News New EW Issue Details Bryan Fuller’s DISCOVERY Departure

[mattyhugh]

The more I read about what Mr. Fuller really wanted - I am HAPPY CBS showed him the door. I'm sure we would have seen the TOS era further retconned to be in line with his 24th century era ST:VOY <--- No thanks. Also, sorry to say, I was not impressed with his work on American Gods either - YMMV.

What didn't you like about AG?

 

[Vger23]

I was actually happy reading that because I have always hated Star Trek's allegories with a passion.
"Why are the green bunnies abusing the blue bunnies?"
"The green bunnies think they are better than the blue bunnies, they think the blue bunnies are less intelligent and need the green bunnies to tell them what to do, some even think the blue bunnies aren't actually bunnies, they think they're some kind of ape bunnies who learned how to talk!"
"But that's wrong, my sensors show that except for the color of their fur there's no differences between the bunnies!"
"The green bunnies don't care!"
"That's EVIL!"
"Yes, it is! But see, you are an enlightened human and we humans have learned from our mistakes, a long time ago in the dark ages of the early 21st century we were quite similar to the bunnies ... "

Excuse me while I barf into my cereal.

I'm not bothered by them dropping the complex story either, often more simple stories are more focused, more personal and actually better. Some of Star Trek's most memorable episodes are quite simple when it comes to the story.
"Data is ordered to do something he doesn't want to do and a court has to decide if he has rights", "the Borg attack and kidnap Picard, the Enterprise crew has to stop the borg and also save the captain", "Kira interrogates a suspected war criminal while Odo investigates who he really is".
Those aren't complex stories, some surprises and twists are thrown in but at their core they're quite simple.


But both had/have the advantage of being set in the present or near future of earth, real locations could be used without problems for many episodes, costumes can be bought in stores etc.

For Star Trek that's not possible, if Discovery's second season had skipped forward a few decades that would have required all new props, costumes, heavily rebuild and redressed sets, new ship designs, new visual effects etc., you have to update everything. That's way more expensive.

I also think part of the reason Trek looked as good as it did was that at least fornthe later shows they knew they'd run for several years and initial costs would amortize over time.
Would DS9s promenade have been as expansive as it was had they known it would be used for 13 episodes before the series moves to a new location? Or would we have gotten a smaller version with a small Quark's (forget three levels) a sickbay and then a sharp turn with blinking lights just around the corner.
When they moved from TNG to Voyager would engineering have been rebuild so extensively that it looked like a new set or would they have paid for a new warp core and the rest would have been "new carpet, paint he walls gray and move the pool table to the location of Geordie's 'cubicle'" with only the window disappearing? Would there even have been an engineering? Because if you only do 13 episodes you have a pretty good idea what sets you need, so you only build the ones you need, not the ones you might need down the line because there is no down the line.

I didn't say it was possible for Trek. I simply said it would be cool. The feasibility of it had nothing to do with anything.

 

[Mr Awe]

Sorry, but that's incorrect. I was at cons for almost 30 years. I've talked to people since. I do a podcast where many people have written in over the last six years. There was *serious* Trek burnout. "What, ANOTHER show?". I had serious Trek fatigue myself because you need time to breathe and we weren't getting that.

The multiple series were too bland. They didn't change over time. If each show had been different, fatigue would've at least happened more slowly. Although, by any objective standards, the run of series was a success. After all, you had four series that produced 25 seasons of television!

 

[CRM-114]

Personally, I'll attest to my own burnout with Star Trek during ENT season three. I had to walk away from Star Trek for a good two to three years before the announcement of JJ Abrams coming into Star Trek got my anttention. I had long felt that Star Trek badly needed new creative blood, to bring a fresh perspective to the franchise.

 

[BillJ]

Sorry, but that's incorrect. I was at cons for almost 30 years. I've talked to people since. I do a podcast where many people have written in over the last six years. There was *serious* Trek burnout. "What, ANOTHER show?". I had serious Trek fatigue myself because you need time to breathe and we weren't getting that.

I'm a huge Trek fan, but when they announced Voyager, I rolled my eyes. I tried to keep up but just lost interest. I finally saw it all years later in bits and pieces.

KIRK: Too much of anything, Lieutenant, even love, isn't necessarily a good thing.

 

[KirkusOveractus]

I think also, to me, during VOY was when I started seeing the same names as writers or story contributors, then reading about how they had a room full of the same people, processing the stories using the same formula.

It killed the possibility of different stories with different styles to them. It's what made the best moments of TOS, TNG and DS9 work so well was that although scripts were tailored by the main production team, it wasn't a room of people that ran the stories completely.

 

[Ralphis]

I really want to see what those subdued TOS-style uniforms looked like. Lets get those leaked. Make it so.

 

[Mudd]

The only specific thing I can get from that article about what changed after Fuller left is the costuming (the "multi-generational anthology" thing having been abandoned early in his tenure).

 

[Kor]

I wonder if he got a decent severance package.

Kor

 

[Tuskin38]

I'm sure we would have seen the TOS era further retconned to be in line with his 24th century era ST:VOY

Weird, to me it sounded like he wanted to keep it more faithful.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

A Star Trek anthology. Where have I seen this idea before? Oh right here: http://trekcomic.com/episodes/

 

[cultcross]

Personally, I'll attest to my own burnout with Star Trek during ENT season three. I had to walk away from Star Trek for a good two to three years before the announcement of JJ Abrams coming into Star Trek got my anttention. I had long felt that Star Trek badly needed new creative blood, to bring a fresh perspective to the franchise.

I felt the same, although lost interest earlier. Mid Voyager, I was already watching because it was Trek, not because it was holding my interest or doing anything that made me sit up and take notice. Nothing remarkable happened all the way through the rest of Voyager and all the way through Enterprise. No risks, no new directions. Season 4 of ENT was portrayed as some kind of new start, but it was more of the same, with added fanwank.

It wasn't the number of Trek series, it was the number of episodes produced by the exact same people, to the exact same formula, in the exact same way. It got writing fatigue because it was never taken anywhere new or interesting. Every good idea (like the Maquis on Voyager) was smothered in its infancy and we went back to 'same old'. If Voyager had been a radical new direction for Trek, it could have prevented the fatigue. But it wasn't, it was TNG with cheaper actors and all the ideas spent.

 

[Shalashaska]

Well, I hope it's still good.

The "more heavily allegorical and complex story line" being tossed along with his other ideas is disheartening though. I had a lot of faith in Fuller that I don't have in the current producers/showrunners.

It's a shame money plays such a large role in the decision-making process.

 

[ISS Enterprise]

I felt the same, although lost interest earlier. Mid Voyager, I was already watching because it was Trek, not because it was holding my interest or doing anything that made me sit up and take notice. Nothing remarkable happened all the way through the rest of Voyager and all the way through Enterprise. No risks, no new directions. Season 4 of ENT was portrayed as some kind of new start, but it was more of the same, with added fanwank.

It wasn't the number of Trek series, it was the number of episodes produced by the exact same people, to the exact same formula, in the exact same way. It got writing fatigue because it was never taken anywhere new or interesting. Every good idea (like the Maquis on Voyager) was smothered in its infancy and we went back to 'same old'. If Voyager had been a radical new direction for Trek, it could have prevented the fatigue. But it wasn't, it was TNG with cheaper actors and all the ideas spent.

BINGO. Feel same way, Trek was tedious n formulated and rarely fun and interesting at mid to tail end of Berman and crew era

 

[fireproof78]

Well, I hope it's still good.

The "more heavily allegorical and complex story line" being tossed along with his other ideas is disheartening though. I had a lot of faith in Fuller that I don't have in the current producers/showrunners.

It's a shame money plays such a large role in the decision-making process.

Until they can make it for free, it's nice to have Star Trek at all, even if money is part of the decision making process.

GR was the same way. More things change, the more they stay the same. I don't have to like it (and I don't) but I'll not pretend that money doesn't exist.

 

[T'Bonz]

I think the time constraints/needing to work on his other show was the cause, based on what I read.

 

[DS9ers]

The multiple series were too bland. They didn't change over time. If each show had been different, fatigue would've at least happened more slowly.

I agree with that. I always felt like TNG was very fresh because of how many years it had been since TOS had been on the air. I felt like they did a great job making DS9 different. For me the fatigue started with VOY and ran into ENT. I like aspects of both of those shows but they are so similar in tone to TNG. Plus by the time those shows rolled around there were already so many episodes of Star Trek in the can. It had to be very hard to come up with ideas that seemed original and fresh.

 

[Quinton O'Connor]

I was 6 when Voyager premiered, so it still felt very new and very ambitious to me pretty much the whole way through. I was only disappointed that the last two seasons, especially 6, declined to embrace the levels of light serialization and stronger characterization seen in the fourth and fifth years.

Anyway, I was only ever cautious insofar as the rumored anthology angle was concerned here, so I am not losing much sleep over this one. While I hope for a day we'll see the 24th and even 25th centuries again, I was skeptical about the potential for single-season crews. The long-form character work is one of my favorite aspects of any franchise I enjoy. Had the Discovery crew hopped forward in time somehow, I might have been more enthusiastic, and I'm always willing to give anything Trek a huge chance. But the rumor itself fell fairly flat.

 

[Jayson1]

While the new look has made me wonder about the show being a prime universe show to me this stuff is what creates the bigger concern in terms if the show will be good or ruined by the network.

To me when you got a talent you find away to work around certain issues such as the show taking longer to get started. Look at someone like Ryan Murphy. The guy has like 5 shows going at once and I imagine some people probably find that frustrating as well but that seems to be the price if you deal with to get the best people involved.

I loved that idea of doing a show that explores Trek from prequel to future setting.

Jason

 

[Mudd]

Maybe the folks at CBS didn't think Fuller was "the best people."