It started when he let a bratty teenager move in with him for an episode.
Time to move on.
Michael Chabon vs Trekkies
- Thread starter F. King Daniel
- Start date
Time to move on.
I was about to ask him the same thing. And I don't mean to be rude, but humans have been far from perfect in other series. And it's more interesting to have a show with imperfect people and imperfect people striving to be better to be honest.
Ummm...what? Why would it *have* to happen at the end of TNG ? That is what makes no sense. It's been more time since Nemesis than the time between Encounter at Farpoint and Nemesis and he's been retired for 14 years yet people want him to act like he was in early TNG for some reason. He was already softening up towards the end of TNG/Nemesis anyway.
Picard's been retired for 14 years. When he was in Starfleet, he had to act a certain way. As an Admiral, he had to project a certain image. Now that he's retired, he doesn't have to do that anymore. Now that he's in his 90s, he doesn't give a fuck anymore.
That's why he's different. I don't think he's "softened up". I think he's actually gone the other way but in a different way.
If you want to see the "real" Picard in TNG, look at "Encounter at Farpoint" when he tells Riker he doesn't want to make him ass of himself. Look at "Tapestry" when he says he'd rather die than live a menial life. Look at "Chain of Command" when he's almost broken. Look at "Attached" when he shares his feelings with Crusher. Or like at "The Inner Light" for what he'd be like as a family man and later when he falls in love with Darrin in "Lessons".
Picard on the bridge of the Enterprise, that's just him "on stage." As The Captain, he has to be "Prim and proper", like Vina said to Pike in "The Cage".
Most obvious difference between Picard and Captain Picard is when he ends up on an adventure with Vash in "Captain's Holiday" and then in "Qpid" he tries to keep everything to himself rather than tell the crew anything. Which pisses off Vash. She knows one Picard while the crew, except for Beverly, only knows another.
That's why he's different. I don't think he's "softened up". I think he's actually gone the other way but in a different way.
If you want to see the "real" Picard in TNG, look at "Encounter at Farpoint" when he tells Riker he doesn't want to make him ass of himself. Look at "Tapestry" when he says he'd rather die than live a menial life. Look at "Chain of Command" when he's almost broken. Look at "Attached" when he shares his feelings with Crusher. Or like at "The Inner Light" for what he'd be like as a family man and later when he falls in love with Darrin in "Lessons".
Picard on the bridge of the Enterprise, that's just him "on stage." As The Captain, he has to be "Prim and proper", like Vina said to Pike in "The Cage".
Most obvious difference between Picard and Captain Picard is when he ends up on an adventure with Vash in "Captain's Holiday" and then in "Qpid" he tries to keep everything to himself rather than tell the crew anything. Which pisses off Vash. She knows one Picard while the crew, except for Beverly, only knows another.
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I guess I just don't get it. I spent all last year rewatching TNG, finished up with Nemesis a few days before the first episode of Picard, and when I watched the show I still saw the same Picard - a realistic portrayal of a man 20 years older, a Picard with 20 years of history behind him, but ultimately the same character.
Because its a nonissue being made in to an issue because issues are fun...??? I really don't know. Like, I don't even like Picard and I don't see this as an issue.
You're either a troll, an idiot or have more or less ignored Star Trek for the last 25 years.
You mean how in TUC you had Starfleet conspiring with Klingons to murder their own Chancellor and frame Kirk and McCoy for it?
How you had a Starfleet Admiral conspiring with the Son'a to displace an entire planets population because they wanted it's secrets to health and everlasting life? The Admiral that allowed the Son'a to attack the E-E?
How about the humans who joined the Maquis and engaged in terrorism against both the Federation and Cardassians?
The Star Trek you think you love has never existed
On the "JL" thing, it's worth noting that that Rafi was wearing her uniform but didn't appear to be "on duty" when she called Picard "JL" and they were having a casual conversation. It's not like we saw a scene on a ship with him saying "Commander, go secure the refugees" and her responding "sure thing JL"
It's actually even weirder considering it's coming from someone with a DS9 avatar.
Star trek is about the human experience. The good, the bad and everything in between
Yeah, they have apparently been on several backwater Romulan Planets trying to save as many folks as they can, so Raffi and Jean-Luc obviously have a long term working relationship that transcends Star Fleet formalities.
If we see the two of them on an Actual Star Fleet Bridge and she calls him JL, then I think folks could have something to bee-otch about.
(barely)
Ad hominems aren't an argument, and most of the good star trek out there is older than 25 years. You should check some of it out.
I'd say it's about half-and-half.
But it looks as if you don't actually agree with this assessment. Your profile says you like TNG, DS9, VOY, and ENT.
TNG: 1987-1994
DS9: 1993-1999
VOY: 1995-2001
ENT: 2001-2005
Going by the opinion on your profile: of what you like only TNG and the first two seasons of DS9 are more than 25 years old. Only nine seasons out of the 25 total seasons you theoretically like, if you like every season of every series (which may or may not be the case). So the majority of the Star Trek you like is actually newer than 25 years old.
You're not an Old-Schooler. You don't even appear to be a TOS Fan.
Okay, so ignoring the first part, please address the remaining points.
"Good trek"
Which apparently is TOS, which isn't consistent with his prior critiques of Picard given that if anything the Federation/humanity is even more flawed than it is in Picard..
TAS, which I've not watched because it wasn't even considered canon for decades
TNG, the first two seasons of DS9, and Movies 1-7
I guess the entirety of DS9 S3-7, Voyager 1-7, Enterprise, First Contact, Insurrection, etc doesn't fall into the realm of "good Trek".
I'm still getting used to the concept of Berman Trekkers who sound like hardliners in the TOS Forum. After two-and-a-half years, it still weirds me out.
I mean, I'm sure someone will make that argument that these don't fall under "good Trek."
Personally, Trek is Trek, good, bad and indifferent. Abrams, in my opinion, is good Trek, but it is vastly different from Berman era Trek. As the old saying goes, different does not mean bad.
It sounds to me like you’re wrapped up in what Roddenberry said Trek is, not what is actually on screen.
I'm horrible. Even though I like Discovery and Picard, half of my favorite episodes are actually from 1991 or earlier. 
Give it another five years or so.I'm horrible. Even though I like Discovery and Picard, half of my favorite episodes are actually from 1991 or earlier.
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