There's not going to be a Director's Cut? I'm surprised; most of Snyder's movies get a Director's Cut.
MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion
- Thread starter Agent Richard07
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I'm a firm believer in Superman being the idealistic apple pie ideal, and that's why I also believe the killing Zod story is an important part of his character. He was placed in an impossible situation and forced to take a life(s) and that action haunted him for a long time, even causing him to develop a split personality and exile himself into space. It's a good arc for him to go through.
I spent this whole day watching Man of Steel. I've now seen it 3 times in a row today.
The scene killing Zod definitely comes across as a moment of desperation. Super got the upper hand for a second with his choke hold. He might not get another chance. Zod is making it absolutely clear that he will just keep on killing people.
As shown here, I really don't see what other alternative Superman had. He didn't want to, but was forced into a corner and did the only thing he could to stop Zod permanently.
As a side note, the music is growing on me, but I know what it's missing. It really should have had a slight nod in it with the original John Williams fanfare in it, and I know exactly where it would fit. I'm thinking of making my own edit and see if I can mix a decent version of my idea.
As results from this thread, the posters who dislike 'man of steel' do so due to veiled 'the movie raped my childhood' type arguments:
-they want the movie to be a traditional fairy-tale where Superman never has to face no-win situations (that almost invariably come to pass in crisis - wars, catastrophes, etc - in the real world), where he can always save the day while making sure no puppy has a scratch on him;
-they reproach Superman that he failed to be perfect, by having help from his father for example (despite his father being far more knowledgeable about the threat Earth faced);
-they dislike the Superman costume because it has no traditional external panties;
etc
Overall, unconvincing - at least if one has no deep attachment/nostalgia for vintage Superman comics, etc.
-they want the movie to be a traditional fairy-tale where Superman never has to face no-win situations (that almost invariably come to pass in crisis - wars, catastrophes, etc - in the real world), where he can always save the day while making sure no puppy has a scratch on him;
-they reproach Superman that he failed to be perfect, by having help from his father for example (despite his father being far more knowledgeable about the threat Earth faced);
-they dislike the Superman costume because it has no traditional external panties;
etc
Overall, unconvincing - at least if one has no deep attachment/nostalgia for vintage Superman comics, etc.
I think the heaviest complaints seem to be from the group with that deep attachment to the older superman stuff.
My first experience of Superman has always been the Donner movie. And I like the character a lot, but I'm not stuck on a specific version of it.
I enjoyed Superboy and Lois & Clark, both which did different enough takes on the character compared to the iconic Chris Reeve take.
And I enjoyed the movie, but I now realize that it was so dizzyingly packed with stuff that it required more than one viewing to let it suck in.
I thought it was worse than Green Lantern, but now I think it's better, and looking forward to the next one.
Right at the BEGINNING of being Superman? The guy killed someone on his very first day on the job.
Shit happens. 
Now that's damning it with faint praise....
He also saved a planet.
Wow I haven't read all the comments yet, so sorry if this is already been brought up.
But I don't really get all the fuss about Superman killing Zod in MOS, because Superman was responsible for the death of 3 Kryptonians in Superman 2.
But I don't really get all the fuss about Superman killing Zod in MOS, because Superman was responsible for the death of 3 Kryptonians in Superman 2.
Well where would the Kryptonians stay?
And why throw Zod in a pit and not bring him to jail because he no longer has super powers?
And why throw Zod in a pit and not bring him to jail because he no longer has super powers?
I had no problem at all with the fact that Clark killed Zod. I would have been annoyed if he hadn't. But Man of Steel was without hyperbole one of the worst movies I have ever seen.
I envy your fortitude. I couldn't sit through that forty year long fight scene three times in one day. I bought the DVD Thursday, and have yet to watch it.
As for the music, it was fine for Batman, but too dark for Superman (not that I didn't enjoy it, I just don't think it fits with Superman). On the other hand, I'm glad they didn't reuse the John Williams music for this movie. That was one of the things I disliked about Superman Returns. Each new version of Superman should have it's own musical identity. So, while I agree that this films music should have been brighter, it didn't need the John Williams theme.
^ I thought the score was pretty upbeat and every bit "Superman" as what we've had in the past. I don't remember what the rest of the music was like though.
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaxqxfpSzMQ[/yt]
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaxqxfpSzMQ[/yt]
Well, I just rewatched on DVD. Had to extend it across three or four sessions as I started falling asleep twice last night during the action half. I have to think that's not what the filmmakers intended....
The drone scene really does have a jarring tone contrast. It would have worked much better as a mid-credits or end-credits scene. And would it have killed them to throw us a line or two addressing the passage of time and how Metropolis got shiny and new by the last scene?
The drone scene really does have a jarring tone contrast. It would have worked much better as a mid-credits or end-credits scene. And would it have killed them to throw us a line or two addressing the passage of time and how Metropolis got shiny and new by the last scene?
Most of it was based on the same chord progressions as the main theme, but with more minor chords (hence darker), particularly in the alien ship scenes.
The Smallville scenes had a very soft piano that was lacking any real emotion. I think some of the atmospheric themes in "The Book of Eli" and "Dredd" could have worked well in the Smallville scenes.
The main Superman theme was fine, but it was arranged as background filler, and needed some fanfare to jump out of it.
I think my desire to really like this movie is clouding my judgement of it though. When I went to see it in the theatre, it just overloaded me, and I walked out of the theatre feeling like I just spent 2hr watching someone else play a video game.
Watching it at home and letting it absorb, I find I'm letting some stuff slide. I would have loved to see more Smallville/Nomad stuff in the movie, it desperately needed more.
The whole bit about Superman needing to stop the World Builder in the indian ocean was a misstep in the movie. He needed to be in Metropolis saving people from the moment Zod activated his terraforming machines.
In general, they made the Kryptonians too powerful. The army fought hard but was completely useless, and Supes was completely outgunned by too many armoured Kryptonians.
The movie felt like Independence Day but with super powerful beings along with their technology.
I think better editing would have solved half the problems with the movie, with some small script changes.
I think the reason Superman did the one in the Indian Ocean first, is because Superman could get to it faster. Also if there hadn't been that hiccup with the SD crystal not going in completely in Kal-El's shuttle. The plan would've worked a lot faster than it was shown in the film. Plus it got humanity involved defending their world. Which is nice.
I think the K's display of power were right on. Looking at the various comic adaptions of Superman in action : Superman the Animated Series, Justice League, Superman: Doomsday, Superman vs The Elite, Superman: Unbound. Superman and other K's have always displayed that level of power.
Where MOS i think failed to thread the needle adequately, is displaying super strong and invulnerable people hitting eachother endlessly and keeping that action interesting. Marvel has the same problem when you see characters like Thor, the Hulk, The Thing, Juggernaut, Colossus, She-Hulk, Hercules and various other super strong characters (Red Hulk, Abomination, Black Bolt, Sentry etc) fight one another. There is always some outside influence or tactical advantage the Marvel characters have that insures their victory. With MOS there is no advantage Supes or Zod and his followers can exploit. They are all equal under the sun.
With regards to the level of destruction you're right. However it's not uncommon for parties from both Marvel and DC to gloss over this. Thor and Hercules once had a battle in NYC over Jane Foster. Both being equal in terms of strength and invulnerability. They wrecked the city and by the end of it everyone is cheering Herc for his victory. No one paid mind to the destruction the two caused.
It's a tough needle to thread. I think Zack Snyder was faithful to the characters and their abilities but in trying to show and tell that story. People were unsettled by the level of destruction it caused. Hopefully Snyder made that intentional and addresses it in his sequels.
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