MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

[M.A.C.O.]

^ The comic series Superman Last Son did you are correct. However it was because Richard Donner was a cowriter of this story. It was essentially a relaunch of the Zod character in post Infinite Crisis Earth. Ursa was also used in the followup Superman New Kryton and War of The Supermen arcs.

Faora is the silver age name. It really is just a name change prescribed to a character that occupies the same function in every incarnation. Another name for her is Zaora. Used in the 1988 Supergirl Saga by John Byrne.

So the question is, What's in a name? I don't think general audiences care enough to discern the differences between Faora, Ursa, Zaora or Mala (from Superman The Animated Series).

 

[CorporalClegg]

Honestly, how much of the general public even knows Douglas's character's name?

 

[Dream]

Honestly, how much of the general public even knows Douglas's character's name?

The two characters are pretty much the same outside the names.

But Superman II and Terence Stamp greatly increase Zod's popularity.

 

[Dream]

Battle in Metropolis physical damage estimated at 700 billion

 

[stj]

Well, it seems that Chris Nolan was against Superman killing Zod. But he was turned around by Goyer and Snyder.
And I understand their reasoning. His aversion to killing is set right there, but we also can see that if push comes to shove, he'll do what he has to.

What sold me was the reaction of Cavill in that scene. He made it work for me, without the justification being spelled out by the filmmakers.

What is unclear to me: are the other Kryptonians alive in The Phantom Zone? I figured they would've perished without the benefit of an intact ship and whatever they were encased in originally when sentenced to the zone. I'd hate for Col. Hardy to be sentenced to an eternity in the zone, unless he and Faora hook up! You just know they had some sexual tension!!

Nolan would have been more impressive if he'd stuck to his original position. The arbitrary add on doesn't work precisely because Superman has no choice. In particular it doesn't redefine Superman as a killer. As the man said, he has no choice. There isn't anything truly meaningful about it. He feels bad about it, but Superman suffers a lot more from being the only one. Zod didn't to die for anything, except to please people who get off on the villains being killed by the heroes. I don't particularly enjoy it myself.

But since Goyer, Snyder and Nolan want to redefine Superman as a killer, that means that the people of Earth must realize that this man could be our enemy, doesn't it?

 

[BillJ]

But since Goyer, Snyder and Nolan want to redefine Superman as a killer

I have to admit, sometimes I wonder if you actually pay attention to the movies you watch or if you have a 'special edition' that plays in your head?

 

[Dream]

But since Goyer, Snyder and Nolan want to redefine Superman as a killer, that means that the people of Earth must realize that this man could be our enemy, doesn't it?

Superman's action didn't bother me. He only used deadly force as a last resort.

I saw it more as suicide by cop. At that point, Zod knew he was the only one left, all his people were either dead or trapped in Phantom Zone, and wanted to die by forcing Superman to kill him. At that point only one of them was making it out of there alive.

 

[Locutus of Bored]

But since Goyer, Snyder and Nolan want to redefine Superman as a killer, that means that the people of Earth must realize that this man could be our enemy, doesn't it?

Considering the alien invader he killed just murdered tens of thousands of innocent people, wanted to murder all seven billion people on Earth, and was about to murder a family before forcing Superman into a situation that left him no choice but to kill (and yet he was still anguished over it), no, I don't see why they would realize that could make him their enemy.

 

[Dream]

The government still isn't fully trusting Superman yet, since they are trying to spy on him. It makes sense after the whole invasion that was led by his own people, even if Superman had nothing to do with it. Superman will still need to earn everyone's trust.

I find this more realistic and interesting than how it is in the comics, with Superman treated as the completely good guy by the police and the governments.

 

[TheSeeker]

He's not really being treated that way in the New 52 version.

 

[Enterpriserules]

He's not really being treated that way in the New 52 version.

Yes in the new 52 Supes is not completely trusted at all. In fact the government has created it's own Justice League to take down the Justice League if it has too. Not a whole lot of trust there.

 

[Dream]

He's not really being treated that way in the New 52 version.

I was talking pre-52 verse. But I see MOS might be taking some inspiration from current comics.

 

[Dream]

I think this movie would have been much better if they had cut down on the action.

I loved the Krypton opening scenes, but it went on for far too long at 20 minutes. Split it in half, keep Jor-El sending his son and the dying planet scenes to start the movie, and show us the action scenes with Jor-El vs Zod for the flashback that was presented by hologram Jor-El to adult Clark when he finds the ship. We didn't need so many scenes of Jor-El riding his dragon.

For the final battle, completely eliminate the whole Superman fights giant World Engine thing. I didn't like it at all.

Make it so the two major action scenes at the end are happening at the same time with the army trying to bomb the Zod's soldiers while we also get Zod fighting Superman, cutting between the action. It wouldn't have felt like we got four major action scenes following right after each other.

 

[Dr.H]

I really love the fact that despite the fact the insane amount of collateral damage that Supes actually participates in most likely kills tons of people the surviving bystanders of the city of metropolis go like"He saved us!" when reacting to Supes. It was a moment that was pointed out by Mark Waid, and that took me out of the film with how unrealistic it was. I mean, I wasn't expecting a gritty, realistic flick(it's the story of a white alien from another planet that has superpowers.) but a little more believability wouldn't have hurt. I thought this film was all about"What if Superman existed in real life?" The film kinda short-changes that question a lot by doing that.

 

[Turd Ferguson]

A+

I saw this last night, and I immediately want to see it again. I'd never seen Henry Cavill in anything else, but thought he made a great Clark Kent/Superman. Great casting, all around. The battle scenes were epic and reminded me of the comics where Metropolis would get leveled every issue.

I thought I'd have a problem with Lois deducing Clark's identity, and apparently, according to David Goyer, Perry White may even know Clark is Superman. But, to me, this works. It makes the reporters and editors of the Daily Planet not look like incompetent morons, and it makes sense that Perry would reward Clark with a job, seeing the potential of stories that normal reporters wouldn't be able to get to and since Clark had no journalism background by not going to college.

All being said, I can't wait for Man of Steel 2, and I can't wait to see what direction they go for it!

 

[stj]

But since Goyer, Snyder and Nolan want to redefine Superman as a killer

I have to admit, sometimes I wonder if you actually pay attention to the movies you watch or if you have a 'special edition' that plays in your head?

That post was commenting on the link. Here's a quote from David Goyer: "Hopfully we've redefined Superman." Obviously you didn't understand what you saw in the movie, but here it comes from the horse's mouth. If you didn't bother to follow the link, why bother to post? As for arguing the issue of whether killing Zod successfully redefines Superman, take it up with Goyer. I explained why I don't think it does.

 

[TheSeeker]

I really love the fact that despite the fact the insane amount of collateral damage that Supes actually participates in most likely kills tons of people the surviving bystanders of the city of metropolis go like"He saved us!" when reacting to Supes. It was a moment that was pointed out by Mark Waid, and that took me out of the film with how unrealistic it was. I mean, I wasn't expecting a gritty, realistic flick(it's the story of a white alien from another planet that has superpowers.) but a little more believability wouldn't have hurt. I thought this film was all about"What if Superman existed in real life?" The film kinda short-changes that question a lot by doing that.

In the heat of battle it's kind of hard for Superman to pause and have a soliloquy bemoaning all the loss of life. It's not like comic books where we can have thought balloons either, and a voice-over of his inner monologue would have been awful. The fact is he was in a fight for his life, and for every other life on the planet. If he'd been able to do it any other way he would have. He even directed the fight into space at one point but got dragged back down to earth.

Still, an acknowledgment of all the collateral damage would have been nice after the fact. Maybe a few shots of Superman helping to rebuild the city. Not sure if that would have really worked either though.

 

[Dark Gilligan]

I can't wait for Man of Steel 2, and I can't wait to see what direction they go for it!

My prediction: Citizen Luthor rebuilds Metropolis into the shining City of Tomorrow for the good of mankind, while Evil Genius Luthor reverse-engineers the Kryptonian wreckage to fight the alien Superman and his ilk--for the good of mankind.

 

[TheSeeker]

^Sounds about right.

 

[Anwar]

It wouldn't surprise me if Luthor creates Metallo and various other villains to fight Superman to cause more damage and make him look worse while making Luthor look better.

Or heck, maybe Kenny Braverman.