secondary hulls are beneath the nacelles here. The other two that appear to be of the same type are positioned in such a way that a nacelle might be hiding a second Kelvin-type secondary hull. The only other option would be that the left ship is a fifth type with four nacelles.
So it looks like there are three type-1s, three type-2/Kelvins, one type-3, and one Enterprise.
There may also be a fifth (or sixth, depending on the hull/nacelle thing) type floating around beneath the lower right section of the station with a small saucer and two nacelles above - not unlike the Intrepid-type of ENT. There may also be two ships of this same type - with tiny, tiny saucer - attached to the lower left and upper right discs. Unless of course this is a sixth (or seventh) type...?
Very good observations and questions, particularly regarding the three-nacelle ship. I generally agree. I can't help but wonder if it has a deflector anywhere. Perhaps the designers had a look at FJ's Starfleet Technical Manual?
Oh Lordy....
WE can only pray that the Folks at ILM that worked on this film, are this Trek-centric and all of the above is true !
WE can only pray that the Folks at ILM that worked on this film, are this Trek-centric and all of the above is true !
I've been looking at the pic blown-up 400% and I'm starting to think the one I surmised that might be a Kelvin Type (on the lower left side...)..., isn't...
It appears to my eyes to be more of a Reliant Type with two nacelles below a primary hull only.
It also appears to be docked sideways instead of nose in.
Also, each ship where it's docked at the station, has a Ring Of Very Bright Lights that circle around facing the ship.
Also, each ship where it's docked at the station, has a Ring Of Very Bright Lights that circle around facing the ship.
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I couldn't decide fully either. I turned the contrast and brightness the whole way up and still couldn't decide:
I'm still thinking it's a Kelvin, but something about it does seem 'off.'
These are my best (quickly drawn) guesses at this point:
I'm still not entirely convinced the three ships in red - the 'arc ships' - are all of the same configuration. Nor am I entirely sure that all of the purple ships I dubbed 'sombrero' are all the same type.
But clearly, we have at least five ship types here.
Thanks for the links M'Sharak.
A quick google/wiki session indicates the homefield for the US Navy airship USS Macon was Moffett Federal Airfield in Santa Clara County, California, known in the 1930's as NAS Sunnyvale. The Tustin hangar looks like it was built for a big rigid airship too.
