Mars Had Rings At One Time

Discussion in 'Science and Technology' started by Dryson, Jun 6, 2020.

  1. Dryson

    Dryson Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Now it seems that, all along, that small anomaly – the 2-degree tilt of Deimos’ orbit with respect to Mars’ equator – held a clue to something very interesting about the red planet’s past … that Mars used to have rings!

    The researchers published the new peer-reviewed paper in Astrophysical Journal Letters on June 1, 2020. The research was also presented at the 236th Meeting of the American Astronomical Society (AAS 236), held virtually this week (June 1-3, 2020) due to COVID-19.

    https://earthsky.org/space/did-ancient-mars-have-rings-deimos

    With Mars having rings at one time I think a new discussion regarding how the Moon was formed needs explored via Lunar landings and colonization. We have to determine whether fragments of Mars exist deep inside of the surface of the Moon.

    Another new discussion would involve the extinction of the dinosaurs. Could a rogue asteroid from the rings around Mars impacted Earth after Mars lost the ability to maintain the rings themselves?
     
  2. Asbo Zaprudder

    Asbo Zaprudder Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Escape velocity is the square root of 2 (1.414159...) times orbital velocity so I don't see where the additional momentum would come from in a ring system to eject the large body, thought to have been 10 to 15km across - about the size of Phobos and Deimos, which supposedly caused the K–Pg extinction event. Smaller rocks aren't a problem to envisage making the trip. We find Martian meteorites on Earth so some are certain to have landed on the Moon as well.
     
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  3. 'Q'

    'Q' Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I think we can scrap digging our moon up and work on determining these questions 1) Why did Mars initially have rings? 2) What was the original source of the ring material i.e planetary collision, captured asteroid belt member, primordial solar nebula or comet 3) What influence did these rings have on the climate of early Mars (probably not much) etc etc
     
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  4. Asbo Zaprudder

    Asbo Zaprudder Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Phobos is at 1.72 and 0.89 of the Roche limit for Mars for solid and liquid bodies so pretty susceptible to being disrupted. It might be a captured C or D-type asteroid or material ejected into orbit by a Mars impact. Deimos, which is a very similar body, is in a higher orbit so at less risk of disruption (4.51 and 2.34 of the Roche limit for solid and liquid bodies). The solar system's gas and ice giants all have rings, of course, although Saturn's is the most impressive by far. Planetary rings are possibly not that uncommon.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2020
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  5. tavor

    tavor Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    rookie question could we turn it around
    what i mean is , heard at one stage a planetary body crashed into proto-earth forming the moon, could some of this debris travel to mars making the rings or dislodging the rings already there?
     
  6. 'Q'

    'Q' Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Maybe, but as lunar formation was considered a 'soft' collision, a major proportion of the debris would remain within Earth' orbit and eventually swept up.

    maybe, but that's a lot of material just moving at just Mars, so that's a low probability. Also any rings present would not be destroyed. Rings are not solid discs, so the loss of some ring matter does not destroy it, just thins it down.

    However, the moon formation would have created a massive ring around Earth before its accumulated to form Luna.
     
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  7. Asbo Zaprudder

    Asbo Zaprudder Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yes, I expect Monte Carlo analysis, if this were performed, would suggest it's an unlikely scenario. Direct sampling of Phobos, Deimos, and Mars and return of this material for analysis would reveal much information but that's probably decades in the future.
     
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  8. publiusr

    publiusr Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Phobos might be the first asteroid to mine.
    Maybe not too big to bag...easily pulled apart...no danger to Earth...use bigger bits to blast craters for public works, etc.

    Or maybe it’s low density means it is hollow, and..
     
  9. Haggis and tatties

    Haggis and tatties Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Mars still has rings but we are on a parallel plane to said rings and because we are flat we can't see them. :p
     
  10. Trinity Gingerbread

    Trinity Gingerbread Time is the thief of life Premium Member

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    Now imagine the fun if Earth had rings
     
  11. Ar-Pharazon

    Ar-Pharazon Admiral Premium Member

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    If they keep letting Musk put hundreds of satellites up there, we may yet. A ring of garbage.
     
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  12. Asbo Zaprudder

    Asbo Zaprudder Vice Admiral Admiral

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    ...especially if the Kessler syndrome takes hold.
     
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  13. publiusr

    publiusr Vice Admiral Admiral

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    One Web now back from the dead, looks to add to the mess.

    Nice new book out called
    The Sirens of Mars
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2020