Let's cut bits off of babies, yes?

[RJDiogenes]

This discussion has happened here before. Echoing roughly what I said then: It happens in the US because it's the norm. Norm being synonymous with tradition.

I'm wondering what are the psychological effects of this operation are...

Do you strongly associate it with being an American male?

If so, then might it subconsciously strengthen your national identity?. ie, it helps you to feel American?

If so, might it strengthen feelings of patriotism?

Well, there's no possible way that circumcision could be relevant to feelings of patriotism. If the question is about nationalism (as Robert suggests), then I'd guess not; the people who indulge in nationalism are more likely to see it as Jewish or Muslim. Of course, that's just a guess at this point; I'm still absorbing the idea that it's still so common.

I do admit, though, that I wish I had an American flag made out of my foreskin.

 

[Davros]

You could run a seminar on how to miss the point based purely off this thread.

She wasn't comparing the two as being equivalent, she was just saying that you can't miss something you were never aware of having, which is why circumsized men are not prone to questioning their lack of a foreskin.

But blind people are still aware that sighted people can see. I may not have a foreskin any more but fore the life of me I cannot think of how having one would make my life any better.

It's an explanation of why people harbour certain attitudes, not an attack on your manhood.

I never viewed it as any form of attack on me or my manhood, just a frighteningly bad analogy.

 

[thestrangequark]

I hate every time this discussion comes up because I get incredibly curious as to what an uncircumcised penis looks like. I've never seen one, but I'm not about to go googling it either. Perhaps one day my curiosity will get the better of me.

Imagine putting a turtleneck on a baby and not rolling it down.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Since circumcision is meant to be religious, is it like a dress code? Do you not get into heaven if you've got a foreskin?

 

[Locutus of Bored]

I hate every time this discussion comes up because I get incredibly curious as to what an uncircumcised penis looks like.

A mushroom wearing a wetsuit.

 

[Sector 7]

I'm glad I'm circumcised. My dad had it done to me, not for religious reasons (we're Lutheran), but for the medical and cleanliness benefits. And he's a doctor, so he would know.

I mean, I can keep myself clean just fine, but every little bit helps. (Any of you Red Dwarf fans care to guess where the word 'smeg' came from?) This happened to me 40 years ago, so I figure it's not worth it to complain now. Besides, I can't even remember the pain, so what the hell do I care? It's not like I can't pee or fuck. My junk is completely healthy and functional, and any woman who complains about it just because I'm circumcised is quite frankly not worth my time.

Agreed.

As to the merits of the procedure itself - I've no strong opinion; as an American male born in hospital in the 1950s mine was done at a time that I do not recall, presumably shortly after birth. It's not and never has been an issue for me, go figure.

Goes for me too...but I'm also glad that it happened.

I was born in that era, too. I seem to have grown up fairly healthy and normal... according to family and friends anyway.

At the time my 25 year old was born, we discussed the issue of circumcision. His mother decided not to spend the additional $75.00 for circumcision, even though I offered to pay the fee.

[We are Christians of Jewish descent, for those who care to know such things. The circumcision is part of our covenant with God. It was instituted to set us apart from the rest of the world's people. This is part of my heritage. I have no problem with those who do not practice circumcision.]

My boy has problems with hygiene. He has a stronger than usual body odor and other such. We talked about such things at appropriate times while he was growing up. Because of the hygiene issues, he is more self-conscious and wishes I had prevailed in my effort to have him circumcised. While others' mileage may vary, this is our family's experience.

 

[Pingfah]

You could run a seminar on how to miss the point based purely off this thread.

She wasn't comparing the two as being equivalent, she was just saying that you can't miss something you were never aware of having, which is why circumsized men are not prone to questioning their lack of a foreskin.

But blind people are still aware that sighted people can see.

And people without foreskins are aware that other peopIe have them. Neither misses them though because they have no memory of having one. Not sure what your point was there really.

may not have a foreskin any more but fore the life of me I cannot think of how having one would make my life any better.

Nor I particularly, but that's not been the point I was making personally.

 

[Miss Chicken]

For those that say there is no medical benefit to circumcision:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/24/health/policy/24circumcision.html

I have previously said in this thread - if there are benefits than let men get circumcised at an age when they can give consent . Little baby boys will not be sexually active for many a year so it isn't as if there is a pressing need for them to get circumcised soon after birth.

I think that we all know where you stand on the issue. I did not say anything about when someone should have a circumcision (nor did the article).

I was bringing up that circumcision protecting men from HIV/AIDS has really nothing to do with whether little boys should be circimcised which is what this thread is about. The only health benefits that a relevant to the topic of infant circumcision are those health benefits that are of benefit to the infant which, in the case of non-therapeutic circumcision, number zero.

 

[Trekker4747]

I hate every time this discussion comes up because I get incredibly curious as to what an uncircumcised penis looks like. I've never seen one, but I'm not about to go googling it either. Perhaps one day my curiosity will get the better of me.

Do not Google it. Because it will ruin whatever Internet "innocence" you may have left.

 

[F. King Daniel]

I hate every time this discussion comes up because I get incredibly curious as to what an uncircumcised penis looks like. I've never seen one, but I'm not about to go googling it either. Perhaps one day my curiosity will get the better of me.

Do not Google it. Because it will ruin whatever Internet "innocence" you may have left.

Turn off safesearch and Google it now, Kestra. Go on, I dare ya!

 

[Alidar Jarok]

My boy has problems with hygiene. He has a stronger than usual body odor and other such. We talked about such things at appropriate times while he was growing up. Because of the hygiene issues, he is more self-conscious and wishes I had prevailed in my effort to have him circumcised. While others' mileage may vary, this is our family's experience.

If there is a health issue, talk to a doctor. Circumcision does not have to be something done when one is an infant. In fact, if he feels strongly about it, now would be a more appropriate time, because he is able to articulate his concerns.

BTW, More than you could ever want to know on this subject

 

[Gary Mitchell]

I have previously said in this thread - if there are benefits than let men get circumcised at an age when they can give consent . Little baby boys will not be sexually active for many a year so it isn't as if there is a pressing need for them to get circumcised soon after birth.

I think that we all know where you stand on the issue. I did not say anything about when someone should have a circumcision (nor did the article).

I was bringing up that circumcision protecting men from HIV/AIDS has really nothing to do with whether little boys should be circimcised which is what this thread is about. The only health benefits that a relevant to the topic of infant circumcision are those health benefits that are of benefit to the infant which, in the case of non-therapeutic circumcision, number zero.

This thread is about all kinds of things. If you look at my original post, it says "For those that say there is no medical benefit to circumcision:". It was for those people that I posted the link. No mention was made by me whether people should be circumsised or not.

 

[Miss Chicken]

Has anyone really said there is no medical benefits to circumcision? Of course there are medical benefits that is why there are such terms as therapeutic and non-therapeutic circumcisions. By definition there is no benefit to non-therapeutic circumcision.

There is considerable doubt about whether circumcision does really protect from HIV/AIDS. It seems that in the Western world the benefits are so small as to not matter. Even in third-world countries it doesn't benefit as much as wearing a condom does and in some countries where circumcision of men have been pushed as a way to protect against HIV/AIDS rates have actually increased as many men think that after being circumcised they no longer need to wear a condom.

 

[Gary Mitchell]

Has anyone really said there is no medical benefits to circumcision? Of course there are medical benefits that is why there are such terms as therapeutic and non-therapeutic circumcisions. By definition there is no benefit to non-therapeutic circumcision.

Well, here's one. I'm not looking through the rest of this mess to find any more.

Why is the USA the only advanced nation to do it if it's a matter of medical care?

It isn't. The medical justification originates from Victorian-era England, hence the much greater prevalence of circumcision amongst the English-speaking western world than, say, mainland Europe. Even today, circumcision is far less common in Quebec than the rest of Canada.

The UK itself effectively abolished the practice in large part simply by delisting it from the NHS, presumably shortly after doing the same for leech therapy.

 

[Miss Chicken]

I got the feeling that the posters were talking about the circumcision of babies, not all circumcision especially as Deranged Nasat's question

"Why is the USA the only advanced nation to do it if it's a matter of medical care?"

was a direct response to the following statement by Mr Laser Beam

Nobody *enjoys* causing pain to infants, but one cannot simply discard all medical procedures just because they hurt. The benefits of vaccinations, for example, are obvious and well documented. Yet they also hurt. But we do them anyway.

 

[Gary Mitchell]

I got the feeling that the posters were talking about the circumcision of babies, not all circumcision.

That's fine. All I did was read an article online and share it with people here.

 

[Davros]

And people without foreskins are aware that other peopIe have them. Neither misses them though because they have no memory of having one. Not sure what your point was there really.

That blind people know what sight is and how it would effect their lives, but so far nobody has been able to tell me how the experience of having a foreskin would make my life better in any way.

may not have a foreskin any more but for the life of me I cannot think of how having one would make my life any better.

Nor I particularly, but that's not been the point I was making personally.

Then why even bother to bring up an analogy about not knowing what it's like to have something you never had if having it would make no difference?

 

[F. King Daniel]

but so far nobody has been able to tell me that the experience of having a foreskin would make my life better in any way.

A slightly wider variety of sexual sensation and pleasure, thus better sex and orgasms.

 

[iguana_tonante]

I hate every time this discussion comes up because I get incredibly curious as to what an uncircumcised penis looks like.

Well, if it's for science...

I've never seen one, but I'm not about to go googling it either. Perhaps one day my curiosity will get the better of me.

You may want to try on wiki. It's tasteful and informative. Or, now that I think of it, just look at any ancient Greek or Roman statue. There's plenty of foreskin there.

 

[Deckerd]

Not if the loss of that body part has no negative result.

I work in a centre for teaching deaf and vi children. I can assure you a blind child born blind has no negative result in her own world view from being blind, nor does a child born deaf. It is the way they are and it's fine. It's the same for any child born with a disability. What they grow up with is normal. Your claim is based on the fact you know nothing else.

That you would even try to compare a circumcision with blinding a child is so absurdly ridiculous I hardly know what to say.

But oh please tell me what is this horrible harm that I suffer from because I was circumcised? What amazing powers does your foreskin have that I lack?

Whoosh! is all I can think of to say to you. I don't know if you're being deliberately obtuse in order to make us laugh or you just didn't understand anything I said.