Mmmm...Cardassian philosophy...

[Deranged Nasat]

I'm in one of my philosophical moods and I'm wondering if anyone wishes to share their Trek reading experiences.

I recently reread my favourite Trek novel, "A Stitch in Time". One of the things I loved about this novel was its exploration of Cardassian philosophy and spirituality, and the subtlty with which it is addressed. Each time I read this book I discover new depths, new links, new implicit ideas and backstories that make me appreciate just how much thought Andrew Robinson put into the cultural psychology of the Cardassian. The apparent simplicity of the text conceals many layers of understanding. The novel is itself written as a manifestation of the Cardassian mind, with the reader having to look "beneath the mask" and live with all these layers at once, as the Cardassian does. While I appreciate the complexities and themes of any novel I read, I'm not one to go out of his way to find "depth" and meaning if it isn't there, but "A Stitch in Time" is full of such, and is deeply moving too.

What makes it even better is that, thanks to our modern inter-connected Trek lit universe, other novels have been inspired by it and built upon its themes and philosophical ideas. One of my favourite Trek novels other than "A Stitch in Time" is "Well of Souls", and I loved how that novel clearly explored and enhanced "A Stitch in Time", on the level of abstract philosophy and theme. Realizing the connections between "Well of Souls" and Tain's "we are the night people" speech in "A Stitch in Time" ranks as one of the most thrilling Trek lit experiences I've had, and contemplating the links was greatly enjoyable.

So, I was wondering, does anyone else remember a philosophical, thematic or ideological link between Trek novels that they really appreciated or enjoyed?

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Yes. A Stitch in Time.

Seriously, not only is A Stitch in Time my favorite Star Trek novel, it's one of my favorite novels period for the same reasons you already expressed (and many others). And because of that novel, I've become very interested in Cardassian culture.

I highly recommend checking out the Terok Nor trilogy because it builds upon a lot of ideas Robinson created in his novel.

I can't wait for The Never-Ending Sacrifice because I figure it's going to be a treat just like those four novels.

 

[Deranged Nasat]

Yes. A Stitch in Time.

Seriously, not only is A Stitch in Time my favorite Star Trek novel, it's one of my favorite novels period for the same reasons you already expressed (and many others). And because of that novel, I've become very interested in Cardassian culture.

I highly recommend checking out the Terok Nor trilogy because it builds upon a lot of ideas Robinson created in his novel.

I can't wait for The Never-Ending Sacrifice because I figure it's going to be a treat just like those four novels.

Oh, I've read the Terok Nor books. I read all Trek books. Like you, I've become greatly interested in Cardassian culture (the Cardassians, particularly in the novels, are one of the gems of Trek). I second your opinion that "A Stitch in Time" is a great novel, period, not just a great Trek novel. I find it moving, amazingly complex and quite inspiring, and the further complexities added by "Well of Souls", "Terok Nor" etc. prove why serial tie-in fiction can trump "original" fiction when at its best. As for The Never-Ending Sacrifice...

 

[KRAD]

ASiT was also a major inspiration for my "Lost Era" novel The Art of the Impossible. (Well, the Cardassian bits, at least... )

 

[Deranged Nasat]

ASiT was also a major inspiration for my "Lost Era" novel The Art of the Impossible. (Well, the Cardassian bits, at least... )

Oh yes, sorry to leave you off the list, KRAD!

 

[William Leisner]

Well, to be frank, I don't think there's a single piece of Cardassian-related TrekLit since 1999 that does not draw from ASiT...

 

[Marie1]

I liked the insight into Cardassian culture- especially coming from Garak, who you usually can't even torture stuff out of!

Nerys, where are you? We need you in here!
(She picks up on everything Cardassian!)

 

[Thor Damar]

I'm afraid that Neryrs Ghemor is required elsewhere at the present time (in glorious service to the state of course).

As one of our other resident Cardassians I welcome this thread and wish to thank Deranged Nasat for stating so eloquently the myriad reasons why some of us have taken the Cardassian people to our hearts.

For me ASiT is one of the greatest world building novels of ST and a truly worthy vehicle for exploring the Cardassian psyche. Indeed, it has become the inspiration for many aspects of Cardassian culture that we see in recent treklit, from the discovery of a Cardassian religion (the Oralian Way) to the makeup of Cardassian society . All in all it is a comprehensive look at those Magnificent Scaly Bastards that I hope will be built upon and developed in TNES.

My powers of monologuing have shamefully failed me so I'll end by one again thanking Deranged Nasat for the superb essay.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Oh, yes, how could I possibly forget The Art of the Impossible, my favorite of the Lost Era novels? Wonderful further exploration of Cardassian history and culture.

 

[JD]

ASIT is also one of my favorite books of any kind, TAOTI too. The one thing that really amazes me to this day about TOATI is how well KRAD was able to tie together so many things we heard about, like Khitomer, and all because of one 20 exchange between two characters. IMO it, and Serpents Among the Ruins are two perfect examples of what kinds of stuff Trek Lit is doing now... and ASIT too, of course.

 

[Elemental]

I'm about halfway through ASiT for the first time. I'm curious at what point most people really fell in love with this book. While I'm enjoying it, I'm not to the point where I would rank it one of my favourite Trek novels.

 

[Deranged Nasat]

I'm about halfway through ASiT for the first time. I'm curious at what point most people really fell in love with this book. While I'm enjoying it, I'm not to the point where I would rank it one of my favourite Trek novels.

It had me gripped from the beginning, but the point where I really fell in love was with Garak's explanation of the Regnar. That passage had a...stark beauty?...to it that really captured a sense of how harsh and unforgiving Cardassian society is, and yet with such a strong spirituality and wisdom lurking in their somewhere, whether the Cardassians acknowledge it or not. This sense would continue to be conveyed at many other points throughout the novel. That was the end of chapter 10 (quite near the beginning). Even prior to that, chapter 7 was extremely moving, and the quick transition from chapter 6, with these two periods in Garak's life played against each other, really allowed me to start appreciating how the Cardassian mind works. I got quite tearful over this part: "there is no home anymore, can't you see? Look around you, it's gone!"

I loved the way in which Andrew Robinson gave the Cardassians such a moving, inspirational spirituality, a wisdom, beauty and even fragility, without- and here's the important thing- without in any way detracting from the harshness, brutality and strength that were so clearly established on TV.

 

[Deranged Nasat]

I'm afraid that Neryrs Ghemor is required elsewhere at the present time (in glorious service to the state of course).

As one of our other resident Cardassians I welcome this thread and wish to thank Deranged Nasat for stating so eloquently the myriad reasons why some of us have taken the Cardassian people to our hearts.

For me ASiT is one of the greatest world building novels of ST and a truly worthy vehicle for exploring the Cardassian psyche. Indeed, it has become the inspiration for many aspects of Cardassian culture that we see in recent treklit, from the discovery of a Cardassian religion (the Oralian Way) to the makeup of Cardassian society . All in all it is a comprehensive look at those Magnificent Scaly Bastards that I hope will be built upon and developed in TNES.

My powers of monologuing have shamefully failed me so I'll end by one again thanking Deranged Nasat for the superb essay.

Simply performing my duty in service to Cardassia, Thor Damar. I assume Nerys Ghemor's current activities are classified?

 

[Thor Damar]

^ I'm afraid that such information cannot be divulged at the current time. Your excellent service to the Union has been warmly noticed and appreciated by the Union and all Cardassians everywhere.

(just to break character at this point and say that the juxtaposition of Garak's life on old Cardassia, Deep Space Nine and in the ruins of Cardassia City has to be one of the greatest literary devices in any trek novel.
I have to say that the sequel to ASiT was a bit of a disappointment to me.)

 

[JD]

I don't remember a specific point where I fell in love with ASIT, I think it was pretty quickly into once I got used to the style of it. I also have to express my appreciation for what the Cardassians have become since ASIT was published, they're deffinitely one of my favorite Star Trek species (races? I've never been sure which is appropriate here). My others are Klingons, Romulans, Bajorans, Andorians and Vulcans.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

Dang! I have NO idea what took me so long to find this thread!

But, I'm here now...

I thought A Stitch in Time was a remarkable book that gave a LOT of detail on Cardassian culture. And yet in at least one place, I think I caught Garak in an outright, canon-contradicting lie. Now, it was perfectly in character for him to tell this lie, if you ask me--I think he was doing it to keep Bashir from asking certain questions, or from feeling sorry for him in any way. And yet it was a lie (I think).

(DON'T tell me, Garak, that Cardassians don't angst about the past...I can catch you out on several instances, even a couple in your own book... )

But for me, so far I actually think the most moving Cardassian story I've read--though it certainly wouldn't have happened without A Stitch in Time--is the Terok Nor trilogy. I absolutely LOVED the themes of spirituality running through it, found myself getting very, very attached to the Oralian characters--Bennek and Astraea especially. And then there's the revelation about Glinn Sa'kat...

Spoiler: Glinn Sa'kat

His full name is THRAX Sa'kat!

And now, post-War, Cardassia is in a very fragile state, at a crossroads, and you can feel the tension as to which way it might go. There's a lot of hope and a lot of potential there...and I am just hoping they'll find a way to go that is not chaos, return to dictatorship, OR a clone of the Federation.

 

[Deranged Nasat]

Dang! I have NO idea what took me so long to find this thread!

But, I'm here now...

I thought A Stitch in Time was a remarkable book that gave a LOT of detail on Cardassian culture. And yet in at least one place, I think I caught Garak in an outright, canon-contradicting lie. Now, it was perfectly in character for him to tell this lie, if you ask me--I think he was doing it to keep Bashir from asking certain questions, or from feeling sorry for him in any way. And yet it was a lie (I think).

(DON'T tell me, Garak, that Cardassians don't angst about the past...I can catch you out on several instances, even a couple in your own book... )

But for me, so far I actually think the most moving Cardassian story I've read--though it certainly wouldn't have happened without A Stitch in Time--is the Terok Nor trilogy. I absolutely LOVED the themes of spirituality running through it, found myself getting very, very attached to the Oralian characters--Bennek and Astraea especially. And then there's the revelation about Glinn Sa'kat...

Spoiler: Glinn Sa'kat

His full name is THRAX Sa'kat!

And now, post-War, Cardassia is in a very fragile state, at a crossroads, and you can feel the tension as to which way it might go. There's a lot of hope and a lot of potential there...and I am just hoping they'll find a way to go that is not chaos, return to dictatorship, OR a clone of the Federation.

Hopefully, the

Spoiler: politics

expanded Khitomer Accords

will be the answer .

The revelation about Sa'kat was brilliant, I agree.

Let's hope Astraea and Sa'kat and Oralius (bit of a triangle going on there, if Astrea isn't supposed to have family beyond "my mother's name is Astraea, my daughter's name will be Astraea" ) return in "The Never-Ending Sacrifice". If not, it will still be fantastic I'm sure, but I hope they do. Given Rugal's background among (I assume) religious Bajorans, his story might intersect with theirs...

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

Indeed...I think that could be quite the revelation for him to discover religious Cardassians. A bit of an upset to the stereotype his "father" put in his head, don't you think? (Man, I am STILL steamed that Proka wasn't held responsible for the verbal abuse, even if he didn't beat the kid...)

 

[Thor Damar]

^ Well I think that given his true fathers dissident sympathies, Rugal may find the Oralian way easier to find than your average Cardassian...

That said if the Cardassian revolution of 2372 isn't shown in NES with all the repressions thereof then I shall be quite dismayed.

(BTW Degranged Narsat have you ever read Andrew Robinson's sequel to ASiT? )

 

[Deranged Nasat]

^ Well I think that given his true fathers dissident sympathies, Rugal may find the Orlian way easier to find than your average Cardassian...

That said if the Cardassian revolution of 2372 isn't shown in NES with all the repressions thereof then I shall be quite dismayed.

(BTW Degranged Narsat have you ever read Andrew Robinson's sequel to ASiT? )

I did indeed read "The Calling". I quite liked it. It certainly wasn't up to "A Stitch in Time" standards, but I thought it was a moving story and an interesting continuation of the character work in "ASiT". That said, I can understand why some were disappointed.

It did mark the first actual apperance of Oralius herself (or himself, depending on sect ), which I liked.