And how long have you worked at LucasFilm?
News Marcia Lucas calls out Kennedy and Abrams, pans the Sequels
- Thread starter Mach5
- Start date
You don’t have to work there to know the structure.
Yeah, you people have all studied the industry and Lucasfilm's internal workings and culture so intimately, you all have PhD's.
I was on the set of Solo before and after Phil and Chris got fired.......but please, continue.Yeah, you people have all studied the industry and Lucasfilm's internal workings and culture so intimately, you all have PhD's.
Alright, I'm curious about your relationship with Kennedy.
It's also based on comments from writers, directors and other people who worked there.Yeah, you people have all studied the industry and Lucasfilm's internal workings and culture so intimately, you all have PhD's.
One that is perhaps exaggerated but is based in truth. @Indysolo and I attended the Galactic Innovations: From Star Wars to Rogue One program in 2019, which was presented by bunches of people who worked on the film, including Ben Burtt and Marcia Lucas, and they even showed a bit of the workprint including the WWII fighter footage that Marcia used as placeholders and to guide ILM in the shot composition and with how fast the cuts should be. The whole ending of the movie is largely her editing work, so let's not diminish her contributions...because the people who worked on it with her sure don't. In addition to her Star Wars Oscar she was nominated for one for American Graffiti and nominated for a BAFTA on Taxi Driver.
You may not agree with or value her opinion but to deny or diminish her contributions is foolish.
One could say the same thing about any opinion voiced anywhere.
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I think it’s interesting that each side considers themselves the definitive word on this. Personally, I could care less if my viewpoint is valid or invalid. Regardless of my opinion, there are certain FACTS that are deficits as to why the Sequel trilogy was not good at all. Lack of planning, plots holes you could drive a truck through. The fact that the main principles were so important to the sequels, and then in essence thrown in the back seat. Did Harrison Ford deserve $75 million? No, not by a long shot. Were Ford, Hamill, and Fisher misled to come back to do the films? Absolutely. I think each actor was just as important to the story as the OT. I believe there should have been an equal balance as far as pay, story contribution, and plot contribution for each actor. It was as if ageism played a part in it too. 60 something, and 70 something actors COULDN’T be a main draw to a film in Hollywood at all.
Worse, secondary characters were given such importance to the story and plot and discarded even faster than you could blink. Lucas at least treated Veteran actors with equal amounts of care and respect and the new principles. That didn’t happen this time at all. Disney can gloat and maintain a chokehold on Star Wars as much as it desires. But, the reality is that George Lucas owns Star Wars in the minds of fandom and the public, the same way as Gene Roddenberry was, is, and always will be the creator or Star Trek, regardless of CBS/Paramount owning it.
These corporations are the bankrollers of these movie media franchises, and that is it despite their own insecurities over control contribution and ownership.
As far as Marcia Lucas is concerned her opinion SHOULD BE respected and valued regardless of what ANYONE thinks. Obviously. Ms. Lucas has validity in the media world, as well as a legal right and ground to stand on, and is protected by legal statues. OTHERWISE, she would be held responsible for legal LIBEL and her comments made legally LIBELOUS by both George Lucas and Disney for the introduction she wrote in the book and her recent interviews offering her views on the PT and ST trilogies both.
I have NO doubt in my mind Marcia Lucas STILL had/has a powerful influence on George Lucas’s original stories for the prequel trilogy, and the sequel trilogy as well.
I believe certain alterations were made by George in the stories and plans to keep Marcia out of story right claims, copyright and outright ownership and credit. The same goes for Lucas or Disney both agreeing to NOT release the original THEATRICAL versions of the Original Trilogy Films on any media currently whatsoever. George Lucas surrendered and sacrificed a lot in the divorce of Marcia Lucas, so that she COULD NOT gain anything more financially from the Star Wars films, despite her thoughts, influence or contributions that she could and did make.
Sorry for the long post.
-Koric
Worse, secondary characters were given such importance to the story and plot and discarded even faster than you could blink. Lucas at least treated Veteran actors with equal amounts of care and respect and the new principles. That didn’t happen this time at all. Disney can gloat and maintain a chokehold on Star Wars as much as it desires. But, the reality is that George Lucas owns Star Wars in the minds of fandom and the public, the same way as Gene Roddenberry was, is, and always will be the creator or Star Trek, regardless of CBS/Paramount owning it.
These corporations are the bankrollers of these movie media franchises, and that is it despite their own insecurities over control contribution and ownership.
As far as Marcia Lucas is concerned her opinion SHOULD BE respected and valued regardless of what ANYONE thinks. Obviously. Ms. Lucas has validity in the media world, as well as a legal right and ground to stand on, and is protected by legal statues. OTHERWISE, she would be held responsible for legal LIBEL and her comments made legally LIBELOUS by both George Lucas and Disney for the introduction she wrote in the book and her recent interviews offering her views on the PT and ST trilogies both.
I have NO doubt in my mind Marcia Lucas STILL had/has a powerful influence on George Lucas’s original stories for the prequel trilogy, and the sequel trilogy as well.
I believe certain alterations were made by George in the stories and plans to keep Marcia out of story right claims, copyright and outright ownership and credit. The same goes for Lucas or Disney both agreeing to NOT release the original THEATRICAL versions of the Original Trilogy Films on any media currently whatsoever. George Lucas surrendered and sacrificed a lot in the divorce of Marcia Lucas, so that she COULD NOT gain anything more financially from the Star Wars films, despite her thoughts, influence or contributions that she could and did make.
Sorry for the long post.
-Koric
Given that your entire post is a stream of supposition and assumption (not to mention some pretty heavy insinuative allegations based on no real evidence whatsoever), I'm not entirely sure you're caught-up on the definition of "facts".
@TOS OnlyFans
What is considered insinuating?
These are FACTS
George Lucas lost $50 million have of his company’s worth in 1983 due to an affair and divorce.
Lucasfilm announcement to not release the original in a state higher that the lost resolution dvd version from the 1993 laserdiscs.
Fact: Disney is an archival company most if not all of it’s releases are theatrical releases. So why is Star Wars an exception?
Fact: Under certain state’s laws a spouse can legally try and claim rights to works created in marriage. Marcia Lucas was an credited editor on the original trilogy films.
Fact: There is proven AGEISM in Hollywood.
Fact: Harrison Ford was paid a salary, plus points and dividends on TFA which amounted to $75 million.
Fact: Fisher and Hamill WERE not paid the same at all.
Fact: Lucas and Roddenberry ARE both credited time and time again as CREATORS of their respective franchises in spite of the fact that Disney and CBS/Paramount ownership of those franchises.
Fact: JJ Abrams has recently in media openly admitted that the ST was not properly planned and could have used a coherent cohesive
overall plan.
The supposition I made grounded in FACTS was George Lucas’s own admission that his divorce nearly destroyed his companies. So it is a fair assumption to make that George Lucas does not want to give his ex wife Marcia Lucas any more additional money that was earned or given back in 1983, and probably made it a continued contractual obligation with Disney not to release the original versions of the films regardless of the calls of the fans, and Disney’s own policies.
Lastly and most Factual J.W. Rinzler’s relationship with Lucas and Lucasfilm is well documented. I doubt Rinzler and his publisher would risk scandal and a lawsuit from both George Lucas personally and or Disney if Marcia Lucas statements were to be considered libelous, an injunction would be issued to have her foreward removed and copies of the book recalled and destroyed.
So again friend, please explain how I do not understand the definition or meaning of FACTS? Those are the facts, and I stand behind them. A few Google searches on your part would see EXACTLY what I am saying. In this day and age, words matter, and FACTS matter even more.
So thank you very much kindly.
-Koric
What is considered insinuating?
These are FACTS
George Lucas lost $50 million have of his company’s worth in 1983 due to an affair and divorce.
Lucasfilm announcement to not release the original in a state higher that the lost resolution dvd version from the 1993 laserdiscs.
Fact: Disney is an archival company most if not all of it’s releases are theatrical releases. So why is Star Wars an exception?
Fact: Under certain state’s laws a spouse can legally try and claim rights to works created in marriage. Marcia Lucas was an credited editor on the original trilogy films.
Fact: There is proven AGEISM in Hollywood.
Fact: Harrison Ford was paid a salary, plus points and dividends on TFA which amounted to $75 million.
Fact: Fisher and Hamill WERE not paid the same at all.
Fact: Lucas and Roddenberry ARE both credited time and time again as CREATORS of their respective franchises in spite of the fact that Disney and CBS/Paramount ownership of those franchises.
Fact: JJ Abrams has recently in media openly admitted that the ST was not properly planned and could have used a coherent cohesive
overall plan.
The supposition I made grounded in FACTS was George Lucas’s own admission that his divorce nearly destroyed his companies. So it is a fair assumption to make that George Lucas does not want to give his ex wife Marcia Lucas any more additional money that was earned or given back in 1983, and probably made it a continued contractual obligation with Disney not to release the original versions of the films regardless of the calls of the fans, and Disney’s own policies.
Lastly and most Factual J.W. Rinzler’s relationship with Lucas and Lucasfilm is well documented. I doubt Rinzler and his publisher would risk scandal and a lawsuit from both George Lucas personally and or Disney if Marcia Lucas statements were to be considered libelous, an injunction would be issued to have her foreward removed and copies of the book recalled and destroyed.
So again friend, please explain how I do not understand the definition or meaning of FACTS? Those are the facts, and I stand behind them. A few Google searches on your part would see EXACTLY what I am saying. In this day and age, words matter, and FACTS matter even more.
So thank you very much kindly.
-Koric
I'm one of those oddballs that likes TPM. Not fond of AOTC, and none of the prequels are perfect. Still they at least capture the essence of Star Wars, to me, and they look gorgeous. The Sequel Trilogy is just a lot of old star wars elements thrown into a craw and regurgitated for fans who will ingest anything with the brand stamped on it delivered by one of the least original producers this side of the industrial safety training film industry.
If the sequel trilogy consisted of 180 minutes of Jabba's force ghost suffering through painful galactic diarrhea on a clear duraplas commode, theaters would fill and half the fans would ardently argue on forums like this that it was mind blowing and that fair weather troglodyte fans just didn't get the director's vision. The problem with fandom is that you can never do enough good or enough wrong to de-fan the fans. They remain and the product just has inseminate itself into more and more bizarre inbred iterations. We're all part of the problem, but it's not that serious. It's ok.
For Marcia Lucas it's personal, and its hard to say just how much of Star Was is her baby too. I imagine it is hard to see something you create take a lot of turns you don't agree with. She is a very good editor, and some of the decisions made must have been gruelling to watch. The best thing might have been never to watch again, but how can you not?
If the sequel trilogy consisted of 180 minutes of Jabba's force ghost suffering through painful galactic diarrhea on a clear duraplas commode, theaters would fill and half the fans would ardently argue on forums like this that it was mind blowing and that fair weather troglodyte fans just didn't get the director's vision. The problem with fandom is that you can never do enough good or enough wrong to de-fan the fans. They remain and the product just has inseminate itself into more and more bizarre inbred iterations. We're all part of the problem, but it's not that serious. It's ok.
For Marcia Lucas it's personal, and its hard to say just how much of Star Was is her baby too. I imagine it is hard to see something you create take a lot of turns you don't agree with. She is a very good editor, and some of the decisions made must have been gruelling to watch. The best thing might have been never to watch again, but how can you not?
Wow, that's insulting to ST fans.
Well, Harrison Ford is a bigger name actor than either Mark Hamill or Carrie Fisher, and he had a larger role in TFA than them anyway, especially Hamill. Plus, Ford was also the first name listed in the credits, which essentially makes him the lead, so of course he'd be paid more.
And? Roddenberry created Star Trek while employed by a studio which was eventually bought out by Viacom/Paramount/CBS. He knew what that meant at the time, even if later in life he acted as though he were Star Trek's Lord and Master. Lucas meanwhile chose to sell Star Wars to Disney of his own accord and knew what that meant.
I think Marcia has a right to be respected, and I agree with a lot of what she said.
Although it's not perfect, TLJ was the only credible one of the sequels, which overall have coloured my 4+ decades of fandom to the point that I now sadly expect all Star Wars releases to be utter garbage until proven otherwise.
Mando is making progress in turning me around, but they've got a way to go to convince me it's not a one-off.
Although it's not perfect, TLJ was the only credible one of the sequels, which overall have coloured my 4+ decades of fandom to the point that I now sadly expect all Star Wars releases to be utter garbage until proven otherwise.
Mando is making progress in turning me around, but they've got a way to go to convince me it's not a one-off.
The Prequels and Clone Wars movie did that long, long, before the ST. It's hilarious to me to see the extremely short memories around the PT, as if Disney could be the only source of poor SW films.
The ST was less than ideal but it doesn't change my view on the franchise. A disappointing film does not a franchise ruin.
The ST was less than ideal but it doesn't change my view on the franchise. A disappointing film does not a franchise ruin.
Initially, I was fine with the sequel trilogy--and I generally still am, I don't actually hate it--but my opinion of it has continually worsened as time has gone by, I do now consider the sequels to be the weakest of the three trilogies and blame most of it on not having even a general consensus of where they were going from the get-go. Sure, Lucas was making up stuff as he went along too, but with a strong background in editing, at least he knew how to make it all fit cohesively. Any course corrections were hard to tell. Abrams and Johnson, however, had different takes on where the story and characters would go, and Abrams returning for Episode IX only made their different takes more apparent.
The initial plan to have each of the sequel trilogy films have "a different flavor" with different directors with different visions was a mistake, IMO. I think you do wind up with a final product that many think could have been much better, even by those who worked on the earlier trilogies.
The initial plan to have each of the sequel trilogy films have "a different flavor" with different directors with different visions was a mistake, IMO. I think you do wind up with a final product that many think could have been much better, even by those who worked on the earlier trilogies.
What they could have used was a overarching creative director, while letting the directors explore their inner Lucas.
I think many leaned to heavily in to the Lucas way of making stuff up.
I think many leaned to heavily in to the Lucas way of making stuff up.
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