Lost 6x09: "Ab Aeterno"

[Gertch]

Most of the Losties lives in the flash sideways are better than they were. So maybe evil went down with the Island?

Evil in charge wouldn't mean their lives wouldn't be better. Satan only temps you by giving you strife when he needs you to sway from God/good. When evil has you there is no need to harass you.

Of course I'm just throwing it out there as I have no idea what else the sunken Island could mean.

Christian is smokey.
Christian has been telling Jack & Locke things that will either send them down the wrong path or get them off the Island. Remember, Christian tells Locke to turn the wheel. Turning the wheel throws you off the Island and moves it to a new place so you can't find it again. Christian/Smokey wanted Locke gone.

But that would mean Smokey knew Locke would be killed and could take his form (yeah I don't know if that's a requirement but seems to be) when everyone came back. I think perhaps Jacob (probably be a white smokey) is Christian and wanted Locke off so MIB couldn't use him. Unfortunetly the Losties brought his body back.

All I know is we did a lot of talking at work and we're no closer to figuring it all out yet.

 

[exodus]

Most of the Losties lives in the flash sideways are better than they were. So maybe evil went down with the Island?

Evil in charge wouldn't mean their lives wouldn't be better. Satan only temps you by giving you strife when he needs you to sway from God/good. When evil has you there is no need to harass you.

Of course I'm just throwing it out there as I have no idea what else the sunken Island could mean.

Christian is smokey.
Christian has been telling Jack & Locke things that will either send them down the wrong path or get them off the Island. Remember, Christian tells Locke to turn the wheel. Turning the wheel throws you off the Island and moves it to a new place so you can't find it again. Christian/Smokey wanted Locke gone.

But that would mean Smokey knew Locke would be killed and could take his form (yeah I don't know if that's a requirement but seems to be) when everyone came back. I think perhaps Jacob (probably be a white smokey) is Christian and wanted Locke off so MIB couldn't use him. Unfortunetly the Losties brought his body back.

All I know is we did a lot of talking at work and we're no closer to figuring it all out yet.

Wasn't locke told the only way to return to the Island was to die?

 

[exodus]

Here's another one:

James
John
Jack

Are all originated from the name Jacob.

Does anyone know if there's an English translation for the name "Jin"?

No, they aren't.

James is derived from Jacob (via French, Late Latin and New Testament Greek), which is from the Hebrew יעקב or Y'akov.
John is derived from the Hebrew יוחנן or Yochanan (ch as in Bach).
Jack is derived from German and French versions of the name John and is often used as a nickname for those named "John." It is sometimes used as a nickname for those named "Jakob" but far less frequently.

Wait, how is it "no" if you just said James = Jacob
and Jack is derived from John and is a nickname for Jacob?
Isn't that tracing them back to one name?

 

[RobertScorpio]

I thought this was a great episode...Im not going to get too anal about it, only to say, it was awesome...

Rob

 

[Gertch]

Wasn't locke told the only way to return to the Island was to die?

Yeah by NotLocke of the future via Richard.

Now I'm cross-eyed.

 

[Demonland]

What did MIB mean when he told Richard that Jacob (who MIB called the devil) "stole his body"?

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Wow, excellent! Started off slightly like some melodrama from the 50s starring Tyrone Power, Jr. but then it snapped right into shape with the crash of the Black Rock.

Kudos to Nestor Carbonnell. He really nailed playing Ricardus as a scared peasant vs the weary, slightly cynical modern version yet incorporated the two characters together at the end.

 

[Mr Awe]

James is derived from Jacob (via French, Late Latin and New Testament Greek), which is from the Hebrew יעקב or Y'akov.

That's why Sawyer is the big damn hero of Lost

Well, I did make the prediction earlier in this thread, but for other reasons!

Mr Awe

 

[Hunter X]

A few questions:

How does one go from the Canary Islands to the New World, and end up in the middle of the Pacific? At least with the drug plane, could try and argue that they went East, and maybe made a stop or two in Asia. A sailing ship would have more problems with that, and going from the Canary Islands (NW tip of Africa, just south of Gibraltar) to Hawaii (give or take) would be a LONG haul.

I think this could be explained by the season five episode, 316. There are certain spots where, if you cross over them at exactly the right time, you get to the Island. The Ajira flight was going from Los Angeles to Guam at night, when there was turbulence, a bright flash, then suddenly it was daytime and they were crashing on the Island.

I always figured the Nigerian plane flew over the hot spot in Tunisia, the one Ben and Locke were transported to when they turned the Donkey Wheel, and was teleported to the Island from there.

I'd guess that the slaving ship passed through one of these spots in the Atlantic Ocean and was transported to wherever the Island actually is, somewhere in the Pacific.

 

[RobertScorpio]

A few questions:

How does one go from the Canary Islands to the New World, and end up in the middle of the Pacific? At least with the drug plane, could try and argue that they went East, and maybe made a stop or two in Asia. A sailing ship would have more problems with that, and going from the Canary Islands (NW tip of Africa, just south of Gibraltar) to Hawaii (give or take) would be a LONG haul.

I think this could be explained by the season five episode, 316. There are certain spots where, if you cross over them at exactly the right time, you get to the Island. The Ajira flight was going from Los Angeles to Guam at night, when there was turbulence, a bright flash, then suddenly it was daytime and they were crashing on the Island.

I always figured the Nigerian plane flew over the hot spot in Tunisia, the one Ben and Locke were transported to when they turned the Donkey Wheel, and was teleported to the Island from there.

I'd guess that the slaving ship passed through one of these spots in the Atlantic Ocean and was transported to wherever the Island actually is, somewhere in the Pacific.

Speaking of the drug plane (with Echo's brother); doesn't the introduction of ECHO and the others from that part of the plane see, now, in hindsight, a total waste of time? Especially all the flashback episodes dedicated to them?

Rob

 

[Hunter X]

I guess that depends on why you watch Lost. Sure, it's all one big story, seemingly about the battle between good and evil, though it could get more complex...

But it is also a series of individual stories. The individual story of Ana Lucia, for example, is no more or less worth telling than the story of Charlie or Jack. It's the execution that makes it work or not, and while many would say that it didn't work, it doesn't mean it wasn't worth the attempt. That's what's nice about a TV show versus a movie. A movie ultimately only has the time for one story. A TV show may have an overall story, but it can also tell a series of short ones within the larger one. At a show's best, the short stories echo, amplify and clarify the themes of the larger one.

Another example: are Rose and Bernard necessary to the ultimate story of the battle between Jacob, the Man in Black, and the finding of the candidate to replace Jacob? Probably not. But it's fun to see their story as well, and maybe even glimpse the narrative through their perspective at some point.

Yet another example: I think we'll see Desmond again, but if they had resolved his story with that last scene with Penny in the hospital, I'd be happy. I'd be glad we got a pretty fantastic love story in the midst of the rest of this epic mess. And I mean those last two words in the best way possible. The story of Desmond and Penny has its own value, apart from the overall story of the Island.

Besides all that, the writers did intend to keep Eko on until the end. Behind the scenes drama prevented that from happening, but that's not necessarily their fault.

 

[exodus]

A few questions:

How does one go from the Canary Islands to the New World, and end up in the middle of the Pacific? At least with the drug plane, could try and argue that they went East, and maybe made a stop or two in Asia. A sailing ship would have more problems with that, and going from the Canary Islands (NW tip of Africa, just south of Gibraltar) to Hawaii (give or take) would be a LONG haul.

I think this could be explained by the season five episode, 316. There are certain spots where, if you cross over them at exactly the right time, you get to the Island. The Ajira flight was going from Los Angeles to Guam at night, when there was turbulence, a bright flash, then suddenly it was daytime and they were crashing on the Island.

I always figured the Nigerian plane flew over the hot spot in Tunisia, the one Ben and Locke were transported to when they turned the Donkey Wheel, and was teleported to the Island from there.

I'd guess that the slaving ship passed through one of these spots in the Atlantic Ocean and was transported to wherever the Island actually is, somewhere in the Pacific.

Speaking of the drug plane (with Echo's brother); doesn't the introduction of ECHO and the others from that part of the plane see, now, in hindsight, a total waste of time? Especially all the flashback episodes dedicated to them?

Rob

No, because I think Eko was important to Locke in learning the difference between miracles of faith vs. coincedence and not to be so overly prideful. I think he was also vital to Charlie in getting clean & sober. Which I think in Jacobs over all plain, helped them recognize the "evil" in themselves and put them on the path of redemption.

 

[exodus]

I read a theory recently that suggested the electromagnetic properties of the island reacted with the metals on the Black Rock and literally hoisted it out of the sea once it got close enough and pulled it ashore, through the jungle, much like the reaction we saw during the end of "The Incident, Part 2"

Nope, watch the ep. again.
It's a tidal wave.

You'll see that it's a tidal wave so high, the Black Rock hits the statue almost near it's face. A wave that intense would carry the ship that far inland.

 

[LitmusDragon]

Something I was thinking about recently, is it possible that Smokey or creatures like Smokey could have been the inspiration for much of what happens in the old testament?

He's a pillar of smoke.

He judges people.

He's vengeful.

I doubt they would drop the bomb that he is literally the God of the old testament (and in fact, there are spoilery bits out there that seem to confirm he isn't) but one wonders if Smokey-like creatures or whatever Smokey is supposed to represent might have been the inspiration for the "old gods" in our ancient myths.

In canon of course, not literally.

 

[exodus]

Something I was thinking about recently, is it possible that Smokey or creatures like Smokey could have been the inspiration for much of what happens in the old testament?

He's a pillar of smoke.

He judges people.

He's vengeful.

I doubt they would drop the bomb that he is literally the God of the old testament (and in fact, there are spoilery bits out there that seem to confirm he isn't) but one wonders if Smokey-like creatures or whatever Smokey is supposed to represent might have been the inspiration for the "old gods" in our ancient myths.

In canon of course, not literally.

Yes, because as you've seen the numbers are ingrained into society in LOST. So yes, I believe at one time these things were true that thru time became legend then became myth. For example: Why some still put coins on the eyes of the dead.

BTW: not sure if anybody has seen this but I thought it was cool.

 

[doubleohfive]

I read a theory recently that suggested the electromagnetic properties of the island reacted with the metals on the Black Rock and literally hoisted it out of the sea once it got close enough and pulled it ashore, through the jungle, much like the reaction we saw during the end of "The Incident, Part 2"

Nope, watch the ep. again.
It's a tidal wave.

You'll see that it's a tidal wave so high, the Black Rock hits the statue almost near it's face. A wave that intense would carry the ship that far inland.

I did watch the episode and obviously it was the tidal wave ... however when the time came, the shot we saw was not wide enough to determine if the Black Rock was surfing about on top of some giant tsunamic wave. Granted, it was tossed about left and right through the storm, but the shot we got portraying the crash through the Tawaret statue was presented from the deck of the ship. It could just as likely have been a tidal wave alone. It could also have been both the tidal wave and the electromagnetic properties of the island. Or, it could just be the electromagnetism. (Have we ever been given an explanation or found out if there's any connection between the electromagnetism on the island and the conflict between Jacob and the Man in Black?)

Either way, I think it's pretty presumptuous to think that's the ONLY thing that caused it to happen, given what we've seen already and come to expect from the show.

 

[Agent Richard07]

I still have a problem with a tidal wave that big hitting the island. A combination of that and the magnetic anomaly makes more sense.

 

[exodus]

I read a theory recently that suggested the electromagnetic properties of the island reacted with the metals on the Black Rock and literally hoisted it out of the sea once it got close enough and pulled it ashore, through the jungle, much like the reaction we saw during the end of "The Incident, Part 2"

Nope, watch the ep. again.
It's a tidal wave.

You'll see that it's a tidal wave so high, the Black Rock hits the statue almost near it's face. A wave that intense would carry the ship that far inland.

I did watch the episode and obviously it was the tidal wave ... however when the time came, the shot we saw was not wide enough to determine if the Black Rock was surfing about on top of some giant tsunamic wave. Granted, it was tossed about left and right through the storm, but the shot we got portraying the crash through the Tawaret statue was presented from the deck of the ship. It could just as likely have been a tidal wave alone. It could also have been both the tidal wave and the electromagnetic properties of the island. Or, it could just be the electromagnetism. (Have we ever been given an explanation or found out if there's any connection between the electromagnetism on the island and the conflict between Jacob and the Man in Black?)

Either way, I think it's pretty presumptuous to think that's the ONLY thing that caused it to happen, given what we've seen already and come to expect from the show.

..but I thought the eletromagnetic property was dormant until Dharma drilled into the pocket?

Everything we're doing is presumptious when trying to figure what the "mystery" is in this forum.
So I don't see what difference it makes what theories we have.
There really isn't any right or wrong until told differently.

 

[EliyahuQeoni]

Here's another one:

James
John
Jack

Are all originated from the name Jacob.

Does anyone know if there's an English translation for the name "Jin"?

No, they aren't.

James is derived from Jacob (via French, Late Latin and New Testament Greek), which is from the Hebrew יעקב or Y'akov.
John is derived from the Hebrew יוחנן or Yochanan (ch as in Bach).
Jack is derived from German and French versions of the name John and is often used as a nickname for those named "John." It is sometimes used as a nickname for those named "Jakob" but far less frequently.

Wait, how is it "no" if you just said James = Jacob
and Jack is derived from John and is a nickname for Jacob?
Isn't that tracing them back to one name?

Its "no" because they aren't all derived from the name Jacob, as you claimed above. Only James is derived from the name Jacob. John is derived from a separate Hebrew name and Jack is derived from--and is a common nickname for--John. Jack is sometimes used as a nickname for Jacob, but it is pretty rare. Jake being the much more common dimunitive form of Jacob.

The link between "Jack" and "Jacob" is pretty thin linguistically. There is a much stronger connection between "James" and "Jacob" and between "John" and "Jack"

 

[exodus]

No, they aren't.

James is derived from Jacob (via French, Late Latin and New Testament Greek), which is from the Hebrew יעקב or Y'akov.
John is derived from the Hebrew יוחנן or Yochanan (ch as in Bach).
Jack is derived from German and French versions of the name John and is often used as a nickname for those named "John." It is sometimes used as a nickname for those named "Jakob" but far less frequently.

Wait, how is it "no" if you just said James = Jacob
and Jack is derived from John and is a nickname for Jacob?
Isn't that tracing them back to one name?

Its "no" because they aren't all derived from the name Jacob, as you claimed above. Only James is derived from the name Jacob. John is derived from a separate Hebrew name and Jack is derived from--and is a common nickname for--John. Jack is sometimes used as a nickname for Jacob, but it is pretty rare. Jake being the much more common dimunitive form of Jacob.

The link between "Jack" and "Jacob" is pretty thin linguistically. There is a much stronger connection between "James" and "Jacob" and between "John" and "Jack"

Ok, because I looked it up in a book of name origin and that's what it said. I guess the book must be wrong then.