Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by bbjeg, Apr 6, 2014.

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What grade would you give the Marvel Cinematic Universe? (Ever-Changing Question)

  1. A+

    18.1%
  2. A

    26.9%
  3. A-

    14.6%
  4. B+

    7.6%
  5. B

    14.0%
  6. B-

    2.9%
  7. C+

    3.5%
  8. C

    4.7%
  9. C-

    2.9%
  10. D+

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  11. D

    0.6%
  12. D-

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. F

    4.1%
  1. MikHutch

    MikHutch Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Tbh I don't mind some of them in theory. Just not the villain solos
     
  2. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Amazing Spider-Man #129.

    First appearance of the Punisher.

    Sic balls Sony!
     
  3. Nerroth

    Nerroth Commodore Commodore

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    Over on Amazon Prime, yes.

    Although, if Marvel Studios wanted to add that version of the character to a would-be (new) Agents of ATLAS project, I don't know if the current deal between Disney and Sony already covers this, or if they would need to sign a new deal instead.

    Technically, there was a Cindy Moon in Spider-Man: Homecoming, but it's not yet clear if that Cindy and the one to be featured in Silk: Spider-Society are from the same universe. (In the comics, not all versions of Cindy Moon necessarily become their respective timeline's Silk...)
     
  4. MikHutch

    MikHutch Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I'd be down for an AoA project with Silk
     
  5. Grendelsbayne

    Grendelsbayne Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Except Gwen Stacey, Jessica Drew, Mayday Parker, Ben Reilly, Felicia Hardy, Silver Sable...

    You know, all the really obscure ones.
     
  6. Starkers

    Starkers Admiral Admiral

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    Which is kinda what Bruce should be like, similarly he's the only Bruce Wayne who explicitly has a few screws loose, and let's be honest a man who dresses as a bat to fight crime isn't the most psychologically grounded of individuals.

    Is he my favourite Batman? Possibly, I'm never quite sure, but he is my favourite Bruce Wayne.

    But then I am the kind of weirdo who has at times cited Connery as his least favourite Bond :p
     
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  7. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk A Spock and a smile Premium Member

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    "Bruce Wayne" is a construct. A feint to distract people from making any connection to Batman. He's the wastrel playboy. The boozy womanizer. The bored disinterested billionaire. Occasionally the straight arrow civic minded citizen. The real Bruce Wayne is the brilliant detective and strategist with or without the cowl, IMO, of course.
     
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  8. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    No, it's highly revisionist. Keaton's Bruce is the only one who's incapable of putting on the act, the public persona of the debonair billionaire playboy that's just as important and useful a disguise as the Bat-cowl is.


    That's a trite, hackneyed argument, and an invalid one, because it's applying real-world logic to a fantasy universe. Bruce Wayne lives in a world where dressing up in a themed costume to fight crime is as normal as wearing a tall white hat to be a chef, or wearing a bright jersey with numbers on it to play sports. For that matter, there's real-life precedent in other cultures for wearing animal masks for symbolic or ritual purposes. Japanese samurai often wore frightening animal- or demon-themed masks on the front of their helmets. So to say "It's insane to wear animal-themed armor" is grossly ethnocentric.

    Besides, one thing the Nolan films did very well was explaining that the bat costume is not reflective of Bruce's psychology, but that of his targets. It's a calculated choice to use a symbol to strike fear in the superstitious, cowardly lot he battles, and to use the pageantry of the Batman to distract observers from seeing the man underneath.

    I also loathe the cynicism of the idea that only a mentally ill person would fight crime. Bruce Wayne has selflessly dedicated his life and resources to the exclusive task of serving other people. That's basically the same thing people do when they give up worldly goods to become priests or nuns or monks. I hate it when people look at such a profound gesture of compassion and self-abnegation and see it only as something unhealthy and deranged, something to mock and discredit. It's a rejection of the very thing that makes superhero stories meaningful.

    And that's part of why Burton's Batman never worked for me -- because he's the director who most fully embraced the idea that Batman was a symptom of Bruce's dysfunction, rather than a calculated tool of a hyperfunctional genius. Also because he was the first filmmaker to portray Batman that way, and it's had too much of an influence on the public's perception of the character since then.
     
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  9. MikHutch

    MikHutch Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    The cynicism is the idea of a lone White dude thinking he can solve street crime by punching bank robbers
     
  10. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Wayne--as covered in his very first published appearance--used the image of a bat for its effect on criminals, not as a reflection or projection of his own personality. If Keaton's Wayne/Batman appeared to have a few screws loose, it is due to Tim Burton using that same type of character template in too many of his films. He did not understand a single thing about what motivates Wayne to fight crime; he was too busy turning a psychologically and physically strong man into a "technogeek" (Burton's words from a 1989 NBC interview), and not a "Square-jawed hero" (again, Burton's words from the same NBC interview). Burton's own hang-ups and insecurities had no place in a Batman film, but he was allowed to mold the character to fit his issues, hence casting a short, balding, nonathletic comedic actor as one of the most imposing of all comic book superheroes.
     
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  11. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk A Spock and a smile Premium Member

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    Cynical? Unrealistic, sure but hardly cynical. Not sure that's even Batman's goal. Not sure what race has to do with it either.
    Does Batman even fight street crime anymore? (Now that's cynical :lol: )
     
  12. MikHutch

    MikHutch Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    The idea that any vigilantism stops crime seems pretty White to me considering the history of vigilantism in the USA
     
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  13. Gaith

    Gaith Vice Admiral Admiral

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    In 1940, when the first Batman comics were being published, the actual Gotham/New York City was about 94% percent white, with Manhattan at about 84%, so it wouldn't exactly be surprising for a character created in that period to reflect a white perspective.
     
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  14. MikHutch

    MikHutch Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Yea because American culture at the time actively suppressed any non-White cultures
     
  15. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Except, it's a part of human history, dating back to even Roman times, like in Pompeii:
     
  16. wayoung

    wayoung Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The Mafia spawned from vigilantes.

    You either die a hero or live long enough to become the villian
     
  17. Commander Troi

    Commander Troi Geek Grrl Premium Member

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    Batmanius!
     
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  18. MikHutch

    MikHutch Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I probably wasn't entirely accurate but thr whole "cops aren't brutal enough on criminals" attitude isn't exactly foreign to White America
     
  19. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Nor is it resticted to America either. So this idea is something that runs through humanity way back. Let's not restrict it to one race or country.
     
  20. The Nth Doctor

    The Nth Doctor Infinite Possibilities... Premium Member

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    During an interview with ScreenRant, Jon Hamm said that he wants to play either Mr. Sinister or Doctor Doom:

    I don't know. Those decisions get made at such a high level at this point, definitely above my pay grade. I would love to. I've been a fan of Marvel Comics and comics in general since I was probably single digits. I think there are tons of stories that I'm familiar with, at least, that are still out there to be told.

    Hopefully, whatever their plans are, they include me. But if not, I know that they have a pretty deep bench of folks that are ready to be a part of those stories. There are certainly a lot of stories in the X-Men world to be told. Fantastic Four as well, [like] Doctor Doom. There are so many great things out there. But yeah, I hope I get a chance. Who knows?​