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McCoy a racist?

There is no good reason an entire species has to be mercenaries or merchants or war-mongers. I'm not sure what it's due to, but I can't help suspecting prejudice
The real reason was to simplify the storytelling for Sixties episodic television. Let the audience know what we're up against, what the deal is with an adversary, or the Vulcans for that matter, and they can have an easy grasp of what we're trying to say.

Star Trek was probably worried that the distant-future setting, the starship and whatnot, were a lot to ask of a TV audience. Adding layers of psychological nuance to alien races would turn people off, who just wanted to relax in front of the tube. Simple mono-cultures were easier for the writers to manage, too.

It would be decades before series television was expected to be layered and nuanced, and those shows are all serial rather then episodic.
 
Second one?
The Next Generation. A lot of social evolution took place in those 20 years.
It would be decades before series television was expected to be layered and nuanced, and those shows are all serial rather then episodic.
Those are the decades I was referring to, when I expected change.
But even in the 70's, audiences were able to cope with serious issues, suspension of disbelief, time travel - all kinds of complexity. We could manage Twilight Zone, All in the Family, Good Times... by 1980, we could fathom Cosmos and Sagan's ship of the imagination. We were not that simple-minded!

Easier for the writers, sure. But why shouldn't writers be expect to work?
 
Easier for the writers, sure. But why shouldn't writers be expect to work?
My theory: In the 1960s and 70s, TV writers didn't make a lot of money per script. So in order to make a decent living, they had to sell a lot of scripts per year. That limited the amount of time writers could spend crafting the artistry of any single script. They had to keep turning out grist for the mill. That's why.

The years around Charlie's Angels and The Love Boat may have been the apotheosis of this phenomenon. Tons of well-liked shows were written simply and carried by charismatic actors.

Another thing was, syndication back then (shipping 16mm film reels around the country) would require that episodes could be shown in any order. So goodbye long story arcs and character growth. The writers couldn't tee up long-range story payoffs even if they'd had the time to think about it.
 
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No , personally I don't think Mc Coy is a racist. But some comments he made about Spock, about his skin colour, his ears and so on could be called racist.
What do you think about it?

McCoy is no racist in any sense as i've experienced it. However, the arguably racist character some ST fans love because they believe he's an "other" representing their idea of the beleaguered "minority" is Spock; throughout TOS, Spock relentlessly insulted the human race in a manner most would see as blatantly racist. His anything other than rare condemnation of humans was delivered in a way that read as utter distaste for a race, etc., but thanks to Spock being the "outsider" amongst humans, some observers developed politically selective glasses through which the character and series is analyzed. His near-endless criticisms of human beings were on more than a philosophical level, and that was not always in the form of ribbing Dr. McCoy.
 
Was watching an YouTube video yesterday by TrekCulture on Star Trek III. Basically called Dr McCoy a racist for how he interacted with the alien character at the bar in one scene.

I personally don’t think he’s racist. Doesn’t come across to me anyway.
 
No , personally I don't think Mc Coy is a racist. But some comments he made about Spock, about his skin colour, his ears and so on could be called racist.
What do you think about it?
Well according to Dax he DID go to Ole Miss....so..........................
 
Kinda highlights how silly it was to have Spock as the only onscreen alien crew member…(not counting TAS).
 
Honestly, there is nothing more upsetting than being called a racist (or any kind of bigot) when you're not, just because someone misinterprets (or chooses to misinterpret) something you said. Happened to me twice this week on FB. Sometimes you get that person who will accept no amount of explaining that you didn't mean it that way and just keeps calling you names. The last one closed with "Be better! We see you!" :borg: I mean, geez.
 
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My theory: In the 1960s and 70s, TV writers didn't make a lot of money per script.

IDK much about that far back, but in the mid 1990s, the Voyager team were advertising $1,000 for a either a freelance script or a story long enough to convert into one (it's been a while, I don't recall which), so that basically tracks.
 
No, he's no racist. Spock also makes disparaging comments about humans ALL the time. And pretty much everyone on that bridge has made fun of Spock's "vulcaness" at one time or another. So I don't know why people always let Kirk off the hook, for example. Also McCoy truly cares for Spock. There are others who may be really racist towards him, but not McCoy.

Yup. Spock gave as good as he got. He put down full blooded humans constantly. Most was just good natured ribbing . In the 23rd century pepple don't fear words and get offended by every little thing
 
You can forgive The Tholian Web as he was under the influence of that area of space. But he should have been written more like he was in The Gamesters of Triskelion in The Galileo Seven. Offering criticism, but not condemnation.
McCoy did have a line, though, and Boma crossed it when he made the comment to Spock about he'd insist on a burial even if it was Spock. While McCoy could have been a bit better, Boma was most certainly the worst of the shuttle crew with Spock.


The Vulcans of Archer’s time do seem very patronizing.
Vulcans in the 22nd, 23rd, AND 24th centuries have come across as patronizing.

For example, Captain Solok from DS9's "TAKE ME OUT TO THE HOLISUITE" was definitely patronizing. "I've come to expect inefficiency with stations run by humans." His first scene already makes it clear how he feels about humans. With the other stuff we learn about him, a case can easily be made of Solok being racist.



Regarding the subject... no, McCoy was not racist. If he were, we would NEVER have seen him defend Spock at every occasion. Or save his life multiple times. Or knock him unconscious so he could sacrifice himself to save Spock.

This whole idea of trying to judge a show or movie from over half a century ago with current standards is not only unfair but does a disservice to the show/movie.
 
McCoy did have a line, though, and Boma crossed it when he made the comment to Spock about he'd insist on a burial even if it was Spock. While McCoy could have been a bit better, Boma was most certainly the worst of the shuttle crew with Spock.



Vulcans in the 22nd, 23rd, AND 24th centuries have come across as patronizing.

For example, Captain Solok from DS9's "TAKE ME OUT TO THE HOLISUITE" was definitely patronizing. "I've come to expect inefficiency with stations run by humans." His first scene already makes it clear how he feels about humans. With the other stuff we learn about him, a case can easily be made of Solok being racist.



Regarding the subject... no, McCoy was not racist. If he were, we would NEVER have seen him defend Spock at every occasion. Or save his life multiple times. Or knock him unconscious so he could sacrifice himself to save Spock.

This whole idea of trying to judge a show or movie from over half a century ago with current standards is not only unfair but does a disservice to the show/movie.

Oof, the TNG and DS9 portrayals of Vulcans. Awful stuff. Massive credit to Tim and Jolene for washing that all welcomely away.
 
The "planet of hats" monoculture trope was a carry-over from previous space opera and even literary sci-fi. And the trope is still very commonplace in lots of SF&F. Unless they're doing it in a way that mocks real-world human cultures, I really don't see any issue with it.

As for McCoy, no, he is not a racist.

Kor
 
McCoy did have a line, though, and Boma crossed it when he made the comment to Spock about he'd insist on a burial even if it was Spock. While McCoy could have been a bit better, Boma was most certainly the worst of the shuttle crew with Spock.

I need to rewatch the Galileo Seven episode...

As for McCoy, I always took it as "silly" banter between two officers that respected each other and knew they were using moments of informality, and both of them would otherwise have engaged in examples of racism, either personally or across the entire species (One would say "Vulcans ___", the other "Humans ___"). But McCoy knew enough of Spock's mannerisms. So had Kirk. As had Spock innately knowing theirs. There are episodes that definitely show the big three being disgusted by actual racism, so there's clearly a contextual difference for what is a very multifaceted situation between two complex characters, three when Kirk is added. I also refuse to use the term "bromance" except I think I just had. But "silly" in terms of 23rd century people.

The fact Spock tells often of how he controls or even "buries" his emotions comes into play; Vulcans are not dissimilar to humans in that regard, once these outer layers are put to the side. Being biologically compatible in terms of reproduction also lends a hand in all this. And other body parts, but those aren't important right now. (Besides, fans in the 1970s had a field day fathoming what things might look like... Even drawing the bits too and, you guessed it, there's a prominent drawing from 1979, and I vaguely recall a spined version from a few years earlier, but the fandom stretches far and wide in terms of artistic creativity, and/or lack thereof, regarding this sort of thing. But I digress.)

Vulcans in the 22nd, 23rd, AND 24th centuries have come across as patronizing.

True! Not always or necessarily by design.

For example, Captain Solok from DS9's "TAKE ME OUT TO THE HOLISUITE" was definitely patronizing. "I've come to expect inefficiency with stations run by humans." His first scene already makes it clear how he feels about humans. With the other stuff we learn about him, a case can easily be made of Solok being racist.

The Holosuite episode definitely rides on a viewer being able to accept Vulcans as being more than pure logic. In theory, with Spock and his complexities at the fore, one would think it'd be easy. Even easier the moment one recalls Sybok...

...Except it wasn't easy at all and the result of this late-entry DS9 episode is a self-indulgent mess that wants to be "light entertainment" but feels more like a foul ball. That Holosuite episode clearly shows either a script telling the actor to be hubris-driven haughty, or the actor chose that, or the director was playing Fizzbin that day. It all felt out so of place.

As much as VOY and ENT could be middling and variable in quality, Tim Russ and Jolene Blalock definitely improve the matters no end and almost consistently compensated for other elements that (IMHO) weren't working. (Suzie Plakson as a runner-up, though she was on screen as Dr Selar for a couple of minutes only.) Indeed, VOY exploring Vulcan lore is a definite high-point for the show, with care and thought put into it, just as much as season 4 was with exploring Seven's humanity.


Regarding the subject... no, McCoy was not racist. If he were, we would NEVER have seen him defend Spock at every occasion. Or save his life multiple times. Or knock him unconscious so he could sacrifice himself to save Spock.

^^this, x2000.

This whole idea of trying to judge a show or movie from over half a century ago with current standards is not only unfair but does a disservice to the show/movie.

That too. So much was different five decades ago that it is impossible for direct correlation. Indeed, "Balance of Terror" - which was somewhat progressive for its time - shows a couple marrying on ship, with the only expectation subversion being the one who predictably dies, so in this episode it's a pico fermi thing. Now if they'd shown Angela dying and how Robert would have reacted might have been more interesting, but only because that would not have been shown on tv before and, TBH, Kirk's addressing down Stiles was a far more important use of screen time.

But the most anyone can do is to actually live in the time period in which the episode was made, or read up enough and try to emulate the experience to really understand. I wasn't there at the time, but trying to remember what the sixties were like after reading and talking definitely helps put TOS into a more interesting light, especially for concepts that haven't held up against the passage of time.
 
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