Narnia books without the Pevensie kids. Too risky to film?

[Owain Taggart]

That would be a good idea, but then again, I don't know how many people would be pissed at the changes in The Last Battle, but I'd say considering the plot in The Last Battle is weak to begin with, it could probably use a bit more depth than what we got in the book. Maybe the enemy could be under power of the witch, which would explain why the world is dying and tie it into what was seen in Wardrobe with her having an effect on the land.

 

[Argus Skyhawk]

Her continued appearances in the series makes me wonder if they were setting her up as an ongoing villain, with plans to replace Tash with the White Witch in The Last Battle– assuming the films were to get that far. Having the Witch return with her followers to overthrow Narnia would sidestep the racial and cultural insensitivity of using ersatz Muslims as the evil opposition to our good Christians, and allow them to bookend the series with the same conflict that began it.

Heck, I know people have been questioning the viability of filming The Magicians Nephew, and that approach could allow the two to be rolled together into one story by weaving parts of Nephew into Battle as flashbacks, establishing how the Witch got to Narnia in the first place and why she's so powerful there. Plus you'd get the nice bookends of showing Aslan, the Witch and the Pevensie family present for both the creation and the destruction of Narnia.

Interesting idea, but would having her return in The Last Battle conflict to much with the fact that we saw her defeated in the first movie?

 

[Gepard]

^We know from the filmed version of Caspian that the Witch still exists in some form, and further that she has followers who possess the ability to return her to life. It was only Edmund shattering the ice that stopped them, remember. And it's a common conceit of fantasy stories that villains are defeated once by the heroes, survive in some form, rebuild their power, and come back stronger than ever for a final conflict. (Harry Potter and The Lord of the Rings come immediately to mind.)

The big problem with The Last Battle, as Owain noted, is that it feels a bit unfocused; the book starts off with the Ape and Donkey impersonating the return of Aslan, suckering in a lot of rubes, and then takes a sharp left into anti-Arab sentiment with the primary enemy being an evil God we've never heard of before. If I were in charge of the franchise, I'd scrap all of that and replace the antagonists with a cult dedicated to the White Witch, who've succeeded in bringing her back. I feel they could introduce a lot more menace that way, and it would have the cache of building on the established mythology. Anyhow, if the Aslan represents God/Jesus and the Witch the Devil (as indicated by her claim on Edmund's soul in Lion and her temptation of Digory with the apple in The Magician's Nephew), it's thematically appropriate for her to be present at the end of the world. In the Bible, God already defeated Lucifer once by casting him out of heaven (Narnia*), but he's still going to come back for seconds at Armageddon. And you wouldn't write a Christian story series where Satan bites the big one in the first installment, you know?

*(Yea, I know heaven is Aslan's Country, but work with me.)

 

[MNM]

Her continued appearances in the series makes me wonder if they were setting her up as an ongoing villain...

Maybe I misinterpreted it, but technically, it wasnt actually her in the Dawntreader was it? It was some vague "evil" that took the shape of things to tempt you, so that "evil" took the Witch's appearance with Edmund, but it wasnt actually her...

 

[Gepard]

I haven't seen Dawn Treader yet, so you may be right. I sort of had the impression from reviews that the green fog was in some way connected with the Witch, but maybe not.

 

[Out Of My Vulcan Mind]

As is so often the case with fantasy films, Dawn Treader is doing a lot better in international markets (albeit with a few exceptions) than it is domestically. It's become quite common for fantasy films to make as much as 65-80% of their box office abroad since the popularity of the genre in the US lags behind the rest of the world.

Dawn Treader has made $110.8 million worldwide so far, with $83.5 million of that coming from foreign markets. It scored the biggest openings of the Narnia series to date in Russia, Mexico, and South Korea. Its opening in France was about the same as that of Prince Caspian, while it significantly underperformed in the UK, opening to about half of what Prince Caspian opened to. In other words its box office problems stem from a lack of enthusiasm in English-speaking territories.

 

[Admiral_Young]

I saw it on Tuesday evening with friends (going again with my brother still as planned on Saturday night still) and found that I enjoyed it immensely. Thought it was actually slightly better than "Prince Caspian".

 

[Owain Taggart]

Her continued appearances in the series makes me wonder if they were setting her up as an ongoing villain...

Maybe I misinterpreted it, but technically, it wasnt actually her in the Dawntreader was it? It was some vague "evil" that took the shape of things to tempt you, so that "evil" took the Witch's appearance with Edmund, but it wasnt actually her...

That's what I said earlier. She's simply an apparition due to the thoughts that the mist is making Edmund think of, hence why he suddenly thinks of the sea serpent. He was distracted with evil thoughts. And that's why I have no problem with that specific change for the movie, because technically she isn't part of the movie, but simply a cameo based on a thought. We all saw how everyone had certain thoughts, like Lucy wanting to be beautiful like Susan, hence her cameo. The mist just projected those thoughts and made them stronger, which happened as they were nearing the evil island.

 

[Brian]

Has anyone else been annoyed by the way the announcer says "Dawn Treader" in the TV commercials? I've always read and said it with emphasis on the first half of "Treader", like "dawn TREA-der". For weeks, the commercial guy has been saying "DAWN treader", like you would say "DAY trader" when talking about people who play in the stock market. It's a subtle difference, but it has annoyed me every time I heard it.

I finally heard him say it correctly (i.e., MY way, lol) in the theatrical trailer I saw before "Tangled" a couple of weeks ago.

 

[Thestral]

As is so often the case with fantasy films, Dawn Treader is doing a lot better in international markets (albeit with a few exceptions) than it is domestically. It's become quite common for fantasy films to make as much as 65-80% of their box office abroad since the popularity of the genre in the US lags behind the rest of the world.

Dawn Treader has made $110.8 million worldwide so far, with $83.5 million of that coming from foreign markets. It scored the biggest openings of the Narnia series to date in Russia, Mexico, and South Korea. Its opening in France was about the same as that of Prince Caspian, while it significantly underperformed in the UK, opening to about half of what Prince Caspian opened to. In other words its box office problems stem from a lack of enthusiasm in English-speaking territories.

Intriguing. Is there a possibility (however slim) that we may get The Silver Chair because of The Dawn Treader's performance in the non-domestic market?

I've seen it, thought it was excellent. Eustace and Reepicheep stole the movie, as they did the book. I thought

Spoiler: Eustace

Eustace the Dragon

was really well done, and thought the film did an excellent job tying together the rather episodic and somewhat disconnected nature of the book. I'd be very happy to see them continue the series with these folks, and liked the "there if you know it" nod towards a sequel at the end. "Eustace, Jill Pole has dropped in for a visit."

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Has anyone else been annoyed by the way the announcer says "Dawn Treader" in the TV commercials?

I've always "heard" it as "Tray-der," like "Traitor" but with a "d" sound.

Of course, I always thought Hermione was said "Hermey-own," so what do I know.

 

[Out Of My Vulcan Mind]

Intriguing. Is there a possibility (however slim) that we may get The Silver Chair because of The Dawn Treader's performance in the non-domestic market?

Films released in December are tricky to predict because they often have strong legs. The series certainly has an uphill battle at this point, but we need to see how it holds up over the coming weeks to properly evaluate what its chances are for another installment.

If its drop-off pattern is like that of The Golden Compass and it makes just $65 million domestic then a further sequel won't happen because domestic theater owners would balk at its production (and the theater owners have significant sway over what the studios produce). If it has a drop-off pattern like, or a little better than, Lemony Snicket's A Series of Unfortunate Events and it makes just under or just over $100 million, together with a strong enough foreign performance to get it to $350-400 million worldwide, then there's a chance of another one, albeit still a relatively slim chance.

The bean counters will probably crunch the numbers to see whether The Silver Chair can be produced on a further reduced budget and what they come up with will be another key element in whether the series continues.

 

[Greylock Crescent]

Y'know, given Hollywood's propensity for recycling known franchises and titles, I'd say it's not a matter of *if* another Narnia film ever gets made ... but a matter of when. And whether or not it be with the current production team and actors. But I've little doubt that eventually another Narnia film will be made. What interests me is whether or not it will be The Silver Chair or a fresh reboot of the franchise.

 

[Thestral]

Has anyone else been annoyed by the way the announcer says "Dawn Treader" in the TV commercials?

I've always "heard" it as "Tray-der," like "Traitor" but with a "d" sound.

Of course, I always thought Hermione was said "Hermey-own," so what do I know.

Surely "Tredd-er" makes more sense, since it's "treading" the Dawn (ie sailing to the far east)?

The bean counters will probably crunch the numbers to see whether The Silver Chair can be produced on a further reduced budget and what they come up with will be another key element in whether the series continues.

Well, depending on how they do the underground scenes, I can see The Silver Chair as being the smallest budgeted of the Narnia series. Much of the book consists of a lonely journey through empty wasteland and the climactic scene consists of four people and

Spoiler: Silver Chair antagonist

a giant snake

. There's only a brief bit with massive armies that goes nowhere and very little combat; it's much more character-driven than any of the Narnia series so far.

 

[Out Of My Vulcan Mind]

^^^
Plus the giants of course, although FX concerning giants can probably be done relatively easily these days.

 

[Thestral]

^ That's what I was thinking, yeah. I mean, surely "Gulliver's Travels" can't have a very large budget, can it?

BTW: Alan Rickman for Puddleglum.

 

[Gepard]

Well, depending on how they do the underground scenes, I can see The Silver Chair as being the smallest budgeted of the Narnia series. Much of the book consists of a lonely journey through empty wasteland and the climactic scene consists of four people and

Spoiler: Silver Chair antagonist

a giant snake

. There's only a brief bit with massive armies that goes nowhere and very little combat; it's much more character-driven than any of the Narnia series so far.

Keep in mind, however, that Puddleglum -- one of the main characters -- is a lanky, Gollum-esque creature who would probably need to be realized entirely through CGI. And he's basically "on-screen" in the book for, like, 90% of the time.

 

[Owain Taggart]

I saw him as a hobo-like dwarf living in the swamps, so it shouldn't be too hard for the character to be fully realized.

 

[Gepard]

It's been a long time since I read the books, but I seem to recall Puddleglum being described (and illustrated in the copy I have) as being greenish, very thin and quite a bit taller than either of the kids. Definitely not a dwarf.

 

[Thestral]

Very tall and lanky shouldn't be too hard to do though, and a green tint the same. Wiki says about Marsh-wiggles "They are described as having large ears and green-grey dreadlocks. They have strong leathery skin and very long limbs attached to short torsos. Both their hands and their feet are webbed, as it says in The Silver Chair, "like a duck's""The webbed hands/feet and the dreads shouldn't be terribly difficult either. Depends on how much they want to play up his bizarreness, but I'd say it shouldn't be more complicated than, say, a Cardassian's makeup.

I was surprised to learn it was Tom Baker they had doing Puddleglum for the BBC TV adaptations; I KNEW there was a reason he looked familiar in clips of the old Who.