Karl. Keith is a singer.
McCoy Haters
- Thread starter gomtuu20
- Start date
A
Amaris
Guest
No, he's definitely channeling Kelley. While he follows the gruff, irascible personality style of De's McCoy, his iteration of the character is tinged with his own unique talent. In short, he's easily recognizable as McCoy, but he's an updated version, one that works quite well. Imitation doesn't even fit in the mix.
I'm occasionally irritated, but mostly amused, by the immediate reaction that many posters here have if they percieve of anyone not espousing total devotion to NuTrek.
NO, this post is not an intended to be a back door way to bash NuTrek. While I didn't like XI, I rather enjoyed "Into Darkness" (except for the resurrection via Khan's blood idiocy).
It's about trying to understand why there are a growing number of McCoy haters. I can't imagine why someone who really is a fan of TOS, and is familiar with all the episodes, could not like McCoy. I grant that since people have individual likes and dislikes, there will be some that don't like certain characters like McCoy, but they will be few and far in between. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about a growing number of McCoy haters. You will see this the next time there is a thread about least favorite characters.
The observations stated throughout this thread about how McCoy's role is being replaced by NuUhura (Nuhura?) in many regards are valid. It changes the dynamic of the entire series.
The McCoy haters have been expressed their views over multiple threads over the last year or so. They ARE out there. It's taken me a while to figure out where it is coming from. I think that many of the Nu fans are not really even that familiar with the original 79 of the TOS. I don't think they really get it. The stereotype of McCoy always being angry is an inaccurate stereotype. I think the stereotype is being perpetuated by NuTrek.
NO, this post is not an intended to be a back door way to bash NuTrek. While I didn't like XI, I rather enjoyed "Into Darkness" (except for the resurrection via Khan's blood idiocy).
It's about trying to understand why there are a growing number of McCoy haters. I can't imagine why someone who really is a fan of TOS, and is familiar with all the episodes, could not like McCoy. I grant that since people have individual likes and dislikes, there will be some that don't like certain characters like McCoy, but they will be few and far in between. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about a growing number of McCoy haters. You will see this the next time there is a thread about least favorite characters.
The observations stated throughout this thread about how McCoy's role is being replaced by NuUhura (Nuhura?) in many regards are valid. It changes the dynamic of the entire series.
The McCoy haters have been expressed their views over multiple threads over the last year or so. They ARE out there. It's taken me a while to figure out where it is coming from. I think that many of the Nu fans are not really even that familiar with the original 79 of the TOS. I don't think they really get it. The stereotype of McCoy always being angry is an inaccurate stereotype. I think the stereotype is being perpetuated by NuTrek.
I totally disagree!
I have to admit that I can't stand McCoy on TOS. He was fine in the movies, but the characterization on the show was frequently annoying and totally unbelievable.
Seriously, McCoy was openly racist/specist when it came to Spock and I find that totally unacceptable. His constant jabbing at Spock was frequently uncalled for. A good example was in The Galileo 7 (which has some bad characterization all around). But there was some line about there not being a problem with Spock's head as with his heart. It was just unnecessary.
What really bugged me about McCoy's characterization was that he was often shown to lack ANY ability to control his emotions. On some level I would not have a problem with McCoy's clear lack of emotional control if the show ever bothered to show that it was character failing (in the same way that they tried to make Spock's limited emotions an issue). But they never did. McCoy was completely unbearable in The Tholian Web. His accusations made no sense and just made him look petty.
More often than not even at his most stoic, Spock always came off to me as perfectly reasonable. Conversely, McCoy was usually over the top. I know which one I would prefer to have around and which one could be counted on to make sound decisions.
I completely agree with this statement! He had no self-control, no filter and came off as emotionally unstable. Personally, I just attributed it to alcoholism. But it wasn't entertaining. What was it ... Paradise Syndrome ... another episode where he freaks out at Spock, for crippling the ship, or some junk, whilst trying to shatter an asteroid. What the balls "Bones," shut the hell up, old timer ... don't blow a gasket! Getting all loud and shit ...
He was a typical Doctor for 60s TV. Emotional, curmudgeonly, and irascible, but more often than not the moral voice of the show. Also, frequently familiar with the bad boys. Take 'Mister Roberts'. the Doctor in that film isn't really all that different from McCoy.
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4QNBypC9vs[/yt]
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4QNBypC9vs[/yt]
I, uh ... I see! Well, then ... I guess TOS wasn't as progressive as it's given so much credit for. More's the pity ...
I've been watching through TOS, some of it being my first time seeing the episode, and I really don't see McCoy's arguments with Spock as 'speciesist'.
Maybe people in the 23rd century have evolved beyond the need for political correctness, and have now all accepted each other as such equals that there's no need to censor our language to stop from hurting people's feelings or scratching old cultural wounds. I usually do end up taking Spock's side over McCoy because I myself am a very rational person. But Spock's belligerent dismissal of emotion has caused him, as in The Gallileo Seven, to make illogical decisions.
Some of Spock's finest moments have been bursting through his logical wall with a display of emotion, and this might be the one thing about Star Trek that NuTrek gets exactly right. McCoy in no way hates Spock, and sometimes his apparently 'speciesist' comments come as a reaction to Spock callously disregarding his own values with an air of superiority. And Spock even plays jokingly into this, with comments like "Their barbarity was a wonderful display of humanity" at the end of Mirror Mirror. And McCoy gradually catches on that Spock is more emotional than other Vulcans and sometimes uses logic to lie to himself, and a lot of his comments are designed not to disparage him but to rib him for that hypocrisy.
Maybe people in the 23rd century have evolved beyond the need for political correctness, and have now all accepted each other as such equals that there's no need to censor our language to stop from hurting people's feelings or scratching old cultural wounds. I usually do end up taking Spock's side over McCoy because I myself am a very rational person. But Spock's belligerent dismissal of emotion has caused him, as in The Gallileo Seven, to make illogical decisions.
Some of Spock's finest moments have been bursting through his logical wall with a display of emotion, and this might be the one thing about Star Trek that NuTrek gets exactly right. McCoy in no way hates Spock, and sometimes his apparently 'speciesist' comments come as a reaction to Spock callously disregarding his own values with an air of superiority. And Spock even plays jokingly into this, with comments like "Their barbarity was a wonderful display of humanity" at the end of Mirror Mirror. And McCoy gradually catches on that Spock is more emotional than other Vulcans and sometimes uses logic to lie to himself, and a lot of his comments are designed not to disparage him but to rib him for that hypocrisy.
I guess I can understand someone not liking McCoy because he's too--gruff, I guess would be the word--for them. Or maybe because they just don't like DeForest Kelley's (or maybe all "old" 1960's-style) acting. But it takes a very shallow understanding of the character (and the character of Spock, as well) to accuse him of some alleged racial hatred toward Spock. He was, clearly, one of Spock's two closest friends.
Last edited:
There was also Ben Casey, a TV-Physician of the 1960s. Intense, temperamental, nonconforming . . . but he got results.
A
Amaris
Guest
McCoy was a man who wore his passions on his sleeve, and anything that got in the way of saving lives caused him to become frustrated and angry. He was devoted to life, and would do whatever was necessary to preserve it.
Nnnope.
and Marcus Welby, here's a gentle moment...
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJBg6EYrXGs[/yt]
McCoy and Spock had a love for each other that allowed them to bicker like an old married couple, without the fear of actually hurting each other. I Amok Time, Spock requested McCoy attend the ceremony as one of his two closest friends. McCoy responds that he would be honored.
You will notice in some of the previous posts, that those who don't like McCoy in TOS are really not all that familiar with it. They haven't even seen all the episodes.
Emotion and logic are frequently at odds with each other. That doesn't mean they hate each other.
You will notice in some of the previous posts, that those who don't like McCoy in TOS are really not all that familiar with it. They haven't even seen all the episodes.
Emotion and logic are frequently at odds with each other. That doesn't mean they hate each other.
If you find McCoy racist because all he used to say to Spock, I don't imagine what do you think about the Skipper who oftenly smacked Giligan with his hat.
I'm half-Greek and I heard a lot of shit about that by some of my friends and I can do similar things. That doesn't mean we're racist.
So, McCoy oftenly teased Spock about his Vulcanity, on both cultural and biological side...but sincerely racist? Come on, if Kirk was shocked by Bones said about Klingons in Day of the Dove, it's because he's absolutely not this kind of person.
I'm half-Greek and I heard a lot of shit about that by some of my friends and I can do similar things. That doesn't mean we're racist.
So, McCoy oftenly teased Spock about his Vulcanity, on both cultural and biological side...but sincerely racist? Come on, if Kirk was shocked by Bones said about Klingons in Day of the Dove, it's because he's absolutely not this kind of person.
Yeah, he was indeed like that because he was there as contrast for Spock.
That's a really good point. The Kirk of the films is so different from TOS Kirk that McCoy's been sort of elbowed off-screen.
I do think Karl Urban (and he's probably the only one of the actors to go this route) is doing a DeForrest Kelley impression... but he does it pretty well and I enjoy it. He's one of the few bright stops of the JJ films for me, despite his being underutilized.
A
Amaris
Guest
I'm hoping for a lot more McCoy in the third film. I love Karl Urban as an actor, and I think he positively shines as McCoy. I think they all do an excellent job, considering the shoes they have to fill!
Similar threads
- Poll
