Klingon Govt Structure Q

[Ogrebear]

Question regarding the Klingon Government:

Are the members of the High Council representatives of their Houses to ensure their views are known to the Chancellor, or are the Councillors like a Cabinet where each one has a Department of state they oversee?

In the former case does that mean the Chancellor has a seperate set of Ministers who actually make the Government work?

In the latter case, does that mean particualr Houses have extertise in certain areas? I.E. the House of F'guson is the people who seem to end up in charge of agricultre?

What sort of Cabinet Departments would a Klingon Government have anyway?

 

[evilchumlee]

The real answer: We don't know.

The FUN / speculation answer:

Klingons are pretty heavily feudalistic. The Klingon "government" is probably fairly weak overall, in regards to an overarching united Klingon people.

Rather, MOST of the power lies within the Great Houses, who directly control and administer their territory. The Leader of the Great House is essentially absolute ruler over his domain.

The High Council is made up of Leaders of the Great Houses, or their representatives. They exist for higher matters beyond the day-to-day running of their individual domains, things that have consequences across the Empire. The Chancellor is at the top of the feudal chain and deals with matters concerning the entire Empire.

I don't think the Klingon Defense Force is highly organized on a Federal/Empire level. Great House forces are levied by the Chancellor when necessary.

While certain Houses may just be particularly known for, or suited to, certain things I don't think it's necessarily their assigned job. DSC tells us House Mokai is known for intelligence and subterfuge, but I don't believe that means that House Mokai is like, the Klingon CIA. It's just that House Mokai has a strong tradition of that.

Everyone answers to their immediate superior. Random Warrior will answer to their Commander, the Commander answers to the Captain, the Captain answers to someone in the Great House court, they answer to the Leader of the House, the Leader of the House answers to the Chancellor. The Chancellor, presumably, answers to Kahless (a stand in for God, not actual-clone Kahless).

 

[Ogrebear]

So the High Council are House representatives, thus there will be Klingons 'Ministers' who deal with the 'government' stuff that answer direct to the Chancellor? Like the Commander of the KDF? Or the Academy? Or Intelligence?

 

[Finn]

Depends on the plot

But I'm guessing they are just a bunch of powerful noblesmen who makes up the Warrior Caste leadership. I don't think there's an Academy like Starfleet Academy....

 

[fireproof78]

Any training is probably handled at the House level initially, then the unit commander.

 

[evilchumlee]

So the High Council are House representatives, thus there will be Klingons 'Ministers' who deal with the 'government' stuff that answer direct to the Chancellor? Like the Commander of the KDF? Or the Academy? Or Intelligence?

No.

"Government" stuff is mostly handled by the Great Houses directly. Think of each Great House as a sovereign, independent nation in and of itself.

The High Council is just a way for those nations to meet and discuss things that affect them all, and the Chancellor wields authority over them when it comes to matters larger than a single House.

Most everything would be up the Houses, but there is likely at least some Imperial infrastructure for things like intelligence and some kind of organization for the KDF.

The commander of the KDF is likely a more ad hoc position, occupied by whoever can command the most respect from the High Council and probably only exists when necessary.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Depends on the plot

But I'm guessing they are just a bunch of powerful noblesmen who makes up the Warrior Caste leadership. I don't think there's an Academy like Starfleet Academy....

Wait, wasn't there a Klingon Academy videogame in the 90's? They've gotta have a formal training institution. I need to rewatch Lower Decks and see what the LD Klingons may have said about it.

 

[Ogrebear]

Wait, wasn't there a Klingon Academy videogame in the 90's? They've gotta have a formal training institution. I need to rewatch Lower Decks and see what the LD Klingons may have said about it.

As far as I know there is a formal KDF training facility, therefore a command structure who reports to someone.

Ditto Intelligence.

I do not buy each House as sovereign entity, that really does not work in my head; an Empire needs more central government than that imho.

 

[evilchumlee]

I do not buy each House as sovereign entity, that really does not work in my head; an Empire needs more central government than that imho.

I think the best possible real world comparison for the organization of the Klingon Empire might be the Holy Roman Empire.

There is some sort of central Imperial governance, but by and large most ruling is done by local lords and what not. I think the KDF is a true parallel to the Holy Roman Empire Army... not actually a permanent fixture, rather more of a framework existing to organize and coordinate mustered forces from the Houses.

I'm sure there are some formal training facilities, intelligence, etc. that exist under the direct authority of the Council/Chancellor, but given the feudalistic nature of the Klingons... the forces would largely be raised by the Houses themselves.

I would theorize that since it's been established that Qo'nos is neutral ground, that the High Council / Chancellor essentially hold the homeworld directly, and that's where any Empire-wide institutions would be based from. Under control of no Great House directly, but the Chancellor who acts as like, to borrow a human term, the Duke of Qo'nos or some such.

 

[Shawnster]

Well, how did government work in feudal Japan? What was government like in medieval Europe?

If the Klingon government is feudal, would it be similar to historical feudal societies?

 

[evilchumlee]

Well, how did government work in feudal Japan? What was government like in medieval Europe?

If the Klingon government is feudal, would it be similar to historical feudal societies?

This.

But also, take into account it's not going to be totally bolt-on. We are dealing with a spacefaring race with an interstellar Empire, so things will be... different. But definitely those things should offer a good guideline as to how the Klingons might operate.

Actually probably specifically Shogunate Japan would be the best comparison.

From Wikipedia
"Each shogunate was dynamic, not static. Power was constantly shifting and authority was often ambiguous. The study of the ebbs and flows in this complex history continues to occupy the attention of scholars. Each shogunate encountered competition. Sources of competition included the Emperor and the court aristocracy, the remnants of the imperial governmental systems, the daimyōs, the shōen system, the great temples and shrines, the sōhei, the shugo and jitō, the jizamurai and early modern daimyō. Each shogunate reflected the necessity of new ways of balancing the changing requirements of central and regional authorities."

That sure sounds like Klingons.

The Shogun... Chancellor... holds whatever power he can gather through strength and respect, and can potentially be replaced at any time by a stronger leader.

There hadn't been an Emperor in centuries, so it seems like the Klingons are somewhat holding together their Empire with the glue of a Shogun-type situation with the Great Houses.

 

[publiusr]

Martok might not have been the only working-class Klingon come to power…the characters in THE KREMLIN LETTER and some of what went on in the Supreme Soviet is probably familiar.

 

[evilchumlee]

Martok might not have been the only working-class Klingon come to power…the characters in THE KREMLIN LETTER and some of what went on in the Supreme Soviet is probably familiar.

I certainly don't think it's outlandish. Above all, they value strength. An exceptionally strong individual could, with some amount of luck, could basically challenge his way up the ranks. The opportunity for challenge would have to present itself, can't just go around killing everyone, but under the right circumstances its certainly possible.

There also appears to be fairly regular civil wars, which can upend everything. Old Great Houses may fall entirely and be replaced with new, upstart revolutionary Houses.

Martok's story was one of being in the right place at the right time. What i'm more interested in is the gap in Martok's story... he gets his battlefield officer commission in 2350, and by the 2370's he's the Leader of a Great House, which I would presume elevates on to Noble status. I'm curious how that happened, although even if the real world it was not absolutely unheard for a common born to be granted nobility, but rare. I suppose that Martok gained enough "honor" to be granted nobility. Thinking about it, given how Klingons tend to be, it may not even absolutely have to be that Martok was "granted" a noble title by anyone... it's entirely possible that in Klingon society, declaring yourself a noble could be enough... as long as you can stand before any would-be challengers. If Martok decided, "I am noble now, leader of the House of Martok, who stands to challenge me?" and the High Council didn't present any challenge... there it is. It's done. There's precedent in how the Chancellorship seems to work... it seems like most anyone COULD conceivably challenge the Chancellor, but it's probably a very bad idea most of the time. Klingon honor would demand the Chancellor answer the challenge, but it doesn't say anything about someone else joining the fight as well... we saw that Gowron, he certainly didn't mind.

(I always like to point out that we tend to forget and it's rarely directly addressed, that Worf is a high born, noble Klingon...)

 

[Sci]

We have never seen Klingon High Councillors serve in any sort of Cabinet, but we do know that at least one Chancellor (Gorkon) had a Chief of Staff in General Chang, implying the existence of some sort of body of advisors who directly serve the Chancellor.

Given that we've only ever seen the High Council passing laws and declaring wars and such, I think the High Council is a legislature, not a cabinet. I also get the impression that each Great House has a set of lesser Houses that serve it -- akin to the "Bannermen" that serve the Great Houses of Westeros in Game of Thrones.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

Chief of Staff is sometimes used as the senior military aide to a flag or general officer, sometimes even used for their second-in-command which would fit with occasional references to a "Starfleet Chief-of-Staff" and indeed Chang's military rank rather than civilian title.

 

[fireproof78]

I also get the impression that each Great House has a set of lesser Houses that serve it -- akin to the "Bannermen" that serve the Great Houses of Westeros in Game of Thrones.

Or Houses Minor in the Dune universe.

 

[Sci]

Chief of Staff is sometimes used as the senior military aide to a flag or general officer, sometimes even used for their second-in-command which would fit with occasional references to a "Starfleet Chief-of-Staff" and indeed Chang's military rank rather than civilian title.

Ah, good point. Gorkon does refer to Chang as "my chief of staff," but it's entirely possible he means that Chang is the head of the Klingon Defense Force rather than that Chang is his senior adviser.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

The two points aren't mutually exclusive, but Chang could easily be a/the senior advisor by virtue of being the head of the Defence Force rather than it being a separate thing (as he's clearly a senior military official)